Nose weight gauge any accurate ones ?

[ProfJohnL]

Initially we had the Reich one which was very accurate to within 2kg however one day I forgot to apply the hand brake and the caravan moved snapping off the head of the scale.
We now have a Milenco gauge which reads up to 400kg and is well within +/- range of 5kg. Why would anyone want to be pedantic about a nose weight that gives the exact nose weight? After all when travelling the nose weight can probably vary between minus zero and 200kg depending on the road surface. Manyl weigh bridges are only accurate to within 20kg?

I sincerely believe that if a jobs worth doing it should be done properly. I detest companies for selling products at premium prices that don't do a proper job, and yet they make claims that imply their product is the bees knees. by using references to standards and calibration in a way that will bamboozle the majority of the general public into thinking it must be better than the rest. It may be better than the rest; but not by much.

The measurement of static weight or loads is something that is very well understood and how to do it with a high degree of accuracy and reliability. A device for measuring 150kg, should be easily produced that is better than +/-1kg accuracy, and for the same money they charge for a simple spring device. I've seen hand held luggage scales with a digital readout that offer 0.5Kg resolution with a 1% accuracy over a 0 to 100kg costing £5.99.

 

[Buckman]

Initially we had the Reich one which was very accurate to within 2kg however one day I forgot to apply the hand brake and the caravan moved snapping off the head of the scale.
We now have a Milenco gauge which reads up to 400kg and is well within +/- range of 5kg. Why would anyone want to be pedantic about a nose weight that gives the exact nose weight? After all when travelling the nose weight can probably vary between minus zero and 200kg depending on the road surface. Manyl weigh bridges are only accurate to within 20kg?

I sincerely believe that if a jobs worth doing it should be done properly. I detest companies for selling products at premium prices that don't do a proper job, and yet they make claims that imply their product is the bees knees. by using references to standards and calibration in a way that will bamboozle the majority of the general public into thinking it must be better than the rest. It may be better than the rest; but not by much.

The measurement of static weight or loads is something that is very well understood and how to do it with a high degree of accuracy and reliability. A device for measuring 150kg, should be easily produced that is better than +/-1kg accuracy, and for the same money they charge for a simple spring device. I've seen hand held luggage scales with a digital readout that offer 0.5Kg resolution with a 1% accuracy over a 0 to 100kg costing £5.99.

Not sure why you are so obsessed with a nose weight gauge being 100% absolutely spot on. I am happy with a tolerance of up to 5kg. I am not prepared to spend hundreds of pounds on a nose weight gauge that is 100% correct as I do not see the point. After all any bathroom scale with a piece of wood is not more accurate than the Milenco gauge. BTW how do you know that the Milenco is not perfect at 100%? Have you conducted experiments as the results would be interesting for all of us to see. :cheer:

 

[ProfJohnL]

Hello Hickman,

I have never suggested that a weight measuring device should be 100% accurate. Such accuracy is impossible. What I have suggested is they should have a reasonable degree of accuracy of say +/- 1% and in practice such accuracies are achieved by many companies who are expert in weight measurement processes.

But the other key point is none of the retail spring gauges can be adjusted for length or give instructions for users to adust gauges to ensure the hitch is supported at ride height.

It seems incideous for a company to produce a device which they claim is "calibrated" but has such a wide 10% margin of error. 10% is more like an estimate, not a quote.

You are more than likely to get as good if not better accuracy with bathroom scales and have much finer and readable graduations for a fraction of the cost.

Is such a precision necessary for noseload, probably not, but why pay a premium price for a bit of one job kit, when there are equally good or better alternatives out there, and you get the peace of mind that you know with greater certainty what your noseload is!

 

[Buckman]

Deleted!

 

[Buckman]

Hello Hickman,

I have never suggested that a weight measuring device should be 100% accurate. Such accuracy is impossible. What I have suggested is they should have a reasonable degree of accuracy of say +/- 1% and in practice such accuracies are achieved by many companies who are expert in weight measurement processes.

But the other key point is none of the retail spring gauges can be adjusted for length or give instructions for users to adust gauges to ensure the hitch is supported at ride height.

It seems incideous for a company to produce a device which they claim is "calibrated" but has such a wide 10% margin of error. 10% is more like an estimate, not a quote.

You are more than likely to get as good if not better accuracy with bathroom scales and have much finer and readable graduations for a fraction of the cost.

Is such a precision necessary for noseload, probably not, but why pay a premium price for a bit of one job kit, when there are equally good or better alternatives out there, and you get the peace of mind that you know with greater certainty what your noseload is!

Who is the Hickman to whom you are referring as no one registered on here by that name? You state that the Milenco nose weight gauge is inaccurate by up to 10% however you do not provide proof of how you came to thsi conclusion. Do you own a Milenco nose weight gauge and have to done various approved independent tests on it?
I think we would all appreciated seeing the proof and results of your tests and may PC magazine with your kind permission can post these results for all to see. BTW have you contacted Milenco with your findings and ask them why their nose weight gauge is so inaccurate when it is supposed to be calibrated?
I look forward to your expert review and reports. Many thanks.

