Towcar for 2007 Bailey Pageant Bretagne

[David_374244821]

My wife and I have just recently purchased a new Bailey Pageant Bretagne. It all happened very suddenly and I now find myself looking for a decent tow car! My current car, a VW Bora 1.9 TDi (150bhp) is a bit on the light side and to be honest I was looking to change it anyway due the lack of space inside (2 kids!).

I am not a big fan of 4x4's so have been looking at middle sized sallon and estate cars. The weight specification's for the van are as follows:

MRO: 1195 kg

MTPLM: 1420 kg

I would appreciate it if anyone could offer some advice on what might be a decent mid sized sallon car or estate that would have little trouble towing this van. I have been looking at some Audi A4 Avants and BMW 330d estates etc.

Thanks in advance.

PS: I have never towed in my life! not even a trailer....

 

[rob_jax]

If you think the VW Bora has insufficient room in the back for your family, then you're not going to be any better off with an A4 (or a 3 series). Why? Because the A3 / Golf and A4 / Bora have the same floor-pan.

You might want to consider a VW Passat / A6 floor-pan - the Passat is a great car.

Robert

 

[David_374244821]

My Bora actually has the same floor plan as a golf. Its bascially a golf with a boot! The A4 on the other hand has the same floor plan as a Passat as I understand it.

 

[emmitdb]

Greetings David,

Have a look at the website www.cuddles.abelgratis.net.

It gives the kerbweights, 85% of kerbweights and maximum towing weights of all contemporary cars in the UK.

This is important in your case because you have not towed before.

As said to another newbie, best practice states that a newbie caravanner should not tow a caravan with a stated MTPLM (thats legalise for the max. all up weight the caravan is allowed to be)at anything above 85% of the kerb weight of the car.

In the other chaps case, he is looking for a caravan,. In your case you are looking for a car that is in excess of the MTPLM of the Bretagne by at least 15% ie.1670kgs which is A6 2.7 Tdi Avant territory.

I dont know how deep your pocket (or car allowance ) is but the older A4s (and even the newer ones) are out of it.

Do your homework but please be advised that if your car is too light you will end up with at best an uncomfortable towing experience which could turn out to be potentially dangerous.

There are lots of people that will tell you that the 85% is not law but a guideline. They are quite right, but it is a guideline that has stood the test of time. It is there for a reason. Once you have done your apprenticeship towing in all conditions and KNOW that you are competent to accept all eventualities then you can exceed the 85% guideline.

By that time you will have had so many pleasant caravanning experiences that you will want to continue into your dotage.

Ignore the above and you may have the kind of experiences that will put you off this wonderful lifestyle of ours for life.

 

[wayne_5097681]

Trying not to be funny, but why would you out of the blue buy a brand new caravan when you have'nt been caravaning before and also when you've got a car thats not man enough to tow it?

 

[Lutz]

You don't say whether you are looking at buying a new or used car. If you are thinking about a new one, then look for one with ESP (some car manufacturers call it DSC), preferably of the second generation where the brakes on all four wheels are controlled independently rather than axle-wise. Many of the latest models of the last couple of years are equipped with it. It will safeguard you better against instability and allow you to go higher than 85% weight ratio without compromising on safety.

 

[rob_jax]

My Bora actually has the same floor plan as a golf. Its bascially a golf with a boot! The A4 on the other hand has the same floor plan as a Passat as I understand it.

David,

Nope:

A3 = Golf

A4 = Bora (or Jetta now gain)

A6 = Passat

Just take a note of the rear leg room behind the drivers seat in your Bora, then look in the A4 - should be almost no difference - the seats are different.

Robert

 

[David_374244821]

Trying not to be funny, but why would you out of the blue buy a brand new caravan when you have'nt been caravaning before and also when you've got a car thats not man enough to tow it?

Good question! Me and my wife did a fair amount of camping together in our younger years and always had a lot of fun. We thought caravaning was a natural extension of this and would provide the kids with a lot of fun holidays. The idea of coming home from work on a Friday night and heading off for a stress free weekend is very appealing to me

The reason we bought a new caravan was simply becuase we will most likly hold on to it for 5+ years. The dealer wwe bought from had 6 year old vans at 9k plus while our new van cost 12k. I thought for an extra few grand going new was the best option. I'm sure it will be worth a fair amount when we go to trade it in or sell it.

