Noseweight

[stephena]

Whilst giving the van a clean this morning and a bit of a clearout/re-stocking session by Mrs A ahead of our first trip of 2012 next weekend I decided i should check the noseweight.
I did this at the point I had emptied all our usual gumbins out of the van, duvets, pillows etc and had just the one gas bottle which will be around 3/4 full.

According to the nosewieght gauge our vans nosewieght was 201lbs/95kgs... this is a bit high isnt it?

For information our van is a Sterling Europa 520 (2005 model).

 

[colin-yorkshire1]

hi Stephen
yes it is a tad. however I would not worry about it so soon, wait untill it is cleaned out and re stocked then try it again.
many vans have a positive nose weight empty and can be adjusted with the loading.
by the way ours is 80kg completely empty with the gas bottles and battery on board " forward of axels" and the mover which is also forward of the axel but I have no trouble getting it down to 50kg (max for the car) before it goes on the road.

 

[Parksy]

The 95kg figure depends on the towball limit of your towing vehicle Stephen
If your towing vehicle has a towball weight limit of 75kg then yes, the noseweight is too high and you should adjust is as Colin has suggested by re-distributing the load / weight.
If, on the other hand, your vehicle towball limit is 100kg then 95kg is ideal.

 

[stephena]

Thanks all just checked the towbar plate and the witter website and It appears our towbar has a max nose weight of 210kg does this sound right? It brand new and wasnt cheap but this figure seems huge too.

 

[Mikey_74]

No it doesn't sound right, I've never seen a nose weight limit this high, the highest I've seen is around 140kg, BUT if you've an Alco hitch head stabilizer then the maximum noseweight you can have is 100kg

 

[Surfer]

Basically the noseweight of the caravan should never exceed the noseweight of the car and the noseweight on the caravan is generally limited to 100kg.

 

[ProfJohnL]

Thanks all just checked the towbar plate and the witter website and It appears our towbar has a max nose weight of 210kg does this sound right? It brand new and wasnt cheap but this figure seems huge too.

Wow that is huge, and I suspect you have looked up the incorrect information.

There are two nose weight limits you need to know.

The first is hitch limit for your cars tow bar. Each make and model of car has its own limit which the car manufacture will specify.

The second nose weight limit is set by the caravan manufacture and is the maximum Vertical load the hitch can apply to the towing vehicle - Again you should check the limit for the caravan, but the majority of popular caravans are usually limited to 100Kg

These are both legal maximum LIMITS, so you must not exceed the lowest limit which ever it is.

Caravan nose weight will vary depending on how you load the caravan. The important thing is that it falls within the cars capability when it is towing. You adjust the nose weight by rearranging items inside the caravan.

The regulations require nose weight to be measured at the towing height. This means that both the car and the caravan must be loaded and ready to tow. This is important as car carries the nose weight, and it adds to the cars axle loads.

Obviously the greater the weight carried by the car the lower its suspension (and ball hitch) will ride, and this important because the nose weight of any trailer changes depending on how high from the ground the hitch rides.

So to measure the real nose weight:-
We will use a set of bathroom scales, a cut length of broom stickand a spice of wood to spread the load on the scales.

Set the car and hitched caravan on level (horizontal) Ground.

Make sure the car and caravan are loaded as if you are about to drive away, and don't forget that driver and passengers must be included.

Measure the height of the hitch from the ground and note it.

Un-hitch the caravan and chock the wheels.

Place the bathroom scales and piece of wood directly (vertically) under the cup of the ball hitch. Cut the broom stick so that the cup of the hitch is supported on the scales. The hitch must sit at the same height as previously measured.

With the hitch supported by the cut broom stick, make sure the jokey wheel and steadies are fully retracted then read the nose weight on the bathroom scales.

Currently there is no device on the market that will measure nose weight accurately, as none of them guarantee to maintain the working height of the hitch whilst the measurement is made.

As nose weight has legal limits, and as frequently we tend to work close to the limits inaccuracies could render you unwittingly illegal.

