User Payload UK-v -Germany

Jun 11, 2005
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Initially posted in Insurance by error

Looking in this month's Practical Caravan I could not help but notice the very different carrying capacities of UK vans compared with German ones. I know that everyone thinks that German vans are heavy but a large part of the Max Permitted Load is down to the fact that they have a good margin for user payload. Even the little Adria Action put some UK vans to shame. If you look at one of the Coachman models (Amara) User Payload is down to around 97-135kg. Even for their larger vans it is still no higher than 138kg. Hymers are coming in around 360-460kg, and even the Adria Action has a useful 281kg

Just because a manufacturer gives a good User Payload you don't have to use it to the full if it means going over the car's limit, or 85%, but it would give owners felixibilty and perhaps mean no change of van when changing cars
 
Mar 14, 2005
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This subject has come up before. A useful payload of under 200kg for a family caravan is plain unrealistic and doesn't take market requirements into account. Caravan manufacturers should take note.

However, I have this suspiscion that UK manufacturers deliberately restrict their max weights (MTPLMs) so as not to cut themselves off from part of the market. As the opportunity for further weight saving in caravan design is limited, they choose to restrict payload so that owners of lighter cars who wish to abide by the 85% weight ratio recommendation have a bigger selection of 'vans that they can tow.

Here in Germany this 85% rule(?) is unknown and the general attitude is to tow anything so long as it's legal. Since the law has recently been changed to allow towing at 100kph so long as the weight ratio doesn't exceed 100% (it used to be 80%), this opens up more possibilities in the German market. Just as an example, certain variants of the Opel Signum are homologated to tow up to 1700kg by special request and there are owners that make full use of this option.
 
Mar 14, 2005
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lutzschelisch.wix.com
This subject has come up before. A useful payload of under 200kg for a family caravan is plain unrealistic and doesn't take market requirements into account. Caravan manufacturers should take note.

However, I have this suspiscion that UK manufacturers deliberately restrict their max weights (MTPLMs) so as not to cut themselves off from part of the market. As the opportunity for further weight saving in caravan design is limited, they choose to restrict payload so that owners of lighter cars who wish to abide by the 85% weight ratio recommendation have a bigger selection of 'vans that they can tow.

Here in Germany this 85% rule(?) is unknown and the general attitude is to tow anything so long as it's legal. Since the law has recently been changed to allow towing at 100kph so long as the weight ratio doesn't exceed 100% (it used to be 80%), this opens up more possibilities in the German market. Just as an example, certain variants of the Opel Signum are homologated to tow up to 1700kg by special request and there are owners that make full use of this option.
Of course, with a kerbweight of only around 1500kg, a Signum towing 1700kg will exceed the 100% weight ratio substantially and may only tow at speeds up to 80kph.
 
Aug 28, 2005
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Guys,

I sort of get the point that your both getting at - for me our German built caravan weighs in @ 1100kgs (but I have never weighed it in factory condition) on the road we typically tare out at around 1235kgs but we are given up to 1400 kgs so we have a lot to play with.

I don't believe in taking advantage of this and our car meets the criteria @ 1775kgs and so potentially we really could trade down a little in the future if we wished.

For me the figures show two things - firstly you can build light-weight family orientated caravans well - just use better materials in construction. Some vans have either got low or no payloads to talk of which is poor customer orientated design.

Monkey's husband
 
Nov 6, 2005
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Maximum Technically Permitted Laden Mass (MTPLM) should be the design weight, ie the minimum of the various limits placed on components but most UK manufacturers artificially restrict the MTPLM to the Mass In Running Prder (MIRO) plus the minimum allowances required under EN1645.

I personally would prefer the approach of German manufacturers in allowing a generous payload but this needs a disciplined approach to loading which isn't common among UK caravanners.
 
Mar 14, 2005
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Just goes to show that UK manufacturers artificially restrict MTPLMs to look good.

That higher MTPLMs don't bother Continental manufacturers can be seen by the fact that nearly all even offer uprated MTPLMs for many of their models as regular production options in their published price lists. This gives the Continental customer opportunity for even more payload.
 
Jun 2, 2005
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This subject has come up before. A useful payload of under 200kg for a family caravan is plain unrealistic and doesn't take market requirements into account. Caravan manufacturers should take note.

However, I have this suspiscion that UK manufacturers deliberately restrict their max weights (MTPLMs) so as not to cut themselves off from part of the market. As the opportunity for further weight saving in caravan design is limited, they choose to restrict payload so that owners of lighter cars who wish to abide by the 85% weight ratio recommendation have a bigger selection of 'vans that they can tow.

Here in Germany this 85% rule(?) is unknown and the general attitude is to tow anything so long as it's legal. Since the law has recently been changed to allow towing at 100kph so long as the weight ratio doesn't exceed 100% (it used to be 80%), this opens up more possibilities in the German market. Just as an example, certain variants of the Opel Signum are homologated to tow up to 1700kg by special request and there are owners that make full use of this option.
you are right about restricting payload.

With my Swift Conqueror 630, I ordered a new weight plate with a higher max gross weight, from Swift. No modifications needed !!

As both mu car and my wife's car can cope, why not take advantage ? but why put a lower weight on originaly ?

Michael
 

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