Bye Bye - LOL

May 24, 2014
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Today is the day we empty the caravan and get it ready to depart to the dealers.

Madam is gazing wistfully at it through the window resurrecting fond memories of holidays past. :(

I too am gazing out the window, and thinking "Good riddance". :evil:

Its all in the eye of the beholder.
 
Feb 9, 2009
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Sorry you are going. Any plans to get another van?
Do not forget that even if you do not get another van you can still log on to the forum.
Best of luck in the future
 
May 7, 2012
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When we traded ours in the dealer was helpful by putting the new caravan alongside the old one and we just moved everything across. Possibly means we did not throw out as much as we should but it was great time saver.
 
May 24, 2014
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Sorry you are going. Any plans to get another van?
Do not forget that even if you do not get another van you can still log on to the forum.
Best of luck in the future

Thanks but Im not going anywhere, just upgrading and getting rid of a caravan that has less charm than Vlad the Impaler. ;)
 
May 24, 2014
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Thanks, we are hoping we can tow this one without bits dropping off everywhere. Right pile of junk the HiStyle.
 
Jun 20, 2005
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Did you get a good px?
Strangely enough over the years , the longer I have kept a caravan the less that breaks.
Every new caravan should come with a tool kit for guys like us to do the repairs diy with no bother, serious damp faults and major components excepted.
 
Mar 14, 2005
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Dustydog said:
....Every new caravan should come with a tool kit for guys like us to do the repairs diy with no bother, serious damp faults and major components excepted.

Every new caravan should not need ANY tools! They should be perfect every time!!!!

It needs caravanners to become a little more hard nosed about returning faulty caravans to dealers and to make them stand up an pay for their inability to sort things before they sell them.

Every time a caravanner makes a repair, even if its just tightening a screw, or wiping a mark off the kitchen top. The dealer has got away with taking your money for something that's imperfect. which is breach of contract.

Caravanners on the whole are a pushover, and dealers and the manufacturers know that and boy do they get away with it.
 
May 24, 2014
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A pushover is the one thing I am not Prof. Im more the bulldog type. I pay for a level of service and i expect a level of service. When i dont get it i sink my teeth in and dont let go as my long suffering wife will testify. Not that i would dare bite her.

As a nation we Brits dont complain enough. Its as if we have become conditioned to second rate. However i put most blame on the fact that quality control is left to us as the end user rather than the manufacturers.

Theres an old saying from my army days....remember, your weapon was made by the lowest bidder. Same can prob be said for most caravan components.
 
Oct 12, 2013
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Thingy ,
We were the same as you last year when we came to Px our Orion which we had 4 great starting years in it , but I've got plenty of pictures on my phone for memory of where we've been and what we've done with it but now have a new file for the new one that we have & what we are still currently doing with it and all loving it.
I hope you enjoy your new one .

Craig .
 
Jun 20, 2005
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ProfJohnL said:
Dustydog said:
....Every new caravan should come with a tool kit for guys like us to do the repairs diy with no bother, serious damp faults and major components excepted.

Every new caravan should not need ANY tools! They should be perfect every time!!!!

It needs caravanners to become a little more hard nosed about returning faulty caravans to dealers and to make them stand up an pay for their inability to sort things before they sell them.

Every time a caravanner makes a repair, even if its just tightening a screw, or wiping a mark off the kitchen top. The dealer has got away with taking your money for something that's imperfect. which is breach of contract.

Caravanners on the whole are a pushover, and dealers and the manufacturers know that and boy do they get away with it.
Fully agree Prof but sadly in spite of all our posts moaning and groaning very little seems to improve. These days I find it easier and more economic in time and fuel costs to do most repairs at home especially woodwork and trims which seem designed to fall off. Only yesterday I discovered a fractured seat slat. Machined a new one at zero cost, improved quality and easily fitted.
I doubt much will change. I initially thought Alutech and all the Swift composites were a great improvement. But again they only seem as good as glue and sealant.
Let’s see if more victims of failures use the CRA for recompense.
 
May 24, 2014
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I hope you enjoy your new one .

Thank you. Its a big step up for us in terms of cost, it remains to be seen whether its a step up in reliability.

We are very restricted in the size of caravan we can have at home, 7.1m is the absolute maximum else its storgage.
Usually the side dinettes 4 berth vans are ideal for us in size, but if you look around the manufacturers, very very few except for Coachman designation 520s or Swift variants of the 530 are 7 mtrs and virtually nobody else is doing the side dinette 4 berth. Our market was incredibly limited.
 
Jun 26, 2017
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ProfJohnL said:
Dustydog said:
....Every new caravan should come with a tool kit for guys like us to do the repairs diy with no bother, serious damp faults and major components excepted.

Every new caravan should not need ANY tools! They should be perfect every time!!!!

It needs caravanners to become a little more hard nosed about returning faulty caravans to dealers and to make them stand up an pay for their inability to sort things before they sell them.

Every time a caravanner makes a repair, even if its just tightening a screw, or wiping a mark off the kitchen top. The dealer has got away with taking your money for something that's imperfect. which is breach of contract.

