wheel came off new caravan

[Chrisbee]

When wheels are fitted the mating surface between the wheel and drum/hub needs to be spotlessly clean. If this is the case then correctly torqued wheels will not "fall off". The problem arises when dirt, grit etc gets trapped. As the vehicle is in use sideways forces, especially when cornering, can crush this dirt effectivly decreasing the clamping effect of the nuts. That is why it is recommended that the torque be rechecked after 20/30 miles. Having said that, I've never had a nut that was not still at the same torque and I must have fitted 1000's of wheels to HGV's and coaches over my working life.

As euro says, if correctly fitted, wheels to not fall off.

 

[Dustydog]

I did the post below whilst enjoying the appalling delights of the very wet and windy Hebrides, never again!

Since returning home I have spoken to a number of people who do not believe me. Well I couldn't believe it either!

BE WARNED FROM A SCEPTIC.

Cheers

Dustydog

"Hi Graham

Well you are totally exonerated and indeed I have no problem telling my story.

Unfortunately the last thread didn't really address why the nuts came loose. This is the first time in 40 years it has happened to me especially as I watched the tyre fitter double check the nuts' torque.

Now I'm more cautious i am still not certain why it happened other than the suggestion I have already put forward.

Also I never thought you were a ventiloquist!!LOL.

See Chrisbee's last post on earlier thread. It must be the cleanliness _of the hub, wheel mating surfaces and the nuts that makes the difference.

However , even though I have been a victim, I do find it hard to accept that every driver of every vehicle needs to double check wheel nut torque after a service.

Anyway Graham,Idon't need telling twice . Maybe the whole design of wheel attachment needs readdressing???

Cheers

Dustydog still very wet!

 

[602]

Hi,

In 1967, I got a job in a commercial vehicle main dealer. They ran a bonus scheme, where the mechanic got 25% of whatever each job earned. So when you got a PDI to do, you checked the engine oil, tyre pressures and wheel nuts. If there were any problems, the new owner would tell you at the 500 mile service. Why? Because an afternoons work was worth about

 

[Barkas]

I got my car back from the garage a few months ago, they had both front wheels off and I had to use a 3ft snap-on power bar to break them loose, over tightening is a big problem these days with tech,s using air power tools. All you need for your car or caravan is a

 

[602]

Hi,

My son left his car at a tyre bay to have a puncture mended and put back onto the hub. The nice man didn't bother to tell him that they had done the nuts up so tight that they had broken the special security wheel nut tool. By the time he realised, it was too late to complain.

The problem was ...... this was in Brisbane. In Oz, you don't go anywhere unless you have a spare wheel and the means to change it.

Wheel nuts that fall off are DANGEROUS. If something is likely to fail, then it should FAIL SAFE. Drill some holes and fit R-clips.

602

 

[Surfer]

A number of people are advidingf that it is your responsibility to ensure that the nuts are re-torqued after 50 miles which in essence means purchasing a torque wrench or taking the caravan back to the dealer to re-torque it. Doing this is an expensive way to ensure that you are safe when it should have been done properly b y the dealer in the first place.

Imagine if you have a disability or are a pensioner who is no exactly fit. How on earth would you re-torque the nuts unless you took it back to a dealer. From our dealer to the storage depot is 25 miles so a round rip is 50 miles. Do I drive to the storage depot, turn around and drive straight back to the dealer as physically I am unable to re-torque the nuts myself?

Who pays for the cost of the return trip to the dealer which will cost at least

 

[Dustydog]

Ian

I felt the same as you until it happened to me.

Chrisbee's theory is much in line with the mechanic I met at Oban. Graham Ponty also has had the same problem.

The fact is we , the owner / driver are responsible for the vehicle. After my experience the torque wrench will get a lot of use. I suspect I was very unlucky, first time in donkey years,. Once bitten etc.

Cheers

Dustydog

 

[Sedo]

Had 2 tyres put on our Sedona a couple of months ago and the tyre fitters words were to the effect of check your wheel nuts after about 50 miles mate.

