Bailey Olympus 464 v Pursuit 430/4 v S7 Bordeaux.

[otherclive]

After a gap of more than two years we decide to buy another van in September this year. However as we had sold our XC70 and bought a no-turbo petrol Subaru I didn't want to change the car. So we bought Trigano 420DD which is lightweight and tows beautifully. However, its just too small for us when we have the granddaughter, and/or dogs. So in the spring we plan to buy a more conventional caravan. Our last one was a Bordeaux S5 which had good payload (250kg) but at 7m was just too long to keep long term on the drive. So as I don't want to pay storage costs and also want a van that can be readied to go at short notice we are looking at vans with a MTPLM around 1300kg, fixed bed and around 6.5m shipping length. We quite liked the Orion 430/4 but its payload is so low that I would have to fit roofbox which can be a restriction when visiting some places.

Our choice is narrowing down to the caravans listed in the title. I would be interested hearing members views on their likes and dislikes of these caravans, and general ease of living with them and ease of towing.

 

[Raywood]

What you are really looking at is the level of equipment, fixtures and fittings and possibly price. The Pursuit is the basic model in the Bailey range and the other two the mid and top range in the Bailey ranges. Assuming the Pursuit would be a fairly new caravan and the others older it is more a question of do you want the relatively new but less specified caravan or an older better specified one. The Bordeaux does have the advantage of Alde wet heating if you are looking at winter use which might be a factor though. The Pursuit should have more factory backed guarantee than the other two but if you are looking at that, make sure the caravan has been serviced in line with the Bailey requirements.

 

[Dustydog]

Ray
The top of the Bailey range in the Pageant Bordeax days was the Senator. We have one of the last ones made. Sadly no Alde wet heating system. The Pageant ranges only managed gas electric Truma warm air.
The Pursuit does have the wet system. Plus it's construction is Alu tec.
For me I'd have to go for the latest construction .

 

[otherclive]

Thanks for the replies. we have looked at all three types (and many other too). The Pursuit is attractive given its large payload with upgrade to 1300KG MTPLM, suitable length and overall layout. Though when you first look inside wit grabs you but after further time you do see that some of the internals are built to a budget. The shower area doesn't look too durable, although we tend to use site showers. But its modern contraction and even if there were to be a leak it shouldn't do the damage that damp does to convention vans. Although the floor may still be susceptible.

Jury is out on the heating systems. I rather liked the Truma Ultraheat as of the power was down or we were on a non EHU overnight stop we could still use it on gas without any fan being required. The combined under locker Combis seem to need power at all times. Didn't realise that the S7 Bordeaux had Alde. That wouldn't be a plus in my list of needs.

Bit disappointed that Bailey discontinued the Olympus 464 when they were upgraded to the Series 2. I understand some heavy items were moved further aft in order to reduce the ex works noseweight of the Series 1 from 88kg.
I'd be interested if any owners of Olympus S1 464s could share their experience of their vans. My car's noseweight limit is 80kg. Although to be honest when we travel the caravans loading is for stability and noseweight so there is generally quite a lot to shifting of items into their on-site locations.

 

[robf1234]

Thanks for the replies. we have looked at all three types (and many other too). The Pursuit is attractive given its large payload with upgrade to 1300KG MTPLM, suitable length and overall layout. Though when you first look inside wit grabs you but after further time you do see that some of the internals are built to a budget. The shower area doesn't look too durable, although we tend to use site showers. But its modern contraction and even if there were to be a leak it shouldn't do the damage that damp does to convention vans. Although the floor may still be susceptible.

Jury is out on the heating systems. I rather liked the Truma Ultraheat as of the power was down or we were on a non EHU overnight stop we could still use it on gas without any fan being required. The combined under locker Combis seem to need power at all times. Didn't realise that the S7 Bordeaux had Alde. That wouldn't be a plus in my list of needs.

Bit disappointed that Bailey discontinued the Olympus 464 when they were upgraded to the Series 2. I understand some heavy items were moved further aft in order to reduce the ex works noseweight of the Series 1 from 88kg.
I'd be interested if any owners of Olympus S1 464s could share their experience of their vans. My car's noseweight limit is 80kg. Although to be honest when we travel the caravans loading is for stability and noseweight so there is generally quite a lot to shifting of items into their on-site locations.

hi we have the s7 Bordeaux and it does not have wet heating ,,the only thing i dont like about it is the shower ,,in that when you use it ,it has to be dried out before you can use the toilet ,,i use the van for work sometimes and often get back very late ,,and i hate having to dry the shower base off at the end of a hard day ,,but thats my only grip ,, hmy:

 

[Martin24]

As always current condition and service history over and above age and particular range. Also of course what's actually out there. More trade ins coming in over January to March as the deliveries of new vans really filters through. We have the Alu Tech on our Pegasus GT65 and have had no issues with it (yet) but yes the floor can still be an issue and is a weak point. As far as the heating goes I much preferred our old fire and blown air to the blown air only option. Much more user friendly and practical. A lot of fixtures and fittings will be less substantial and built to a budget even more than your S5.