 

[Dustydog]

Deleted!

Hickman / Buckman?
Is this a 20% error variation
Parksy cogently set out the sensible nose load methods that most of us use. The good thing on this Forum is that we all know nose load does form one of many factors required for a safe tow. In practice as I have proven many times the nose load readings take at hitched level , plus one inch up and one down still gives the same reading! That is using the Reich and the bathroom scales

 

[Buckman]

Deleted!

Hickman / Buckman?
Is this a 20% error variation
Parksy cogently set out the sensible nose load methods that most of us use. The good thing on this Forum is that we all know nose load does form one of many factors required for a safe tow. In practice as I have proven many times the nose load readings take at hitched level , plus one inch up and one down still gives the same reading! That is using the Reich and the bathroom scales

I agree so not sure why the other gentleman is making so much fuss about it being close to 100% accurate? Love your variation joke>! LOL! :lol:

 

[Parksy]

Not wishing to inflame what has again become a hot topic, most of us accept that there are different methods of measuring caravan noseweight.
Nobody could ever achieve a static noseweight measurement taken at the exact ride height of the towing hitch every time without considerable difficulty and inconvenience because the ride height can change with the addition or subtraction of fuel, passengers, kit etc.
This is true whether using bathroom scales or a noseweight gauge
Any weight measuring device including bathroom scales to be considered to be highly accurate would need re-calibration after a set number of uses, and even the electronic luggage scales mentioned earlier would depend on the charge state of its battery which as we all know can change due to ambient temperature, damp etc. This is also true of bathroom scales which as far as I'm aware contain no instructions whatsoever with regard to the measurement of caravan noseweight.
I'm not sure what the instructions for using the Milenco gauge say about the hitch height at measurement, my instructions went missing a long time ago, so I don't know if hitch height is mentioned.
If anyone has a set of instructions for a Milenco noseweight gauge it would be helpful if they could post the relevant details on this thread.

 

[Buckman]

Parksy I think the instructions are on the box. When the Milenco is "resting" the height is approximately the same as the towball height. As you lift the jockey wheel the downward pressure increases on the Milenco gauge and when the the jockey wheel is off the ground, you take a reading. Our Milenco which can read up to 400kg is marked in 25kg graduations.

 

[Parksy]

The height of my vehicle towball is toward the higher end allowable so the gauge when I use it has to stand on a piece of wood that I normally use under the corner steady. Towing a caravan with your family car involves a series of rules and of compromises.
For me the hard and fast rules concern speed limits, overall weight and good maintenance procedures, especially with tyres and brakes. The noseweight limit as far as I'm concerned is a compromise using the equipment that is currently available, it's never guaranteed to be entirely accurate.

 

[ProfJohnL]

Deleted!

Hickman / Buckman?
Is this a 20% error variation
Parksy cogently set out the sensible nose load methods that most of us use. The good thing on this Forum is that we all know nose load does form one of many factors required for a safe tow. In practice as I have proven many times the nose load readings take at hitched level , plus one inch up and one down still gives the same reading! That is using the Reich and the bathroom scales

I agree so not sure why the other gentleman is making so much fuss about it being close to 100% accurate? Love your variation joke>! LOL! :lol:

I'm sorry I got your name wrong, it was an auto correction that I hadn't noticed.

As the other gentleman, I have not and will not entertain owning or using a bespoke spring based nose load gauge that cannot be adjusted to match the ride height of the tow ball. As for the figues I used, they come from the British Standard manufacturer claims their product complies with.

 

[otherclive]

There are bathroom scales that have accuracy better than +-5kg. We have some and use them for weighing checked in airline luggage. Made by Salter.

 

[Dustydog]

There are bathroom scales that have accuracy better than +-5kg. We have some and use them for weighing checked in airline luggage. Made by Salter.

Oh dear Clive.
As Hutch and I know Fat Club’s scales are accurate to 0.25 of a pound. Yours are 11 lbs out! Good new for me

 

[Buckman]

Deleted!

Hickman / Buckman?
Is this a 20% error variation
Parksy cogently set out the sensible nose load methods that most of us use. The good thing on this Forum is that we all know nose load does form one of many factors required for a safe tow. In practice as I have proven many times the nose load readings take at hitched level , plus one inch up and one down still gives the same reading! That is using the Reich and the bathroom scales

I agree so not sure why the other gentleman is making so much fuss about it being close to 100% accurate? Love your variation joke>! LOL! :lol:

I'm sorry I got your name wrong, it was an auto correction that I hadn't noticed.

As the other gentleman, I have not and will not entertain owning or using a bespoke spring based nose load gauge that cannot be adjusted to match the ride height of the tow ball. As for the figues I used, they come from the British Standard manufacturer claims their product complies with.