Caravanners on the whole are a pushover, and dealers and the manufacturers know that and boy do they get away with it.

Prof,

Big difference of opinion here as unlike yourself, I have no interest whatsoever in towing the caravan to the dealer and complaining about superficial issues like loose screws and fittings and misaligned cupboards that I can rectify myself in a matter of seconds. I clearly must value my time and energy much more than you do your own, not to mention my relationship with the dealer. We bought our caravan to help maximise our enjoyment of family time spent together, rather than as a weapon to use during a malignant crusade against the Caravan industry.

I have had a couple of issues with my caravan which I bought new last year, which both the dealer (not the one I bought the van from) and the manufacturer, Swift have responded to and resolved in a timely manner, and in an exemplary fashion. However, in suggesting that others should return their caravan for such trivial issues as those you mention, and your almost standard reply to the majority of posts which quote the Consumer Rights Act, I can’t help but think that your interest in caravanning and the caravan industry in general has strayed well and truly off the path of enjoyment for leisure purposes, and has become something much more malign.

Wishing you the very best of luck on your crusade Prof, but I for one won’t be signing up. Life’s too short. I’m off to enjoy my caravanning adventures with the family ... :p

“Now, where did that screw come from, I’m sure it wasn’t there when we set off”

“It’s OK, just put it in the drawer with the others ! :p
 
May 7, 2012
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While in principal I agree with the Prof, in practice I am not on a crusade to have every little thing done by the dealer at the expense of having to tow the caravan back to them. We did spot a couple of minor problems at the dealers and they were fixed on the spot but have since found a couple of bits of loose trim, a Lunar speciality, which it is easier to glue back down and one of the hooks from the end of a blind missing. I can put the hook back on but will need the dealer to post this on first.
I do feel that you need to try and keep a good relationship with the dealer if they are fair with you and would not want to ruin that with nit picking.
 
May 24, 2014
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This is partly why the dealers are getting away with shoddy service, simply because for many people its too much hassle to drag the caravan back for every minor detail.

The skill is in knowing when to swallow the loose screws and hit them hard for something major. Everyone can make mistakes, and the quality of the dealership shows in how they rectify mistakes, and that I can live with. What absolutely drives me wild is the "can't be bothered to do it right" attitude and with me that generally illicits both barrels.
 
Mar 14, 2005
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Dustydog said:
Only yesterday I discovered a fractured seat slat. Machined a new one at zero cost, improved quality and easily fitted.

Hang the practical approach, stand up for your rights!

You ordered a perfect caravan, and what did you get - a faulty one. Why should you pay extra to repair a fault that is not your fault?

You say it was zero cost - but patently that cannot be true. you must have purchased the material used, and the tools and at least some wear and tear, What about the education and training you had that enabled you to carry out the repair, and of course the time it took to establish what the problem was, to establish what was needed to effect the repair, the cost of the space to house and use the tools, not to mention your time.

Your real cost can not be zero.

I know you weigh up the costs of inconvenience of using the dealer, but it is exactly these small things that dealers should be sorting and feeling the pain of their failures. It would start to make then take their legal responsibilities more seriously, and bring pressure to bear on the Manufacturers to see that quality matters.

Don't forget that under the CRA, it is the sellers responsibility to cause the minimum of inconvenience to customers whose products are faulty. Perhaps they will begin to have a mobile technician who can travel to customers to resolve the smaller simpler product faults.

Power to the Consumer - stand up for your rights!!!
 
Jun 20, 2005
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ProfJohnL said:
Dustydog said:
Only yesterday I discovered a fractured seat slat. Machined a new one at zero cost, improved quality and easily fitted.

Hang the practical approach, stand up for your rights!

You ordered a perfect caravan, and what did you get - a faulty one. Why should you pay extra to repair a fault that is not your fault?

You say it was zero cost - but patently that cannot be true. you must have purchased the material used, and the tools and at least some wear and tear, What about the education and training you had that enabled you to carry out the repair, and of course the time it took to establish what the problem was, to establish what was needed to effect the repair, the cost of the space to house and use the tools, not to mention your time.

Your real cost can not be zero.

I know you weigh up the costs of inconvenience of using the dealer, but it is exactly these small things that dealers should be sorting and feeling the pain of their failures. It would start to make then take their legal responsibilities more seriously, and bring pressure to bear on the Manufacturers to see that quality matters.

Don't forget that under the CRA, it is the sellers responsibility to cause the minimum of inconvenience to customers whose products are faulty. Perhaps they will begin to have a mobile technician who can travel to customers to resolve the smaller simpler product faults.

Power to the Consumer - stand up for your rights!!!

Sorry Prof,
Fantasy and reality clash. :eek:hmy:
I agree everything should be perfect but the time and cost of tugging to and fro from the dealer really isn’t practical nor sensible.
In fact even I will say doing diy fixes on your own caravan is part of the pleasure and satisfaction of owning a box on wheels :whistle:
 
Mar 14, 2005
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Hello Icarus

Each to their own, and I hope you do enjoy your holidays.

