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Cars Tow Capacity - MIRO vs MLTPM

Sep 10, 2021
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Hi there,

First time posting and I am looking for some information regards what I can legally tow.

I have a company car which is a Peugeot 5008 with a max tow capacity of 1300kg. The gross weight of my car is 2200 Kg and as I passed my test after 1997 I can legally tow a combined weight of 3000KG, meaning the max i can tow on this point is also 1300kg. I can't change the car so need a caravan to fit, which as a family of 5 is proving tricky.

I am looking at a caravan that has an MIRO of 1120Kg and an MLTPM of 1317Kg.

My question is if I tow the caravan and put very minimal weight in it am I legal ? I know for a fact it will be under the 1300kg limit but I am unsure of whether it would go on the actual weight or the plated weights if I were to be pulled over.

i have spoke to a few dealers who have said it would be fine but 1 said it would be illegal. - seems to be a bit of a grey area.

Any help or advice would be much appreciated.

Thank you

G
 
Nov 6, 2005
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It's not a grey area at all. The answer to your question is NO - it's the sum of the maximum weights that has to be 3500 kg or under.

Many older caravans were well under 1300 kg MTPLM.
 
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Nov 11, 2009
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Hi there,

First time posting and I am looking for some information regards what I can legally tow.

I have a company car which is a Peugeot 5008 with a max tow capacity of 1300kg. The gross weight of my car is 2200 Kg and as I passed my test after 1997 I can legally tow a combined weight of 3000KG, meaning the max i can tow on this point is also 1300kg. I can't change the car so need a caravan to fit, which as a family of 5 is proving tricky.

I am looking at a caravan that has an MIRO of 1120Kg and an MLTPM of 1317Kg.

My question is if I tow the caravan and put very minimal weight in it am I legal ? I know for a fact it will be under the 1300kg limit but I am unsure of whether it would go on the actual weight or the plated weights if I were to be pulled over.

i have spoke to a few dealers who have said it would be fine but 1 said it would be illegal. - seems to be a bit of a grey area.

Any help or advice would be much appreciated.

Thank you

G
A Sprite Musketeer TD is five berth. A made up double at the front a small double plus bunk at the back or single plus bunk at back. My 2013 had a weight upgrade to 1300 kg and payload of 192 kg. Only 6.5 m total length and towed well. Look in P C reviews there is one on the TD. Sold mine two months or so ago.
 
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Sep 10, 2021
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It's not a grey area at all. The answer to your question is NO - it's the sum of the maximum weights that has to be 3500 kg or under.

Many older caravans were well under 1300 kg MTPLM.
thanks - as I mentioned getting mixed messages from a few dealers. Maybe just keen to make the sale.

I had read on another post that if I was to be stopped I would need to be taken to weigh bridge in which case I would be under.
 
Sep 10, 2021
7
0
10
A Sprite Musketeer TD is five berth. A made up double at the front a small double plus bunk at the back or single plus bunk at back. My 2013 had a weight upgrade to 1300 kg and payload of 192 kg. Only 6.5 m total length and towed well. Look in P C reviews there is one on the TD. Sold mine two months or so ago.
thanks will have a look around for one of these.
 
Nov 6, 2005
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thanks - as I mentioned getting mixed messages from a few dealers. Maybe just keen to make the sale.

I had read on another post that if I was to be stopped I would need to be taken to weigh bridge in which case I would be under.
No weighing is needed when checking licence entitlement - just note the two plated weights and add them up.
 
Mar 14, 2005
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thanks - as I mentioned getting mixed messages from a few dealers. Maybe just keen to make the sale.

I had read on another post that if I was to be stopped I would need to be taken to weigh bridge in which case I would be under.
As Roger has pointed out the licence entitlement is based purely on the plated maximums for the car and caravan added together.

The licence entitlement B wording is a combined Maximum Authorised Mass not exceeding 3500kg there is no tolerance to the value so a combined value of 3501kg is the wrong side of the limit, and you would be driving without a licence, and technically without insurance as you do not have a licence for that vehicle.

The point about needing to use a weighbridge has no relevance in respect of infringement of licence entitlements, but the authorities would need to use one if they were pursuing an overload infringement. They can only prove an overload with the measurement from a calibrated weighbridge.
 
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Sep 10, 2021
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Thanks All,

Back to the drawing board I think, clearly need a van with max 1300kg.

thanks For the help and information, much appreciated.
 
