Ludicrous situation or is it me?

[otherclive]

My thoughts entirely but I can assure you that the XC70 space saver is 2 inch less on diameter (above 1 inch was radius) than the standard 17 inch alloy. It's storage well is a precise fit and a full size standard 17 wheel with OEM tyres will not fit into the well. So even if you use the space saver you're stuck with the punctured full size spare and nowher to stow it. The Haldex website recognises this and says the size difference is accommodated in the design of the Haldex unit just as tyres with differing pressures and tread depths are. Visit the Volvo Owners Club forum where there are numerous posts on this but which Volvo have confirmed is satisfactory when used as in the guidance. That's one reason why my first line of attack would be to use the Continental sealant kit as it isn't limited to 50 miles as is the space saver.

 

[hortimech]

After finding out what a Haldex unit is, I do not think you would damage it. It is an electronically controlled hydraulic clutch that connnects the rear axle when required or in other words, an on demand four wheel drive system that if the front wheels start to spin, the rear wheel drive kicks in. I would be more concerned about the axle shafts and gears in the diff, as I said, if the wheels are a different size, in a straight line, the wheels would turn at different speeds.

 

[WatsonJohnG]

Sorry for the delay in replying but we were away last week
I bought a second hand alloy off a Columbia XT for about £140 and it fitted in the spare wheel well never to be needed in 2 years!
I now have the Ford Kuga and that had a mini spare now replaced with a full size one off ebay but in this case the boot floor needed raising to accomodate it

John

john
i looked at doing the same for the xc70 but was thwarted by the fact that the space saver is 1 inch less on diameter than a full size wheel so a full size spare wheel not sit in the well. Did look at dropping the pressure on a full size spare to squeeze it into the well but it risked being so low it would have come off the rim even if it could have been squeezed in, which is doubtful. Perhaps one answer is for caravan payloads to increase to take the cars full size spare!!!!!

That raises the question of what to do with the punctured wheel after fitting the spacesaver

 

[WatsonJohnG]

The space saver on many cars is a lot smaller in diameter and a lot thinner
They are only intended to get you to a tyre dealer
One reason given for fitting space savers is to reduce weight and thus improve fuel consumption and etc etc
The space saver on the Kuga is a lot smaller and although the boot trim will allow the full size wheel to fit in it is about 4 in higher
I used building wall cavity polystyrene to raise the existing polystyrene boot floor

https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=space+saver+spare+wheels+pic&hl=en&prmd=imvns&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ei=p0mGUL-gGOT80QX18YGwBA&sqi=2&ved=0CCcQsAQ&biw=1366&bih=635

 

[otherclive]

Although the overall difference in circumference between the space saver and OEM road wheel is 8% (using MITA site) in the real world this is liklley to be reduced to below 8%. New tyres have around 8.5mm tread depth and if one were to run tyres down to 3mm the OEM tyre circumference reduces. Also XC70s have a tyre pressure of 38psi in the ECO setting which can be used when the car is fully loaded or lightly loaded with just driver and low fuel. Clearly this would affect road wheel actual rolling diameter. For normal loads up to three ocupants 33psi is the tyre pressure assuming you dont wish to run at ECO pressures. Then there are the high speed pressures for speeds in excess of 100mph which are 35psi unless fully loaded. So the an XC70 could be lightly loaded at 38psi and new tyres which gives the max difference on circumference. But then there are the deformation characteristics of tyres with load and pressure. The OEM tyres are quite soft sidewall and the space saver is very stiff. At space saver speeds (50mph or less) the road tyres will be cooler than they may otherwise be if travelling normally on faster roads with higher cornering speeds and braking. So road tyre pressures will probably be less than normal. So the 8% difference in circumferenec between the OEM tyres and sapce saver really only relates to compparing two tyres off the car and with cool pressures, most other factors move towards reducing the circumferential difference.
Looking at the effcet on the cars differential is more difficult without knowing the design philosophy used. But assume a diff should last the life of the car even assuming 100,000 miles life up to 50 miles on a space saver represents just 0.05% of the diffs expected life. So four punctures in 100000 miles would affect 0.2% of the diffs expected life. With the car/outfit being driven at no more than 50mph for up to 50 miles the effect on the diff is unlikley to be significant, although only the overall system designer ( the car maker) can vouch for this.

Dont get me wrong I'm not a fan of space saver and I think owners should still have an option avaiable to fita OEM wheel in a proper stowage but I can see how legslative restrictions may impact this by marginally making the car heavier and putting it into a higher tax band. At one time FL2 was 0.1% just under the 225 level. But unfortunately caravanners and safety conscious motorists are a minority.