 

[David_374244821]

Trying not to be funny, but why would you out of the blue buy a brand new caravan when you have'nt been caravaning before and also when you've got a car thats not man enough to tow it?

Good question! Me and my wife did a fair amount of camping together in our younger years and always had a lot of fun. We thought caravaning was a natural extension of this and would provide the kids with a lot of fun holidays. The idea of coming home from work on a Friday night and heading off for a stress free weekend is very appealing to me

The reason we bought a new caravan was simply becuase we will most likly hold on to it for 5+ years. The dealer wwe bought from had 6 year old vans at 9k plus while our new van cost 12k. I thought for an extra few grand going new was the best option. I'm sure it will be worth a fair amount when we go to trade it in or sell it.

 

[David_374244821]

Greetings David,

Have a look at the website www.cuddles.abelgratis.net.

It gives the kerbweights, 85% of kerbweights and maximum towing weights of all contemporary cars in the UK.

This is important in your case because you have not towed before.

As said to another newbie, best practice states that a newbie caravanner should not tow a caravan with a stated MTPLM (thats legalise for the max. all up weight the caravan is allowed to be)at anything above 85% of the kerb weight of the car.

In the other chaps case, he is looking for a caravan,. In your case you are looking for a car that is in excess of the MTPLM of the Bretagne by at least 15% ie.1670kgs which is A6 2.7 Tdi Avant territory.

I dont know how deep your pocket (or car allowance ) is but the older A4s (and even the newer ones) are out of it.

Do your homework but please be advised that if your car is too light you will end up with at best an uncomfortable towing experience which could turn out to be potentially dangerous.

There are lots of people that will tell you that the 85% is not law but a guideline. They are quite right, but it is a guideline that has stood the test of time. It is there for a reason. Once you have done your apprenticeship towing in all conditions and KNOW that you are competent to accept all eventualities then you can exceed the 85% guideline.

By that time you will have had so many pleasant caravanning experiences that you will want to continue into your dotage.

Ignore the above and you may have the kind of experiences that will put you off this wonderful lifestyle of ours for life.

Thanks for taking the time to write this.

 

[wayne_5097681]

Good question! Me and my wife did a fair amount of camping together in our younger years and always had a lot of fun. We thought caravaning was a natural extension of this and would provide the kids with a lot of fun holidays. The idea of coming home from work on a Friday night and heading off for a stress free weekend is very appealing to me

The reason we bought a new caravan was simply becuase we will most likly hold on to it for 5+ years. The dealer wwe bought from had 6 year old vans at 9k plus while our new van cost 12k. I thought for an extra few grand going new was the best option. I'm sure it will be worth a fair amount when we go to trade it in or sell it.

thanks for clearing that up i was abit puzzled, hope you enjoy your new van.

 

[paul_5132583]

Message for Lutz, interesting thought's on the ESP, my VW Touran has this fitted as standard, and i pull at just over 87%, without any stability issues.

Could i ask what you base your experience on,i have seen many of your postings and would like to know if you have revelant expertise in this field, i can remember reading in a caravan mag one particular guy suggesting that until more research is carried with ESP and tow cars,and that he suggested turning it off whilst towing, i have never taken up the advice because i feel that it can only benifit the handling, and in rain and snow the car accelerates and stops in a straight line, although only tried this solo.

Like many topics and advice given on this forum it can become dangerous to comment if not qualified to do so.

Regards Paul.

 

[Lutz]

I can't comment on the benefits or otherwise of ESP of the first generation. Like you, I have heard of sources that appear to question its usefulness when towing. However, I can't see why and I haven't seen anything to back up advice to turn it off. I therefore suspect that it was more a sort of prophylactic statement ("be wary of anything new").

I do have a copy of a report on the results of a Merc M with second generation ESP towing a caravan, though, and that showed a definite improvement in stability when negotiating a so-called "Moose Test".