Second Lockdown 😥😥😥😥😥😥😥

[Dustydog]

I want the vaccine asap and will take the Oxford one as it is. However I understand I could still be an unwitting carrier. Let’s hope everyone receives the vaccine in the near future.

 

[JezzerB]

There are quite a few vaccines that require a second or third dose or a 'regular' booster-tetanus was initially every 5 years I think but far less often now-something tells me 10. The mmr is given in more than one session too, so it's not particularly unusual tbh and is looking very promising. As the prof says though, mutations are a worry but then this very virus came as a mutation so that's normal and to be expected.

 

[Beachball]

According to hospital sources NHS England they expect to get stocks of vaccine on December 7th ,8 and 9th.
The NHS will be inoculated first with care homes residents and vulnerable over -80"s having to wait

 

[ProfJohnL]

According to hospital sources NHS England they expect to get stocks of vaccine on December 7th ,8 and 9th.
The NHS will be inoculated first with care homes residents and vulnerable over -80"s having to wait

The hospitals and surgeries are preparing for the vaccine, but as yet the vaccines have not been approved, so there will be no vaccinations until they have been approved.

 

[Dustydog]

We need to be very careful. Mutations are a fact of life. Hence the reason we get different flu vaccines each year. Let’s not panic ourselves before the actual event🤪

 

[ProfJohnL]

I want the vaccine asap and will take the Oxford one as it is. However I understand I could still be an unwitting carrier. Let’s hope everyone receives the vaccine in the near future.

That is the problem , and this needs to be realised by everyone, the virus can live on surfaces for between hours and days . No amount of vaccine will prevent you picking up the virus from a surface or someone coughing or sneezing in your vicinity. You can carry it (and therefore spread it) without being infected yourself.

Some people may, become infected but are "A symptomatic" and not have any illness. and again they can carry and spread it. This would be the case for people who have developed an immunity either from recovering from the infection, or who may have been vaccinated.

And of course ultimately becasue infected peopel only develop symptoms a few days after they have been infected, they can be active carriers without knowing it.

Any one of these scenarios are a very real threat to people with vulnerability, and is why keeping distance, washing hands etc, and wearing a mask in public is still so vitally important.

 

[Beachball]

If it not been approved why is this in The Sun yesterday ?
Hospitals have been reportedly been told to get ready for a coronavirus vaccine in as a little as nine days - with NHS set to be at front of the queue .
NHS bosses said hospitals in England could expect there first vaccine deliveries from Pfizer- BionTech as early as December 7th The Guardian Reports

 

[Beachball]

Conflicting information passed via media & papers about the vaccine waiting for official sources to confirm future plans for this ..

 

[otherclive]

If it not been approved why is this in The Sun yesterday ?
Hospitals have been reportedly been told to get ready for a coronavirus vaccine in as a little as nine days - with NHS set to be at front of the queue .
NHS bosses said hospitals in England could expect there first vaccine deliveries from Pfizer- BionTech as early as December 7th The Guardian Reports

Beachball, it’s sensible to put plans in hand and commence the initial actions to vaccinate the first groups of recipients. But until any of the vaccines have been given Regulator approval they cannot be used other than for pre approved trial purposes. So having an infrastructure organisation in place will save time when Regulators approval is given.

 

[otherclive]

That is the problem , and this needs to be realised by everyone, the virus can live on surfaces for between hours and days . No amount of vaccine will prevent you picking up the virus from a surface or someone coughing or sneezing in your vicinity. You can carry it (and therefore spread it) without being infected yourself.

Some people may, become infected but are "A symptomatic" and not have any illness. and again they can carry and spread it. This would be the case for people who have developed an immunity either from recovering from the infection, or who may have been vaccinated.

And of course ultimately becasue infected peopel only develop symptoms a few days after they have been infected, they can be active carriers without knowing it.

Any one of these scenarios are a very real threat to people with vulnerability, and is why keeping distance, washing hands etc, and wearing a mask in public is still so vitally important.

The early spring concern of catching the virus from surfaces that led to panic buying of disinfectant has now become more balanced. The article by WebMD with internal links to the US CDC shows that particular risk to be very low and easily addressed by hand washing. The virus is predominantly spread by air and human contact. Hence the five day free fir all at Xmas is a nonsense.
https://www.webmd.com/lung/news/20200903/coronavirus-on-surfaces-whats-the-real-risk

PS edit. There is minimal evidence to support your comment that people who have had the Covid or who halve been vaccinated could be carriers. You virtually state it as a fact, but with the lack of evidence it’s a hypothetical statement. The one or two reported cases really don’t deserve such a postulation from non medical persons. That’s why trials on vaccines will be ongoing to investigate such a possibility.

 

[Beachball]

i think i have answer the question about approval did you read my post 283 I am waiting for the official sources to confirm this about the vaccine

 

[Dustydog]

An excellent article Clive that puts the contact aspect into its correct perspective. The sooner we ALL have the vaccine the sooner we must hope C19 will fade away.
Beachball, our local hospital and GP surgery already have an advanced plan in place to start a comprehensive vaccination process almost immediately.