When I was a child all our Subarus were non turbo, from our GLF-5, through L series and on to Legacy. All towed a variety vans with ease and stability. If they made one with enough weight for us it would be on the top of my list.

Good luck with the hunt, above all enjoy the search and keep us updated as you go.

 

[otherclive]

Thanks for the replies. we have looked at all three types (and many other too). The Pursuit is attractive given its large payload with upgrade to 1300KG MTPLM, suitable length and overall layout. Though when you first look inside wit grabs you but after further time you do see that some of the internals are built to a budget. The shower area doesn't look too durable, although we tend to use site showers. But its modern contraction and even if there were to be a leak it shouldn't do the damage that damp does to convention vans. Although the floor may still be susceptible.

Jury is out on the heating systems. I rather liked the Truma Ultraheat as of the power was down or we were on a non EHU overnight stop we could still use it on gas without any fan being required. The combined under locker Combis seem to need power at all times. Didn't realise that the S7 Bordeaux had Alde. That wouldn't be a plus in my list of needs.

Bit disappointed that Bailey discontinued the Olympus 464 when they were upgraded to the Series 2. I understand some heavy items were moved further aft in order to reduce the ex works noseweight of the Series 1 from 88kg.
I'd be interested if any owners of Olympus S1 464s could share their experience of their vans. My car's noseweight limit is 80kg. Although to be honest when we travel the caravans loading is for stability and noseweight so there is generally quite a lot to shifting of items into their on-site locations.

hi we have the s7 Bordeaux and it does not have wet heating ,,the only thing i dont like about it is the shower ,,in that when you use it ,it has to be dried out before you can use the toilet ,,i use the van for work sometimes and often get back very late ,,and i hate having to dry the shower base off at the end of a hard day ,,but thats my only grip ,, hmy:

Thats always the problem with rear side showers, but compared to a caravan with a rear shower behind the bed you save 1m shipping length and quite bit in weight. Although the Pursuit 430/4 does have a rear shower/toilet behind the bed at a shipping length similar to the S7 Bordeaux and Olympus 464. But I suspect the compromise is then in the long/kitchen areas. Seeing Pursuit 430/4 in the new year. A possible option with a payload of near 300kg if you update to 1300kg MTPLM.

 

[otherclive]

As always current condition and service history over and above age and particular range. Also of course what's actually out there. More trade ins coming in over January to March as the deliveries of new vans really filters through. We have the Alu Tech on our Pegasus GT65 and have had no issues with it (yet) but yes the floor can still be an issue and is a weak point. As far as the heating goes I much preferred our old fire and blown air to the blown air only option. Much more user friendly and practical. A lot of fixtures and fittings will be less substantial and built to a budget even more than your S5.

When I was a child all our Subarus were non turbo, from our GLF-5, through L series and on to Legacy. All towed a variety vans with ease and stability. If they made one with enough weight for us it would be on the top of my list.

Good luck with the hunt, above all enjoy the search and keep us updated as you go.

Thanks Martin, I too prefer the Trumaheat blown air heating as even if you are off grid you can still use the heater on gas only , and separating the heating and hot water does give some more resilience in the event of a failure.
Be patient, I hear Subaru will be bringing outa bigger SUV, but whether it comes to UK isn't certain yet.

 

[ProfJohnL]

Hello Clive,
I won't add any detail concerning a particular model or make of caravan as which layout is very much a personal matter. But I will add a few general points. As we are fully aware there is no mass market UK caravan manufacturer that stands head and shoulders above the rest in terms of reliability and quality of construction. All the major manufacturers have moved to "new" methods of construction, and based on a very rough strawpoll, there are signs that water ingress on these models is better, but it's difficult to be absolutely certain, but it does seem having the wood less construction will limit damage if water does get in.

For a number of years now, we have seen car manufacturer's reducing vehicle weights, and revising transmission ratio's with fuel economy in mind. I am certain that caravan manufacturers will have been aware of this trend, and have responded with some of their own weight saving measures, such as thinner (and therefore weaker) materials, but their efforts have been offset by the marketing teams continual clamour to have more items fitted as standard. I am sure this has affected the durability of caravan interiors.