I must admit I carry a torque wrench in the boot of the car, have done for years.

Usually find it useful to check wheel nuts after having tyres changed or even wheels removed for brake work on servicing.

I'm afraid it's a case of not really trusting anyone to tighten them properly.

I was told by a mechanic that it wasn't such a problem with steel wheels but since alloys have become more and more popular it is.

Don't know if anyone saw the article I think it was in Auto Express, but they cars to have tyres changed or checked and I think it was something like 2 out of 10 were torqued up correctly.

Must admit it was a bit of a bummer when we had a new van thinking we had to stop after 50 miles to check the torque but that's what it said in the book and that's what the salesman advised before we drove away.

Tom

 

[chris_374398963]

So does this mean that after every service and buying a new caravan we have to check the wheels every time surly some must be wrong

 

[Heethers]

Like l said before on an early post, after l had my van srviced afew weeks ago after ltravelled back the 40 miles l re checked the torque on the wheel nuts, all took a little more torque not much but enough that the Like l said before on an early post, after l had my van serviced a few weeks ago after, l travelled back the 40 miles l re checked the torque on the wheel nuts, all took a little more torque not much but enough that made me glad l had done them.

I rechecked them again after trip of 150 miles and they were o/k.

Would this be one for Doug King of PC to investigate through the manufactures on how to get over the problem?

Like Doug reply in the July issue page (14)

Re check your hand book which states wheel nuts must be rechecked after 30 mile's or so after service, tyre's refitted or if you have undone the nuts for any reason.

I agree with Ian how on earth are older people or those that are not mechanically minded to over come the problem, are these the only options, take the van back to the dealer to re-torque, drive round for 30 miles then return to the dealer, their has got to be an answer, some form of locking devise as with the Artics, got to be something out their to solve the problem.

NigelH

 

[Heethers]

Sorry about the post cut paste went a little hay wire

 

[ValA.]

Has nobody seriously asked the question "What exactly am I checking after thirty miles?" Am I checking that the mechanic did his job properly, or am I checking that after thirty miles the nuts haven't come loose? If the former then it's the dealer's fault if it wasn't done properly, and if the latter, then there is something seriously wrong with the design of the nuts/bolts which loosen after being set at the correct torque. Is the thirty miles only after a mechanic has done the job, or must they then be checked after EVERY thirty miles just in case I didn't check them properly or they have come loose again? Something can't be right here!

 

[Lutz]

Have a look under the other topic about wheels coming off. I have given an explanation there why the nuts do not have to be retorqued every 30 miles. After all, you don't retorque the wheel nuts on your car regularly, do you?

 

[hublock]

I think you'll find this article of interest.

It does explain why you should check the wheel nuts after a service.

It's common sense and not worth risking what could be a very serious accident.

http://www.caravanandmotorhomebooks.com/articles/why_wheels_fall_off.html
Regards,

 

[chris_374398963]

Why should we have to check the nuts on the wheels if the dealer is not doing his job John can i as you a question where do you live because if you live in Notts and your caravan was provided by Lowdam caravan's I can understand because the service department is rubbish

 

[hublock]

Hello chris,

If the dealer fails to tighten the wheel studs it's you who has the accident, and anyone who might cross your path.

The wheel studs can work loose even if they have been tightened correctly.

"A picture tells a thousands words."

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8guSoWOafkI&feature=related
Regards,

 

[Lutz]

It is nevertheless unreasonable to expect to have to retorque the wheel nuts more than once after a wheel change. A further check during a later regular service should suffice. If it doesn't then someone didn't do their job properly.

 

[xtrailman]

I agree lutz

I'm sorry but the get out of jail clause, where if you have not checked your nuts after 30 miles, then the wheel falling off is YOUR fault, is complete nonsense!!

How is this mystical mileage arrived at?

What technical evidence says check at 30 miles, or you are doomed?

Don't use a torque wrench or your wheel will fall off?

