On reading various forums I got the impression that in general the driver had to transfer weight from trailer to car to comply. I would have thought that to overload the rear axle, the car would be at its maximum gross weight and adding the nose weight of the caravan would take it way over especially if caravan was overloaded. In those circumstances I guess that weight could not be transferred from caravan to car therefore they would not be allowed to proceed. Their problem!
Yes indeed. If you intend to tow, you can't load the car up to its plated GVW before hitching up.
It doesn't seem to figure on UK forums but on Australian forums it's all too easy to overload the rear axle when towing even though the car isn't fully loaded - this is why the popularity there of weight distribution hitches.
Now I'm sure that the police and DVSA here wouldn't overlook an overloaded rear axle during a vehicle check, perhaps caravanners here should be more aware of the risk of putting too much in the car boot.
Now I'm sure that the police and DVSA here wouldn't overlook an overloaded rear axle during a vehicle check, perhaps caravanners here should be more aware of the risk of putting too much in the car boot.
Remind me what the Americans use when towing their huge units wher eit looks like the nose weight would exceed any axle load? Is it what they call a strait liner?
The Americans use weight distribution hitches, even on cars where the manufacturer advises not to.
Ironically, the old blade stabilisers we used in the UK before ATC, ie Scott-Halley and Bulldog, achieved a level of weight distribution roughly equal to the noseweight.
There is no such thing as a type approved weight distribution hitch in Europe or the UK, at least not for trailers under 3500kg, so there is little point in discussing that subject any further.
Apologies as I was under the impression we were allowed to ask questions that may be of interest to the poster on this forum?
My reply wasn't in response to your post but to an earlier one from RogerL.
So?
I'm not aware of any UK law which prevents me fitting and using my old Scott-Halley blade stabiliser, which isn't type approved, with my car and caravan which are both type approved.
There may be restrictions in other EU countries but not in the UK.
My posting was intended to highlight the fact that some outfits are easy to exceed the car's rear axle limit when towing even though the car may not be fully loaded.
Since 2014 caravans are subject to whole vehicle type approval in the UK just as much as they are in the EU. As the stabiliser is part of the caravan that is relevant to its handling and hence to road safety, it too must be type approved. The old Scott and Bulldog stabilisers were manufactured before the above date so they are exempt if fitted to a caravan that was also built before implementation of type approval. Theoretically, if fitted to a more recent caravan that caravan should be IVA'd. but I can't imagine anyone in the UK would go to such lengths as it's unlikely that anyone would actually be charged for not having it done.
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The UK doesn't require modified "vehicles" to be IVA'd - in the UK, type approval applies at the point of original sale not to any subsequent modifications - other EU countries may be different.
I don't know where you got that information from. What's the point of having an IVA process in effect in the UK if a vehicle doesn't have to be IVA'd after point of sale? As soon as a vehicle has been technically modified its type approval becomes null and void.
Here's an excerpt out of the guide to The Individual Vehicle Approval Scheme issued by the DVSA:-
It is an offence to use a vehicle that requires type approval without an Individual Approval Certificate(IAC) confirming compliance with the type approval requirements, except for the following purposes:
1. Submitting it, by previous arrangement, for an approval examination.
2. Bringing it away from such an examination.
3. Delivering it, by previous arrangement, to a place where relevant work is to be done on it following receipt of a refusal to issue an Individual Approval Certificate.
4. Bringing it away from a place where relevant work has been done on it.
My use of the term point of sale was wrong - it's the original registration which is relevant in the UK - the IVA process is for vehicles which aren't type-approved so that they can be registered for use on the road - once registered they can be modified without further recourse to type-approval or IVA.
But as I said before, as soon as a vehicle is technically modified from its original type approved condition, the type approval becomes null and void and as the DVSA stated, it is illegal to use a vehicle that is subject to type approval but which isn't any longer and hasn't been IVA'd.
In practice, however, fitting an non-type approved stabiliser will not result in a problem in the UK because the IVA process is largely ignored in the case of trailers under 3500kg. Unlike on the Continent it's not even resolutely applied in the case of motor vehicles, but that doesn't make it any more legal. It's just tolerated without any legal endorsement.
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IVA is used for previously Type Approved vehicles that have been radically modified pushing them out of the DVLA’s 8 point rule, I’ve been involved in this several times. I have no idea if this affects Type Approved trailers/caravans though.
I thought that I had replied with an answer. The plate, if it has been issued by the manufacturer and if it complies with the regulations, is a legal document. There is therefore no need for a separate certificate although I am sure that when they send it, it would be accompanied by an appropriate letter.
It was answered by myself and another. For the record I received official paperwork from both Bailey and Swift detailing the change to MTPLM and a new sticky label for attaching by the door. I did not attach the sticky labels as they tended to fade. So they were carried in the van, and attached when I sold the vans.
Happy now ?
The sticky label by the door doesn't usually comply with any regulations in which case it functions for information only but not as a statutory weight plate. It is therefore not a legal document and doesn't have to be accompanied by a certificate.
A statutory weight plate complying with the regulations will be adequate proof of an upgrade and, as I mentioned in my previous post, doesn't need a separate certificate.
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I have not said anywhere in this thread or others over the years that the door label is a certificate or legal document. But nevertheless it is what most buyers look at. Neither did I say the paperwork were certificates. But they were official manufacturers letters confirming the change to MTPLM. That was sufficient for me.
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No, but Buckman raised the question "Do you get a certificate with the upgrade plate?" and I only wanted to reply to that. Any paperwork accompanying a new sticky label by the door is not a certificate as such and is therefore unnecessary.
I think there's a bit of confusion here possibly caused by two threads with similar questions on upgrades and running in parallel.
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