 

[BernardinTring]

Well, what can I say? I'm very, very grateful for the various contributions that have been made. Some leave the mind boggling at just what generally is going on with vehicles which have a dominant towing capability. I'm amazed at the 'otherclive' situation of a tight fit in the boot for the space saver and the too small for the normal size, so too with John Watson and the building foam solution! It seems to make my case of an actual fit being possible pail into insignifigance with the only questions remaining being, parting with nigh on £600 basically for peace of mind. No joy by the way on e-bay or breakers yards
It really is a strange situation too, that in the world of 'optional extras' that these are usually additions pieces of equipment or blinge to the car that do not generate a 'spare part' being left over at the end of the exercise as in the case of this temporary/space save verses full size wheel. Seems more clutter in the garage or again to try and sell it with more hassle.
Perhaps I would not feel quite so 'shafted' if either the Dealer or Nissan would be prepard to offer a credit or allowance against the Alloy. Even contemplated contacting Mr Nissan in Japan; anyone tried getting an e-mail address for Nissan Japan? No and I do'not speak the language and will not be attempting to make phone contact, might well try the snail mail approach, recorded delivery of course!!!!
Finally why isi t that the two main Clubs and the various owners clubs, both Caravans and Cars are not jumping up and down a bit more drawing attention to the anomoly for vehicles which tow? Will be much more vigilant in the future and drop any brand or dealer loyalty that I have had in the past; silly boy for thinking this mattered.
Again many, many thanks for the variety and number of contributions made.
Bernard

 

[WatsonJohnG]

Is this any good
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/0679-X1-Single-Refurbished-Nissan-X-Trail-17-Alloy-Wheel-/321002302545?pt=UK_CarParts_Acc_Wheels_tyres_Trims_Car_Rims_ET&hash=item4abd3a6c51

 

[BernardinTring]

John
Many thanks for the link. I'm not technical but the advert is 17inch the wheels on the Platinum X-Trail are described as 18inch.
Totally unsure as to compatability/suitability. Therefore very hesitant but many thanks. for taking time and trouble.
Bernard

 

[ValA.]

http://www.gumtree.com/p/cars-vans-motorbikes/nissan-x-trail-18-inch-alloy-wheels-tyres/111774161 - £250 for four! You could buy them all and sell on the 'spare' three to other xtrail users in the same position! And still save yourself more than £350.00!
Although not local to you, you may find something at http://www.motorhog.co.uk/ - they have a warehouse full of spare wheels and we've recommended them to loads of people, who have always found what they're searching for.

 

[Surfer]

That raises the question of what to do with the punctured wheel after fitting the spacesaver

A very valid point especially if you have a boot ful of suitcases which just fit. My concern would be travelling late at night on for instance at Xmas and having a blow out and only having a can of gunk. What if you are in an area with poor mobile reception?

 

[otherclive]

If needs must I'm sure you'd find a spot for it. On Aunt Berthas lap if all else fails. LOL

 

[Raywood]

Having bought a car with no spare wheel and only the stupid blow up kit which is no use if the tyre is damaged I am buying a second hand wheel for the spare and a cheap tyre. This should do the trick if I have a problem and get me somewhere I can get a new tyre at a reasonable price. If you need a new tyre out on the road I suspect you will have to pay through the nose.

 

[PR]

I wanted a proper Alloy spare for the Freelander 2. Looked on e-Bay and found 4 which I picked up for eighty pounds. They had better tyres on than my existing ones. I have kept two as proper spares, as we are doing a long trip next year.
Now I will be selling two alloys and one steel wheel suitable for F2 or Evoque.

 

[BernardinTring]

Just over six weeks ago I outlined the ludicrous situation of Nissan supplying a 'tow-car' an X-Trail, with a temporary spare wheel unsuitable for towing and it brought various tales of woe on the principle of 'spare tyres'.
I'm now pleased to be able to say that persistence directly with the 'boses' at Nissan Maple Cross, Rickmansworth have paid off, all be it at a cost of £258.80p. But I do now have peace of mind.
I paid the princely sum of £588 for a full size alloy spare which fortunately fitted the boot well. After an exchange of correspondence, Nissan have refunded the cost of the supplied 'temporary tyre' to the tune of £334.20; net cost to me of the alloy being the £258.80.
Really daft thing about this is that a full size 'proper' tyre and steel rim was quoted at £335. Therefore to my thinking for an additional eighty pence a full size steel rim could always be supplied with a vehicle designed for towing.
Bizarre approach by Nissan on the temporary tyre in view of cost differences I would have thought.
I'm still waiting for the Caravan Club response to questions on their support to Nissan on the principle of the temporary spare.
Overall I'm pleased with the result.
Bernard