It is obviously a mileage plucked from the sky, if it is so critical, why isn't the caravan towed for 30 miles, and the nuts checked again.

Why does my xtrail NOT require a nut check?

No one has mentioned that the nuts should be tightened up while JACKED up, final torque is then done when when the wheel is lowered and under load.

This is very important, as it centres the nuts.

I always clean the mating surfaces before refitting, after first smearing a very fine layer of grease on the mating surfaces.

In addition, on both car and caravan studs/bolts, i smear a fine coat of anti seize grease, this is NOT recommend, but i have always done it, my nuts NEVER rust on.

These practises evolved over 40 years, having cars where both nuts and wheels had seized on.

 

[602]

Hi,

Formula One cars are required to have a big lump of wood fitted underneath. Presumably this is so they can skid on their belly if a wheel comes off. ????

So, if caravan wheels are expected to come off, how about fitting a "skid" underneath? Somewhere to put your trolley jack, too? Maybe you could pull your wheels every winter, leave it standing on its skids?

OT, but has anybody seen those GROUNDHOG towable storage containers? The wheels can be wound up out of sight so the container sits directly on the ground. Then a big steel cover drops over the drawbar, hides all the electrics and hydraulics and WHY. Probably need a gas ax to steal it. MGW 3500kg, 20ft x 8ft x 8ft,

 

[Jim_374473646]

LOL @ 602

I wonder if you paint it white whether anybody will realise it's not a caravan

Jim

 

[ShadySadie]

NO

Formula 1 cars and other Formula racing cars have a wooden plank under them as their ride height is governed by the regulations to prevent teams from "using ground effect" aerodynamics to give faster cornering.

At the end of a race that wood has to remain within a certain thickness, if the car has been riding to low to the ground the plank wears away and they get disqualified!

The planks can also help the car fly and flip if it becomes airborn in a crash and loses aero down force, so in some ways it can have a negative effect in a racing incident.

 

[colin-yorkshire]

hi all

no disrespect meant to all the technical buffs out there with their micrometer approach to engineering but the fact really is if a wheel comes off it has not been put on right in the first place fullstop. a wheel comes off after a service or on a new van it is down to the mechanic that put the wheel on not the person towing the van after, the idea that is it just because they did not check the nuts after 30 miles is just plain nonsense. a wheel properly fitted will not come off on its own it is just a get out clause for shoddy workmanship.

602 qoutes from F1 but think about it one nut per wheel no torque wrench exept for the one on the air gun 200mph running over raised kerbs not many wheels come off no stopping after 2 laps to retighten the nuts and if one does come (very rare) it is allways the wheel fitters fault never the driver.

colin

 

[Lutz]

... the fact really is if a wheel comes off it has not been put on right in the first place fullstop

I really don't know how you come to make a sweeping statement like that. It only applies if all parts (the stud, nut and wheel) are designed to fit together. Any unsuitable screw fastener can become loose when subjected to fluctuating loads, no matter how well tightened up in the first place.

 

[602]

Hi Lutz,

If wheels come off that easily, then they need to think of a new way of holding them on.

Thinking bac to circa 1958, my old early thirties Austin 7s didn't even have a conical face on the nuts. Plus they had a cut out on the wheel, so you could take it off without fully removing the nuts.

The only problem I have ever had with wheel nuts was on a Citroen 2CV. The studs poked out at a part of the wheel which was curved, so the fitted special washers to compensate. Only it was possible to tighten the nut while the washer was out of line ...... and they came loose.

Bad fitting? Probably. Bad design? Possibly. If wheels are prone to falling off, its scarcely good design. Remember that law attributed to Mr Sod?

602

 

[Dustydog]

Lutz

Ok I did agree with you until it happened to me. May I suggest your statement is only true where all the parts are brand new or scrupulously clean in the first place.

I'm the victim here which has cost me money and it was my fault I didn't recheck the torques 50 miles later.

Cheers

Dustydog