 

[ProfJohnL]

The early spring concern of catching the virus from surfaces that led to panic buying of disinfectant has now become more balanced. The article by WebMD with internal links to the US CDC shows that particular risk to be very low and easily addressed by hand washing. The virus is predominantly spread by air and human contact. Hence the five day free fir all at Xmas is a nonsense.
https://www.webmd.com/lung/news/20200903/coronavirus-on-surfaces-whats-the-real-riskh words they use

PS edit. There is minimal evidence to support your comment that people who have had the Covid or who halve been vaccinated could be carriers. You virtually state it as a fact, but with the lack of evidence it’s a hypothetical statement. The one or two reported cases really don’t deserve such a postulation from non medical persons. That’s why trials on vaccines will be ongoing to investigate such a possibility.

Thank you for pointing this article out.

I have a high regard for the opinions of experienced medical practitioners, as they rarely pass an opinion on matters like C19, without having put a lot of considered thought into it. The article does not say delayed transmission by surface contamination cannot be involved. In fact they recognise that basic hygiene like washing hands etc is the best way to reduce such transmission.

But when you look at the way the virus spread so rapidly across the world, and in most cases the causes could be traced to someone carrying the virus, but there were enough cases that suggest there was no direct contact with an infected person, that suggests delayed transmission was playing a part.

So there is a distinct possibility that anyone could carry the virus on clothes gloves etc and no amount of immunity will prevent it.

 

[otherclive]

Thank you for pointing this article out.

I have a high regard for the opinions of experienced medical practitioners, as they rarely pass an opinion on matters like C19, without having put a lot of considered thought into it. The article does not say delayed transmission by surface contamination cannot be involved. In fact they recognise that basic hygiene like washing hands etc is the best way to reduce such transmission.

But when you look at the way the virus spread so rapidly across the world, and in most cases the causes could be traced to someone carrying the virus, but there were enough cases that suggest there was no direct contact with an infected person, that suggests delayed transmission was playing a part.

So there is a distinct possibility that anyone could carry the virus on clothes gloves etc and no amount of immunity will prevent it.

I think I will await the WHO investigation on how it developed and spread.

 

[Raywood]

Christmas dinner. Hope you have the PPI rready.

 

[Beachball]

The Pfizer/BioNTech Covid vaccine approved for use next week in UK latest news

 

[otherclive]

Christmas dinner. Hope you have the PPI rready.
View attachment 953

Been advised if we eat out doors it will be easier to administer the Pfizer vaccine.

 

[Mel]

The Pfizer/BioNTech Covid vaccine approved for use next week in UK latest news

It really is amazing what has been achieved in such a short time. Tribute to human ingenuity.
Mel

 

[Dustydog]

Makes you confident Science can solve anything 👏👏👏👍👍

 

[Buckman]

Makes you confident Science can solve anything 👏👏👏👍👍

They have yet to solve the common cold, cancer and many other disease. They have been working on solutions for decades and still have not come up with answers or solutions.

 

[otherclive]

They have yet to solve the common cold, cancer and many other disease. They have been working on solutions for decades and still have not come up with answers or solutions.

I think that you are very wrong on cancer. Just look at five year survival rates and see the gains. But it’s a pity that the underfunded and under resourced health service hasn’t managed the survival progress that some other nations have achieved, but it has still achieved significant improvements.

 

[Dustydog]

I think that you are very wrong on cancer. Just look at five year survival rates and see the gains. But it’s a pity that the underfunded and under resourced health service hasn’t managed the survival progress that some other nations have achieved, but it has still achieved significant improvements.

My last comment was tongue in cheek and not wasted on the Prof👍.
Science is a subject based on proving the unattainable can be achieved no matter how remote or obscure or impossible the task maybe. History says it all. Atomic bombs , pharmaceuticals, and EVs where maybe the body surfaces contain solar panel types that regenerate electricity. My old physics tutor always said never discount anything. Well done all the Pharma boffins for their magnificent efforts this year. Never give up finding a solution😇😇

 

[ProfJohnL]

Just taking Dusty's point a little further, just think how many things have been considered as "impossible" by scholars of their time yet over subsequently we have found ways to achieve them, through the advancement of understanding.

Consider: Sailing beyond the horizon, travelling faster than a horse (never mind the ecology of horse manure), flying, traveling faster than the speed of sound. Landing on the moon, etc... and more up to date such as the Higgs Bosun, and many other sub atomic particles and fields and forces.

A good scientist should never say never, but they should qualify their statements with things like "based on our current understanding" or "within the capability of our equipment" etc.

 

[ProfJohnL]

It's great news about the Pfizer vaccine, and it will be a game changer, but its only part of the answer, and it isn't (and never was going to be) an instant fix.

As you should know its a two dose vaccine, and it will take a number of days for it to start to produce any protection, I heard to-day that for someone who is vaccinated this week, they're are unlikely to develop immunity until about mid January.

The vaccine also does not prevent you from carrying the virus, so it is still vitally important to continue with great care about hygiene, such was keeping distance and washing hands etc.

Keep safe and keep others safe.

 

[Buckman]

It's great news about the Pfizer vaccine, and it will be a game changer, but its only part of the answer, and it isn't (and never was going to be) an instant fix.

As you should know its a two dose vaccine, and it will take a number of days for it to start to produce any protection, I heard to-day that for someone who is vaccinated this week, they're are unlikely to develop immunity until about mid January.

The vaccine also does not prevent you from carrying the virus, so it is still vitally important to continue with great care about hygiene, such was keeping distance and washing hands etc.

Keep safe and keep others safe.

Interesting as never knew any of the above? Thanks.