I take issue with Rays comment when he states Alde wet systems are an "advantage", I don't think it's fair to make such a statement, he may personally prefer them and they may have an advantage for him but that is not a universal truth for everyone, as other respondents have shown; there are plenty of caravanner's who are happy with convection and blown not air. The choice of standard equipment may also be affected by the weight saving or otherwise of using a combined function unit.

As you well know, ultimately the choices you make will be based on your own wish list, and which caravan comes closest. More recent caravans be burdened with features and complexity you see as unnecessary. Or perhaps you want an all singing and dancing box of tricks. The choice is yours

 

[otherclive]

Thank Prof. The later caravans on our list such as Pursuit and Olympus use the latest build techniques and have materials which are more resistant to water damage. But saying that our Series 5 Bordeaux only sprang a minor leak around its near side front window in year 9 and it cost less than £100 to fix. I prefer the Trumaheat and separate water heater for reasons stated above. We don't need the latest features as we found our Series 5 very comfortable and practical. I do like a reasonable payload though as it allows me a choice of where to carry the equipment and for longer trips (with dogs etc) it allows us to carry what we need. Again Bailey allow upgrades to payload if the chassis can take it. Our old S5 had 240kg with an MTPLM of 1400kg (in "old money"). Overall it's the basic comfort and practicality, and weight that will be a decider and as long as its less than 6.6m it can be stored on the drive, saving £400+ storage fees too.

 

[Martin24]

I'll keep my eyes open for that one Clive, I doubt the bootspace will be big enough though

How's the hunt and decision making going? I think having read everything you say, especially regarding heating I'd be looking for a series 7 or older even.

We've got the caravan at home again now and it's so much easier as well as saving money on storage there was no increase in premium going from cassoa silver to home which was another unexpected bonus. I am wondering whether to install cctv but is it really worth it as will get no further decrease in insurance and we're behind locked gates as well. I'll keep pondering that one.

 

[otherclive]

Martin,
We have seen an Olympus 464 at a dealer in Westbury, but they haven't come back re a trade in value. Guess a Trigano isn't the norm for trade-in at "conventional" dealers. Got a viewing at Webbs in Salisbury who have a Pursuit 430/4 arriving in the New Year, and Lady Bailey also have a 430/4 too. The nearest S7 Bordeaux is at Martins in Exeter so may go down to view in the new year. I am not panicking about selling the present van as this time of the year people's attention (and cash) is focussed on Christmas. Near us we have two places who have caravans for sale on behalf of customers. Both have good reputation, one is an outdoor shop and the other is a NCC service centre where I have my vans looked after. They take over the sale and provide the warranty to the buyer who is actually buying from them. For this they take an agreed commission. May go down this route or try a private sale via Owners clubs, and the two Clubs too. Something to think about in the new year.

But at the moment the van is powered up with the fridge packed with Christmas food, and it may be used as overflow accommodation during the holiday.

Re your comments on the insurance cost, I too found the insurance quote a bit lower for keeping it on the front compared to a "Silver" storage site. Strange world eh?

 

[Martin24]

I like the idea of buying through your workshop, you already have a good working relationship and I know I would trust our workshop over any dealer. Is Winchester caravans any good for you? I bought our first Coachman from them and a friend always has his Bailey's from them. Have always found their customer service really good.

 

[otherclive]

Actually I was thinking of selling my caravan through one of the two local outlets. Both have good reputations, and the outdoor shop has specialised in trailer tents and folding ones for years , and uses the caravan technician who has a NCC workshop in our local storage site (400-500 units) . But both have a limited number of vans for sale at any one time , so it would have to be a decision on what comes up and when. Winchester would be within my radius of interest, as I wouldn't want to buy from anywhere too far away as any problems would then probably require a long haul back to the seller for rectification. Saving a few quid on the purchase and then spending time and money to haul the van back to the seller doesn't make good sense. Cheers

 

[otherclive]

Well we collected our new caravan last week, and surprise, surprise its wasn't one of those that we short-listed. The Pursuit 430/4 with its transverse bathroom had significantly reduced living area. The S7 Bordeauxs that we looked at seemed to have lived a well used life, and the Olympus would have been an option but the dealer was somewhat off hand, so our feeling was that if they are like that over sale, then any subsequent problems may not be very well dealt with.

So looking around a display of vans we saw Sprite Musketeer TD 5 berth which was under 1300kg MTPLM and whilst we had never considered a 5 berth we looked inside. It was immaculate both outside and inside, even had an ironing board! And compared to the tight space in the Trigano, the Sprite could host a premier league match. Even though it wasn't fixed bed we decided to buy it as it may lead us to be a bit more tidy when on site. Towed it back last week in appalling weather and it was fine, and i have now got the trips booked for the year although only the ones in the school holidays have been confirmed with our grand daughter coming along too, as our own solo trips depend on our daughter's own leave being approved! But we are making progress in that direction.

 

[Martin24]

Glad you are sorted and hope you have a great time with all that extra space!

 

[otherclive]

Glad you are sorted and hope you have a great time with all that extra space!

Thank you, all I need to get now are a couple of side lift jack brackets and I will be ready to go. Really looking forward to our first trip which won't be until late March as we already have thing booked through Feb/March. First trip will be for a few days relatively local into New Forest just to see how it shakes down. Then its Dartmoor for our first real trip.

 

[Martin24]

Both favourite locations of ours.

 

[Raywood]

Martin,
We have seen an Olympus 464 at a dealer in Westbury, but they haven't come back re a trade in value. Guess a Trigano isn't the norm for trade-in at "conventional" dealers. Got a viewing at Webbs in Salisbury who have a Pursuit 430/4 arriving in the New Year, and Lady Bailey also have a 430/4 too. The nearest S7 Bordeaux is at Martins in Exeter so may go down to view in the new year. I am not panicking about selling the present van as this time of the year people's attention (and cash) is focussed on Christmas. Near us we have two places who have caravans for sale on behalf of customers. Both have good reputation, one is an outdoor shop and the other is a NCC service centre where I have my vans looked after. They take over the sale and provide the warranty to the buyer who is actually buying from them. For this they take an agreed commission. May go down this route or try a private sale via Owners clubs, and the two Clubs too. Something to think about in the new year.

But at the moment the van is powered up with the fridge packed with Christmas food, and it may be used as overflow accommodation during the holiday.

Re your comments on the insurance cost, I too found the insurance quote a bit lower for keeping it on the front compared to a "Silver" storage site. Strange world eh?

Oddly enough the dealer where we bought our current caravan said he likes something different as with all caravans being virtually the same something different is in fact easier to sell. Possibly though with no guide book price your dealer was not sure what to offer.

 

[otherclive]

Martin,
We have seen an Olympus 464 at a dealer in Westbury, but they haven't come back re a trade in value. Guess a Trigano isn't the norm for trade-in at "conventional" dealers. Got a viewing at Webbs in Salisbury who have a Pursuit 430/4 arriving in the New Year, and Lady Bailey also have a 430/4 too. The nearest S7 Bordeaux is at Martins in Exeter so may go down to view in the new year. I am not panicking about selling the present van as this time of the year people's attention (and cash) is focussed on Christmas. Near us we have two places who have caravans for sale on behalf of customers. Both have good reputation, one is an outdoor shop and the other is a NCC service centre where I have my vans looked after. They take over the sale and provide the warranty to the buyer who is actually buying from them. For this they take an agreed commission. May go down this route or try a private sale via Owners clubs, and the two Clubs too. Something to think about in the new year.

But at the moment the van is powered up with the fridge packed with Christmas food, and it may be used as overflow accommodation during the holiday.

Re your comments on the insurance cost, I too found the insurance quote a bit lower for keeping it on the front compared to a "Silver" storage site. Strange world eh?

Oddly enough the dealer where we bought our current caravan said he likes something different as with all caravans being virtually the same something different is in fact easier to sell. Possibly though with no guide book price your dealer was not sure what to offer.

I know that the Used Prices Guide has nothing for Eriba, Trigano, Gobur or many/all of the non-mainstream caravans. The internet however does help inform decisions on prices etc, as do contacts in the trade. That I can understand, so that's why we gave the salesman our details and contacts. But even if the dealership were not interested in a P/E a call, or email to just say so would have been sufficient and show some consideration for a potential Buyer of the 464, or possibly as it turned out the Buyer of a caravan that wasn't even on our list. To not get back at all shows a disregard for the potential customer, and would colour my decision as if Sales took a potential Buyer so lightly what would the after sales be like if any problems arose?

 

[TD42]

Hi otherclive, If I may be so bold, Have you yet sold your Trigano? if not I could be interested ,depending on price ,& location .
having sold our van a couple of years back ,we are severly missing the freedom of caravanning ,although we have also downgraded to a 1.6 HDI Hyundai which has a max tow load of 1300kg
which might also be a problem
if you prefer my email is xaad@fsmail.net

TD

 

[otherclive]

TD the Trigano is at Martins of Exeter.

http://www.martinsofexeter.co.uk/mall/departmentpage.cfm/CaravansandMotorhomes/_515746/1/Touring-Caravans

 

[TD42]

thanks otherclive .I did see it on their website & thought it might be yours. A bit far for us to view & to be honest a little out of my price range, but thanks for getting back . Hope you are enjoying your new aqisition

TD