Nov 11, 2009
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Thanks All,

Back to the drawing board I think, clearly need a van with max 1300kg.

thanks For the help and information, much appreciated.
Good look and let us know how you get on. Best to go for a budget model range as these often don’t take up payload with accessories that may not be essential. Don’t forget battery and mover aren’t in MIRO so come from payload as would a solar panel unless fitted as part of MIRO. It’s surprising quickly payload will be used up. I used a spreadsheet with different loading a for winter, summer, short break, long break etc. Once you’ve got a van and everything packed take it to a public weighbridge for a weight check.
 
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Mel

Mar 17, 2007
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The B+E test is to be phased out.

This autumn, any one with a B licence will be upgraded to a B+E licence by the DVLA
Really!! Beggars belief. Then what was the whole B vs B+E in aid of? 😲
Good news for newbies to Caravanning but all the poor so and so‘s who have been adding up weight combinations on their fingers for all this time must be pretty whotnotted off.
.
mel
 
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Nov 6, 2005
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Really!! Beggars belief. Then what was the whole B vs B+E in aid of? 😲
Good news for newbies to Caravanning but all the poor so and so‘s who have been adding up weight combinations on their fingers for all this time must be pretty whotnotted off.
.
mel
It's being done to free up examiners for HGV tests - a far from ideal situation.

Perhaps the British caravan industry can finally move away from confusing and/or inadequate payloads with no pressure to meet the 3500 kg limit.
 
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Nov 11, 2009
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Why not just suspend tests to BE in favour of providing tests for HGV drivers. Holders of B could just stay as they are until things come back into balance. Doing away with BE tests is tantamount to admitting they’ve not really achieved any benefit.
 
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Nov 6, 2005
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Why not just suspend tests to BE in favour of providing tests for HGV drivers. Holders of B could just stay as they are until things come back into balance. Doing away with BE tests is tantamount to admitting they’ve not really achieved any benefit.
I suspect there's politics involved - it's a way of showing that we can change ex-EU rules whenever we want now.
 
Nov 11, 2009
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I suspect there's politics involved - it's a way of showing that we can change ex-EU rules whenever we want now.
Hope that they can drive into Europe with their caravan then if they haven’t been tested for BE. EU might decide their rules remain. No test no tow above 3500kg. Interesting times.
 
Sep 10, 2021
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The B+E test is to be phased out.

This autumn, any one with a B licence will be upgraded to a B+E licence by the DVLA
I have actually just seen this online also so from a limit perspective I’d actually be ok with this combination.

however my cars tow limit is still 1300kg so with the mltpm at 1317 I would still be over, regardless of how it’s loaded if it goes on plates only.
 
Jul 18, 2017
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Why not just suspend tests to BE in favour of providing tests for HGV drivers. Holders of B could just stay as they are until things come back into balance. Doing away with BE tests is tantamount to admitting they’ve not really achieved any benefit.
Question is whether the B+E is warranted? Prior to the B+E test how accidents involved vehicles with trailers exceeding 3500kg? It may have been a negligible amount. Has the B+E made any difference to accident rate and is it of any real value?
These are questions that most of us cannot answer as we are not privy to that sort of information and we can only guess.
 
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Jan 3, 2012
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Thanks All,

Back to the drawing board I think, clearly need a van with max 1300kg.

thanks For the help and information, much appreciated.
Just look at caravans that are under the 1300kg if you putting a mover on to match with your car
 
Jul 15, 2008
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Looks like government panic to me....the shortage of HGV drivers in the UK is not new.
Previously the gaps were filled with Europeans who are now not available due to government policies.
The average age of UK HGV drivers is 56 and passing an HGV test is just the start of training for a great many highly responsible driving jobs.
 
Nov 11, 2009
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Looks like government panic to me....the shortage of HGV drivers in the UK is not new.
Previously the gaps were filled with Europeans who are now not available due to government policies.
The average age of UK HGV drivers is 56 and passing an HGV test is just the start of training for a great many highly responsible driving jobs.
I agree but other European countries are also experiencing shortages. Particularly Poland and Romania. Where have they gone to. Perhaps as you say the demographics combined with other job opportunities in their home countries.
 
Nov 6, 2005
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Hope that they can drive into Europe with their caravan then if they haven’t been tested for BE. EU might decide their rules remain. No test no tow above 3500kg. Interesting times.
Having BE on the licence is the EU requirement - how it's obtained is up to individual countries.

However an anomally will exist - those who passed their car test in/after 1997 but haven't passed the towing test will only see BE on their licence when it's renewed - although they'll be able to tow bigger outfits in the UK, it may cause issues if they go abroad with only B on their licence.
 
Mar 27, 2011
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According to DVSA site B + E will be added to licence when it’s changed so if going to EU it won’t be a problem as licences will have the EU requirements, my son in law has a car with 2 tonne towing limit and had been planning to take BE test in spring but now no need and he’s chuffed cos saves hi
 
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