I strenuously deny your assessment of my posts in such matters. They are not malignant, they reflect the state of the industry which has evolved using customers as highly inconvenienced and unpaid quality controllers as often reported in these columns.

Sadly it is the apathy of customers that has allowed this state of affairs to arise, and if a dealer is offended by a customer exercising their legal rights to have perfect brand new products, then they really should not be in business, its within the sellers power to avoid such issues.

I have never suggested that customers should return caravans to the dealers, under the CRA it is the sellers responsibility for faults, and to inconvenience customers as litlle as possible, so its up to the dealers to work out how to do it. - may be a man in a van?
 
Sep 29, 2016
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Prof,

Just wondering; is there any recourse under the CRA (or any other relevant legislation ) to charge the costs of time, fuel and inconvenience etc. to the caravan dealermaker.

It would seem to me that I should at least expect the dealermaker come to me to make good faults at his expense and alleviate me from financial penalty for their errors.

I can give the car trade as a (somewhat debatable) standard with regard to car faults, it is somewhat to be expected that the dealer will uplift the car at their expense and often times provide a replacement car for the duration of the inconvenience.

My expectations feel far fetched, even to me? But I am also asking myself; why do I and others accept the current situation as a 'norm'?

Answer= Because we put up with it (with the Prof here) and because there does not appear to be any recourse to making caravan dealersmakers responsible for costs not of our making.
 
Feb 23, 2018
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Anseo said:
Prof,

Just wondering; is there any recourse under the CRA (or any other relevant legislation ) to charge the costs of time, fuel and inconvenience etc. to the caravan dealermaker.

It would seem to me that I should at least expect the dealermaker come to me to make good faults at his expense and alleviate me from financial penalty for their errors.

I can give the car trade as a (somewhat debatable) standard with regard to car faults, it is somewhat to be expected that the dealer will uplift the car at their expense and often times provide a replacement car for the duration of the inconvenience.

My expectations feel far fetched, even to me? But I am also asking myself; why do I and others accept the current situation as a 'norm'?

Answer= Because we put up with it (with the Prof here) and because there does not appear to be any recourse to making caravan dealersmakers responsible for costs not of our making.

I have never had the fuel costs reimbursed when taking my car to the dealer for rectification of faults under warranty or even dealer inflicted issues. They have collected the car from my address at their expense, but not replaced the fuel in my vehicle. I expect to have to pay in time and fuel for my Caravan to be looked at by the dealers so I make the trip count. (Even a small chip in the veneer round the radio housing which is in a locker was pick-up on by me and reported)

I wish Thingy all the best with his new 'van, those Sterlings do look nice! But I would always carry a screw driver & gaffer tape just in case!
 
May 24, 2014
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I wish Thingy all the best with his new 'van, those Sterlings do look nice! But I would always carry a screw driver & gaffer tape just in case!

Thanks, but.....

Screwdrivers
Gaffer Tape
No more Nails wood glue
Multimeter
Spanners
Sockets + Wrench
Stanely Knife
Cable ties
Big 'ammer
Lil 'ammer
Selection of screws, fuses, window catches etc

after all, its made by Swift :lol:
 
Nov 16, 2015
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Thingy said:
I wish Thingy all the best with his new 'van, those Sterlings do look nice! But I would always carry a screw driver & gaffer tape just in case!

Thanks, but.....

Screwdrivers
Gaffer Tape
No more Nails wood glue
Multimeter
Spanners
Sockets + Wrench
Stanely Knife
Cable ties
Big 'ammer
Lil 'ammer
Selection of screws, fuses, window catches etc

after all, its made by Swift :lol:

Sounds like the same kit I keep for the Coachman.
 
May 7, 2012
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CustardAvenger said:
Anseo said:
Prof,

Just wondering; is there any recourse under the CRA (or any other relevant legislation ) to charge the costs of time, fuel and inconvenience etc. to the caravan dealermaker.

It would seem to me that I should at least expect the dealermaker come to me to make good faults at his expense and alleviate me from financial penalty for their errors.

I can give the car trade as a (somewhat debatable) standard with regard to car faults, it is somewhat to be expected that the dealer will uplift the car at their expense and often times provide a replacement car for the duration of the inconvenience.

My expectations feel far fetched, even to me? But I am also asking myself; why do I and others accept the current situation as a 'norm'?

Answer= Because we put up with it (with the Prof here) and because there does not appear to be any recourse to making caravan dealersmakers responsible for costs not of our making.

I have never had the fuel costs reimbursed when taking my car to the dealer for rectification of faults under warranty or even dealer inflicted issues. They have collected the car from my address at their expense, but not replaced the fuel in my vehicle. I expect to have to pay in time and fuel for my Caravan to be looked at by the dealers so I make the trip count. (Even a small chip in the veneer round the radio housing which is in a locker was pick-up on by me and reported)

I wish Thingy all the best with his new 'van, those Sterlings do look nice! But I would always carry a screw driver & gaffer tape just in case!

There is support for this in the legislation but I suspect you will have to fight for this and if you are on good terms with the dealer it might prejudice this relationship. It would be interesting to hear from anyone who managed this.
 

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