No problem with name as we all do it. :cheer: Not even sure why you are even commenting when by your own admission if you have never used a bespoke nose weight gauge?

 

[camel]

Why some people think that the Milenco nose weight gauge is just a couple of bits of tube with a spring shoved in side is beyond me and could be used for a Bullworker, I. think thst Milenco have some very good design engineers and I think it is fit for purpose and I think itd about time certain people stopped to rubbish this excellent bit of kit

 

[Parksy]

Hi nose weight was something that I didn’t really know about or should I say know was as important as it is till recently.
I have seen the nose weight gauges but they come with mixed reviews. I only have a set of glass digital bathroom scales so won’t be using them so will be I. The market for a Guate if there is a decent one or should I opt for some cheap bathroom scales and a bit 2x1?
Cheers

After much regurgitation of a well debated topic (for which I share equal guilt) to get back to the original question I'd suggest that the apparatus that you choose is not as important as the way that you use it.
As stated earlier check the noseweight on level ground as close to the settled hitch height as possible.
Nobody would ever be able to guarantee total accuracy but a significant over or under nose loading will show and can easily be rectified by moving payload items.

 

[Dazzzzbo]

Hi all.

Thanks very much for the info.
I think I will get the Reich scales as I have to buy either a set of bathroom ones or a proper one.

Many thanks

 

[Buckman]

Hi all.

Thanks very much for the info.
I think I will get the Reich scales as I have to buy either a set of bathroom ones or a proper one.

Many thanks

We had the Reich towball unit however one day while checking I forgot to apply the handbrake as the caravan moved slightly snapping the head off the unit! Be careful with it.

 

[Dazzzzbo]

Hi all.

Thanks very much for the info.
I think I will get the Reich scales as I have to buy either a set of bathroom ones or a proper one.

Many thanks

We had the Reich towball unit however one day while checking I forgot to apply the handbrake as the caravan moved slightly snapping the head off the unit! Be careful with it.

I’ll try lol but sounds like something I would do

 

[Hutch]

When I fill our caravan for a trip away, and this is not always, as over the years you gain experience, about where you stow stuff. , If have a half a gas bottle, I may fit another full one, ok another 10kg. Nose weight ! The boss fills the fridge, just forward of the axle, maybe 1/2 a kilo on the nose weight, bedding just aft of the axle , minus a kilo on the nose weight. I never check the nose weight on the way home as we might only be 5 kgs light3r because of gas used. , fridge empty, above the axle. . Nothing changes above 1.5 meters from the axle.
In the long run. A few inches of height + or - on the hitch will not give more than 5 kgs change, unless you have about a hundred kilos at the very top of the caravan above the axle. . On a very short Caravan. .

Safe touring to all then. Watch your nose weights.

Edit, caravan all loaded up apart from a couple of items, ready for away tomorrow, and I checked the nose weight with bathroom scales, 80 kgs, so thats fine for me, nothing heavy behind, the axle. So if I use maybe the half bottle of gas in one bottle, i will transfer the toilet chemicals and levelling blocks to the front locker. To keep the nose weight about the 80 kgs.

 

[Dazzzzbo]

This is getting quite technical lol considering it wasn’t something I really was concerned about. I done 8hrs b+e training and you don’t learn anything regarding nose weight or any other weights on the vehicles.
You would think that there would be a couple of questions on the test.

 

[Dustydog]

This is getting quite technical lol considering it wasn’t something I really was concerned about. I done 8hrs b+e training and you don’t learn anything regarding nose weight or any other weights on the vehicles.
You would think that there would be a couple of questions on the test.

Have a read of this from the CAMC.

https://www.caravanclub.co.uk/media/12354614/noseweights-mo__2_.pdf

 

[otherclive]

There are bathroom scales that have accuracy better than +-5kg. We have some and use them for weighing checked in airline luggage. Made by Salter.

Oh dear Clive.
As Hutch and I know Fat Club’s scales are accurate to 0.25 of a pound. Yours are 11 lbs out! Good new for me

Nice one, but I did say that there are bathroom scales that are better than +/- 5kg as an earlier post said that bathroom scales were also likely to be no better than that figure. At airline check in we are always within 0.5-1.0kg on luggage allowances.

 

[RayS]

Hi Steve, if you had happened to be on a certain Spanish campsite end of March for the last 15 or so years, you would have seen me checking nose weigh pretty carefully. SWMBO has developed a taste fro Cava and prefers the 2.0euro/bottle in Spain to around £6 here, so the front locker gets pretty full., as does the car. Cava bottles are heavier than standard wine bottles - so the tare weight is petty high. Not wure how we shall get on when out of EU though - HMCustoms may be a problem.

 

[Craigyoung]

..... 5o plus bottles or so i brought back from France , all carefully placed for balancing out :cheer: