Problems with a brand new Swift

[oktogo]

I recently purchase a 2014 Swift Celebration 584 and have had nothing but problems.

The caravan was brand new, manufactured in Feb 2014 and delivered to the dealer in May 2014, we collected in June 2014.

The sealant over the front windows was cracked, the cooker was rusty inside, the bedding gets damp, the cupboard trims don't match or line up, the fridge is fitted on a slant, the blow air heating doesn't have enough power to get hot air to the rear vents... the list goes on.

I have talked to Swift, they are very rude and just not interested and tell me I have to speak to the dealer (even though they supplied the dealer with this caravan) so I then deal only with ****** and a guy called ***** and aks them to replace or repair my caravan. Sadly theyve only been able to repair the sealant over the windows and replace the rusty cooker... the rest has been a nightmare as Swift claim the other issues are not actual faults and are just the way the caravan is made.

So I would like to know anyone who has a 2014 Swift made caravan with blow air heating issues, construction issues and damp in a new caravan. I would like to get a little more power being my claim to Swift and hopefully get enough voices that they will listen to their customers and fix things or re-design things so they actually work and look nice.

To date the dealer have not been able to get Swift to repair or replace the caravan either. I would also like to hear from anyone who has had problems with ****** in the hope they too will listen if we can get enough people to complain.

IF you can reject a brand new car if the car has significant faults then how come nobody seems to bother when you try and do this with a caravan?

Thanks
John

[/Post edited to remove names and such like as per Forum Rules.
Please READ and adhere to the Forum Rules.
Your contract is with your selling Dealer and as such you must deal with them.

 

[Sproket]

Why not try this bloke, he sorted one out last year for a family. .. who had problems with there van

watch

 

[oktogo]

The dealer isn't allowing me to reject the caravan sadly. So I have no choice but to seek other ways of making them see my legal rights.

I wasn't planning on going to the media with this, I just wanted to see if anyone else was in the same situation so we could come together to get a louder voice.

Here's a brief list of the issue:
· Tape on roof between roof panel joints, water pools at the joint at the rear of the van.
· Rust on oven door, inside of oven door is rusty
· Blow air heating doesn't blow hot air out of rear vents.
· Sealant cracked over front windows
· Water comes through roof vents even when shut, there's no seal.
· Wheel lock thread crossed, it’s very difficult to fit the alko wheel lock
· Scratches to side windows
· Brakes squealing
· Error on heater controls
· Bedding gets damp during the day, lots of condensation inside the van.
· Jockey wheel seems to drag on grass or gravel, the wheel doesn’t seem to move freely enough.
· Bed slides out when towing.
· Mirror door comes open in bedroom when towing.
· More worrying is when towing the van snakes around far too often, we have towed many caravans and this one just feels very unstable, it can start to snake for no reason and take a lot of effort to get it under control.
· The speakers are very poor, they only produce a mid tone and mean we just can’t listen to the radio.

The bed base is slatted but the dampness is on the pillows and sheets.

Swift say the heating system design and it's operation is normal, so they are perfectly OK with the fact the rear vents get no air pressure and therefore no hot air gets to the bedroom or washroom. Swift are also OK about the fittings, they say they cannot guarantee all wood will match or align.

 

[Raywood]

Your contract is with the dealer and you need to quote The Sale of Goods Act to them. This requires the goods i.e. the caravan to be of merchantable quality and clearly this one is not. You have the option of rejecting it if it is as bad as you say but I would take legal advice before you do that as there are pitfalls. The alternative is to find another dealer and get a quote for the repairs needed and ask for that sum plus damages for inconvenience phone calls etc. and if they are not willing take them to court. You may find that if you quote the act the dealer suddenly becomes more responsive but if not take them to court.
If you bought the caravan on HP or made any payment towards it using a credit card you also have similar rights against the companies involved.
If you are a member of either of the big clubs they have a legal advice line who should help you if not check your household cover and with any union as this may provide the service.
Under no circumstances let yourself be fobbed off.

 

[Damian]

I would suggest joining Swift Talk forum which is monitored by very helpful Swift staff.
http://www.swift-talk.co.uk/

 

[oktogo]

I wrote them an official letter 3 weeks ago demanding they reply in 14 days, I stated the sales of goods act and stated the exact reason why I was rejecting it... sadly they won't speak to me over the phone, they are not around if i go to the shop and they don't reply to my emails.

The HP company said they spoke to R*** and he said he has fixed everything so the HP company dropped the case, I have now lodged a complaint about them as it's criminal they were lied to and then didn't even ask for anything in writing to prove they had fixed it, then I would have had the dealer by the balls as there's no way it can all be fixed.

My next option is the legal route, I was just trying to get some other stories of people off here so we can all band together to get the right outcome and to also let others know that rubbish caravans are made and the manufacturer doesn't care.

 

[woodsieboy]

We have ongoing problems with our caravan,not Swift, and the dealer has never responded to letters, we have involved the finance company and they sent an independent assessor to view the van who produced a report for them,detailing the faults, we are now waiting the next step,which should be replacement parts to be fitted by our local service engineer.You need to press the finance company as they will be well aware that they have a limited time to respond to your complaint,they cannot close the complaint unless you agree,so I am a bit confused that you say they closed the complaint after the dealer claimed to have sorted it.You need to be persistent as IMO some dealers think that if they ignore you then you will get fed up and drop the case.If you are not satisfied with the response from the finance company you can send your case to the financial services ombudsman, who will examine, it and if they agree can instruct the finance company and dealer to put things right for you.

 

[Damian]

Quote " I was just trying to get some other stories of people off here so we can all band together to get the right outcome and to also let others know that rubbish caravans are made and the manufacturer doesn't care. "

Whilst I understand that you may have problems and that you seem to be finding it difficult to get satisfaction, the crux of the matter is that your contract is with your Dealer and it only through him that you should be taking any proposed action.

You CANNOT use this Forum to garner other people into "joining forces" as it is against Forum Rules and will NOT be tolerated by the Owners of the Forum, Haymarket.
Nothing anyone posts on the forum can be verified, and as such is a "one way" conversation, with only one persons view of the whole situation.

Also, if you decide to take legal action that will be the last time you may post about your problems on this forum as it will be then subject to Sub Judice until the situation is resolved one way or the other.

 

[oktogo]

I'm not goading people, this is a caravan talk forum to discuss anything and get other users help, ideas, feedback or views. Asking for people to join in merely validates the point that caravan owners are nice helpful people who love nothing more than talk about caravaning and get together to help people out?

Would your rules stop users joining forces to praise a campsite, towbar or exception deal they've found? Is it just negativity you're trying to conceal from your forum?

 

[Dustydog]

John

reading your posts clearly tells me you are in unchartered territory.
No dis respect but I think you need some professional help.
A forumite has already suggested you speak to one of the club'slegal aadvisor assuming you belong to 9ne.
I assume you have insured the caravan?
If so you may well have a legal expenses cover that can help.
A new caravan is an expensive item .
Do not delay.
Keep us posted. Hope you get satisfaction .

 

[Damian]

The simple facts are that we are bound by Haymarkets rules for the forum,

Rule 4 reads " You may not transmit complaints about named companies or caravan parks. Such individual issues should be taken up with the company direct."

Which you would have seen had you read the Forum Etiquette before posting.

Normally I would have just removed the whole posting as it was against the rules and is/was the first and only post you have ever made on the Forum.

However, I gave you the benefit of doubt which I thought reasonable, but what you are trying to do now is not going to happen.
You must make whatever decision you do, but your choice will not be aided by any users of the forum.
You have been advised by others as to what action you could try and take and as none of the users are legally trained, theirs is purely laymans advice, and that is as far as forum users can go.

Your posting staying on the site disproves your assumption that we are trying to conceal negativity, we do not conceal anything which we are permitted to publish about brands or in general terms about services, but when it involves named companies , because they do not respond, nor do they have to, it is not permitted to have a one sided argument or discussion.

 

[oktogo]

Damian,

I welcome every comment by the forum users, both good and bad. One sided views are of no use to anyone.

thanks for not removing the topic.

 

[Damian]

Thank you for understanding.
Not that is of any comfort to you in your situation, but it is not only Swift vans with problems, they affect just about every UK make, whatever price you pay.

Sadly there is no way of knowing which van is good and which is bad until you own it, then you find out ,,,,,,,,,, one way or the other.

I feel that the only way forward for you is the legal route so it is important to make sure that ALL communication is in written form with copies kept of everything, and all sent communication is by Recorded Mail.
At this time the Sale of Goods Act will be your best friend.

[/Late Edit; I see that you have had quite a long communication on Swift Talk and that Ash has stated that it is not wise for them (Swift) to comment on anymore at the current time as they are in consultation with your Dealer and are trying to sort the situation out.
That is probably the best way forward at this time and hopefully will result in the situation being resolved.

 

[oktogo]

I feel that the option to only depend on the dealer is a bit poor, the manufacturer should be making sure their dealers are keeping customers happy with their product purchase, I think this dealer will ignore me and hope I'll go away so I think I'll take the advice and seek legal advice today.

 

[Dustydog]

Hi John
I've read your Swift Talk thread.
You have had 7 Swifts the last 5 from the same and current dealer.
Thus I must assume the dealer has performed well over the years.
Whilst Ash is offering to help and has again reiterated an offer to help please keep focused that your contract for sale is with the dealer not Swift.

Sadly imo QC with caravan manufacturers is pretty poor.
Over the years I have found attention to detail poor. In my Bailey there bits of trim that are an inch short. We live with it but it's not right.
Hope you get it sorted

 

[oktogo]

Hi DustyDog,

I have dealt with the same dealer but only due to the fact there are limited caravan retailers around here, They are also very cheap when you compare them against suppliers with the same products for sale.
Fingers crossed we get somewhere after sending them a solicitors letter.

John

 

[colin-yorkshire]

hi John,
sorry you seem to be having problems with your new van, but to my reckoning it's only 3months old so falls well within the time scale of SOGA, rights are on your side, use them the dealer cannot fob you off. if he tries inform trading standards.
you have to remember that although it maybe Swift that built a faulty product, it is the dealer to whom you have the sale contract with and is his responsibility to fix it,replace it or refund.

it may be one expensive item but it is just the same as any other product [for example] if you bought a electric kettle from Tesco, and it failed in the first 3months you would not expect Electrolux to replace it would you!!!! it would go back to Tesco with the receipt.

 

[Raywood]

I am afraid legal action looks to be your way forward, it is sometimes the only way the dealers and manufacturers will do anything. This is not a Swift problem it appears to apply to most makes though.

 

[xtrailman]

From the list of problems I would have thought the dealer could sort them.

 

[xtrailman]

The dealer isn't allowing me to reject the caravan sadly. So I have no choice but to seek other ways of making them see my legal rights.

I wasn't planning on going to the media with this, I just wanted to see if anyone else was in the same situation so we could come together to get a louder voice.

Here's a brief list of the issue:
· Tape on roof between roof panel joints, water pools at the joint at the rear of the van. Design fault.
· Rust on oven door, inside of oven door is rusty Sorted new one fitted.
· Blow air heating doesn't blow hot air out of rear vents. common problem with some caravans, design fault.
· Sealant cracked over front windows. You shouldn't normally see cracked sealant on a new caravan, possible faulty sealant batch.
· Water comes through roof vents even when shut, there's no seal. New seal to fit.
· Wheel lock thread crossed, it’s very difficult to fit the alko wheel lock. Common, thread requires re-tapping.
· Scratches to side windows Small scratches are common, bad ones require a new window.
· Brakes squealing Could be rust in the hub or brake dust, requires the hub removing and service.
· Error on heater controls. Possible software update required.
· Bedding gets damp during the day, lots of condensation inside the van. Not sure about this, some mattreses have been recalled due to faulty manufacture. This would be my main concern, damp ingress, I would want a complete damp test.
· Jockey wheel seems to drag on grass or gravel, the wheel doesn’t seem to move freely enough. Lubrication required or new JW.
· Bed slides out when towing. Are there any securing catches missing?
· Mirror door comes open in bedroom when towing. Door catch not working?
· More worrying is when towing the van snakes around far too often, we have towed many caravans and this one just feels very unstable, it can start to snake for no reason and take a lot of effort to get it under control. This could be lots of things, poor loading or insufficient nose weight are possibilities.
· The speakers are very poor, they only produce a mid tone and mean we just can’t listen to the radio. Cheap radio speakers, some owners upgrade them.

The bed base is slatted but the dampness is on the pillows and sheets. As before damp test required.

Swift say the heating system design and it's operation is normal, so they are perfectly OK with the fact the rear vents get no air pressure and therefore no hot air gets to the bedroom or washroom. Swift are also OK about the fittings, they say they cannot guarantee all wood will match or align.

I hope you don't take offence at my line by line replies, I'm trying to help not annoy.

 

[Thingy]

I feel for you but your problems sadly are not uncommon. I have been in your position before and its not pleasant.

Two things I had, similar to you. The snaking in our case turned out to be a catastrophic failure of the hitch and drawbar tube. The dealer wouldnt accept this and it cost me around £100 for an Al-Ko inspection. I got my money back on that one.

As for the speakers, I have just raised this issue over on Swift Talk, and it seems so have many before me. The issue isnt actually the speakers per se, its where they are mounted and the material in which they are mounted. Im guessing being a new Swift, they are in the plastic headlinging around the sunroof. Plasitc is an awful acoustic medium, no depth to the sound. Add the fact that there is little to no clearance behind the speakers to the roof and you have very little acoustic space. Older caravans had the speakers mounted in wood, or what is laughably referred to as wood, around the headlockers. Whilst not perfect, it gives a far deaper and more vibrant sound than this current batch. Nothing you can do about this one, we all have it..

As for the damp on the matress, i think the lack of heating may not be the issue, but a lack of ventilation is very often the precursor to damp, whether it be in a house or caravan. Are the vents below the bed blocked or covered by the equipment you carry. Remember, these are there to allow gas (heavier than air) to disipate in case of a leak.

Our last van, the one in question also had damp. Im guessing with the discussion on the matress that you have a fixed bed. Ours turned out to be something very simple, it was the seals on the locker door for the underbed storage. Such a minor thing and it caused real worry at the time.

On our present van, we have had issues with the heater controls, and it turned out to be a simple misfit of the connector on the data cable, which was jointed in one of the cupboards. At the time, we were away for five weeks and it caused chaos.

Hope some of this helps.

 

[waffler]

My sympathies. Can I try to help you and also improve your comfort. We were sold a secondhand van by a dealer many years ago and found it seriously damp. Dealer ignored me and so I took him to the small claims court.. I found my trade union had a legal advise line who took me through it all. Some home insurance policies do like wise. (The dealer paid 2 days before the hearing.) On the heating issue I assume it is Truma blown air from a combi boiler. If so this should be excellent. It took some getting used to but my wife, who is an expert on temperature reckons it's better than the hime system, and we have been out all year. This is the routine i use. Mke sure everything is off- mains, controller and master switch. Connect ehu. Switch on master switch. Switch on heater controller and set air temperature. Select power source. I use Mix 2 in winter. (This gives a quick warm up and even in the coldest weather keeps van warm.) If heat is needed it should start blowing hot air in about 2 minutes. I have seen the following error messages, regulator frozen- i switched it off and on ro cure this one, no mains elec- ehu not connected properly, no 12v- forgot to switch on master switch. As an experienced caravanner you will have checked that flaps are open etc.

 

[RayS]

I have every sympathy with the problem. You have been advised to get legal advice.

On a similar matter I approached CAB and they suggested using Law Society Find a Solicitor feature of the website.
This site requires your location and the area of advice sought e.g. Consumer, domestic, property etc. Choosing Consumer I then got a list of 8 companies and individuals in my area reckoned to have experience. A concise email to each (using BCC of course has led to one telephoneconversation which has not been followed up, one standard 'not interested' email reply and six stony silences. Telephone calls to three of the six have promised return contact but none has been made after 6 weeks.
A complaint to the Law Society brought a reply suggesting contacting CAB !

So I wish you better luck in getting legal assistance than you've had with your dealer.

 

[ProfJohnL]

The consumer has the right to expect goods to be fit for purpose etc, so why do dealers think they can fob us off with substandard goods which they peddle? The fact remains that dealers should work for their profits which means they should be ensuring the products they sell are right by arranging for their suppliers to assure what they supply are in good order before they deliver them to their customers, or do proper pre-delivery inspections to catch the manufacturers poor quality control. Either way the customer does not order faulty goods so why should you accept them?

If dealers do not want top do this work they should reject the products they receive back to their suppliers and NOT pass them onto customers.

In practice it does not cost a lot to start a small claims action your self. Details can be obtained from the courts. So I strongly suggest you investigate this option. Don't forget you have no contract with the manufacture so your action is against the dealer.

You may feel this isn't entirely fair, but in reality, the dealer is responsible. They are charged by SoGA to supply goods fit for purpose etc. If the goods they receive are not to standard they should reject them back to their supplier and not pass on faulty goods to customers. THAT'S THEIR LEGAL RESPONSIBILITY, so if they do pass on faulty goods they have NOT done their job and are inconveniencing customers by doing so.

Further to Rays post about accessing legal assistance, The problem with asking law firms to quote to do work, They have no real means of predicting how long and how much it will cost, which probably explains the lack of response.

The alternative approach is instruct a firm rather than ask. Unfortunately it sets in motion an undetermined action with potentially uncontrolled costs. so set out a limit.

Xtrailman, The dealer may be able to sort out these issues easily, so why hasn't he?

The manufacturer has no direct responsibility to the end user in these cases - that's just the way the UK law is, responsibility follows the contract chain, not the moral route. However world class manufactures and dealers do take end user issues seriously and do engage and take on board customer views and concerns, and use negative comments and issues as opportunities to improve.

 

[Raywood]

Getting a quote from solicitors on these cases is simply not possible as they cannot predict how the case will develop, all they can do is give you their terms for doing the work and the hourly charge. What you need is the cost of the work needed and you need an estimate for that from another form and present it to the dealer with the threat that unless they either agree to pay this or arrange all the work needed to be done you will take them to court. You then have to follow it through as it is the failure of customers to do this that makes the industry think they can just fob you off. This will not stop until the industry realises that it is cheaper to actually do what they should have done than to mess you about.
Make it clear that your claim will include the costs of taking the caravan in for the repair and back afterwards plus inconvenience and other costs as you are entitled to these.
Also involve any finance company, they are well aware of their responsibility and have the size and power to make life very difficult for the dealers and manufacturers.
Even if the manufacturer ignores you copy them in to all correspondence so if at a later date if there is any doubts as to their involvement you can show that they are not guilt free.