 

[BigTim]

Hi
An additional point I don't think has already been mentioned is the importance of having the 'van on a LEVEL surface when checking the noseweight.
Concerned about the noseweight on our 'van I recently replaced my older noseweight gauge with the Milenco noseweight gauge which is the only which is meets industry standards for accuracy. When we recently needed a new jockey wheel I, also, fitted the Alko one which includes a built-in noseweight gauge.
A problem that we have with measuring the noseweight on our 'van is that our drive, where we keep our 'van, AND the road outside our gate both slope steeply. To measure the 'van on a flat surface I have to tow it to a nearby supermarket car park, after closing time, as that is the only flat, level surface in the area.
With the same 'van loading I was amazed by the difference in noseweight when measured on our road, sloping downwards from the front of the 'van (140 Kg) and on the level carp ark (95Kg). In both instances the 'van the load and its position was identical.
Our Witter towbar has weight limit of 140Kg and our Kia Sorento a towing limit of 150Kg and within the towbar weight limit I have include not only the caravan's noseweight but the additonal weight of our Witter towbar mounted bike carrier and bikes.
I was, also, concerned about the total weight of our car & 'van, particularly when both are loaded for our long summer hols on the Continent, so last year I bought a Reich Caravan -Weigh-Check. I use this on the supermarket car park too. The CWC is an expensive item but cheaper and more convenient than being caught overloaded by a MOT roadside check!
Tim

 

[Willi-Wonti]

AOur Witter towbar has weight limit of 140Kg and our Kia Sorento a towing limit of 150Kg and within the towbar weight limit I have include not only the caravan's noseweight but the additonal weight of our Witter towbar mounted bike carrier and bikes.
I was, also, concerned about the total weight of our car & 'van, particularly when both are loaded for our long summer hols on the Continent, so last year I bought a Reich Caravan -Weigh-Check. I use this on the supermarket car park too. The CWC is an expensive item but cheaper and more convenient than being caught overloaded by a MOT roadside check!
Tim

Check what is stamped on your caravan hitch.
Alko have a max weight of 100 kgs

 

[ProfJohnL]

Hello Tim,

Thank you for pointing out the very necessity for the outfit to be on level ground, and for reporting the degree of difference a slope can make as in your case, it is a clear corroboration of what I have been saying for a number of years.

The slope tilts the caravan which changes the vertical height of the hitch relative to the main wheels. So the same thing happens when a nose weight gauge fails to mimic the towing height of the hitch of the car

So I need to mention on aspect of your posting where Milenco's advertising hype has misled you.

Quote
"Concerned about the noseweight on our 'van I recently replaced my older noseweight gauge with the Milenco noseweight gauge which is the only which is meets industry standards for accuracy."

The Milenco product may accurately (or more accurately than the competition) display any applied weight to it, But unless the gauge supports the hitch at the exact towing height, what it measures is not the nose weight.

Depending on how close you try to set the noseweight to the available limit, the inaccuracy of measurement may compromise your legality.

 

[Guest]

Can I just point out, the van has to be level not the ground underneath it, the van can be adjusted to suit measuring the nose weight on unlevel ground.
To be absolute correct, the nose weight should be measured at the same angle it is being towed at, that being level, or slightly nose down.

 

[ProfJohnL]

Can I just point out, the van has to be level not the ground underneath it, the van can be adjusted to suit measuring the nose weight on unlevel ground.

Whilst there are ways to compensate for slopes, the most practical and by far the simplest solution is to use level (horizontal) ground. the outcome of all compensations is to effectively create an artificail reaction point that is referenced to the horizontal plane the main wheels sit on. How would you know what angle to recreate, unless you can obtain it whilst on level ground,
Don't forget that the angle will change depending on what items and passengers are being carried.

To be absolute correct, the nose weight should be measured at the same angle it is being towed at,

You are correct in so far it is the trailers towed angle (relative to horizontal) that needs to be recreated.

that being level, or slightly nose down

There is no legal criteria for the trailer to be nose down or level - it will be the angle the geometry of the tow cars towball height creates, and that could also include a nose up attitude.