Gas attack?

Mar 14, 2005
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Something that myself and Giovanni got involved in recently. Are there or are there not gas attacks on the continent? Now, I don't mean the hubby letting one off under the duvet, what I'm talking about is the use of gas to anesthetize people during sleep to facilitate robbery. having done a search on the net, there are two camps. One that has experience of this wrong doing and the other that says that it's technically impossible and as such an urban myth. So has anyone heard of such attacks or been part of one?

I note that included in the PC magazine flyer's this month is the "Amazing Outdoor" cataloge. Page 12 gives an item called the "12v narcotic gas alarm".

Smoke without fire?
 
Jun 29, 2004
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Sorry Lol but it is the same old chesnut rolled out year after year. However if one has not heard of it b4 you are only being responsible if you look into it. Yes it can happen on remote Aires ect, particularly in the South and Spain but I recon the odds are a zillion to one.

But hell what do I know.

Do not let it spoil your holiday. Be senseible and overnight on sites as apposed to laybys.

ttfn
 
May 4, 2005
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Page 27 of this months mag from C&CC shows window alarms from Milenco (milenco.com), it states "it is also designed to combat the problem of sleeping gas attacks ( there have been occurances on mainland Europe)". The CC have also in the past endorsed gas alarms stating the same reason. For the small cost involved I would buy one just in case.

Brian (",)
 
Sep 13, 2006
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Our local area chairman was in a party going to Spain last year where a couple of the motorhomes were gassed and robbed and they thought they had taken enough precautions.

Apparently you get a thumping headache in the morning as well.

I believe that using proper commercial sites for an overnighter instead of the service stop offs will reduce the chances of this happening a great deal.
 
Sep 13, 2006
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I should add that that incident took place at a service area that had security and it was believed that they either received a back hander or chose to turn a blind eye.
 
Jul 15, 2005
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Lol,

As the resident chemist / chemical engineer, it is rumoured that the narcotic gases are either an impure form of "hospital ether" or alternatively "nitrous oxide gas"

The problem is that the chemical sensors need to be specifically designed for each type of gas - for instance the household smoke detector is designed to detect smoke, and not Carbon Monoxide nor anything else.

So you need to buy the right detector for the right gas - Ether is probably more likely to be used - so buy that one if it makes you feel safer.

But the best advice is to avoid sleeping in the "wild"

Robert
 
Mar 16, 2005
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I buy practical caravan,caravan and the motorhome mag, mmm.

As i stated to LOL one of them and quite recently in the past

5 months did indeed do a article on this matter.

Not one insurance company that they got in touch with have firm

evidance of any such thing, infact some of the insurance company

had other ideas of what had really happened.

They had also looked into how much gas would need to be pumped

into a caravan to actually put people in a deep sleep, and not

actually kill them. note any reports of deaths, no and what you

fail to realise and rob jax should know is ether can be a killer.

Have you never had a operation? factors such as weight age and

respirtry problems need to be known. Too little and its more

than likely you will wake up. Too much and you may never wake

up.

So how would criminals know how to gas a caravan with an 8st

wife and a 16st husband? and apparantly the amount needed would

have to be quite large and therefore not readily available.

A new market has been made through hear say and compounded by

peoples unfounded fears.

You are far more likely to be just plainly robbed using old

fashion techniques.

You are more likely to get a puncture,lost, crash,a host of

things than being "gassed" while you sleep. think about it

top class burgulars would be robbing houses.

oppertunest and low lifes would rob you on the road and they'd

need one hell of a large gas cannister to lumber around, by no

means ideal for just a few hundred euros..
 
Mar 14, 2005
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This has all been discussed at length before, but most of the stories were third or fourth hand.

I previously made two points:

1. If putting someone under for an appropriate time is as simple as squirting some gas through a vent, then why does it take so long to train as an anaesthetist?

2. If I possessed a magic gas that allowed me to rob at will, what would I choose? A holiday caravan with perhaps a handful of passports, a camera, a mobile phone and 100 euros ... or a lorry stacked full of mobile phones, iPods, computers, household goods etc etc.

I obviously can't say for sure that it is an urban myth, but it certainly lacks credibility and there is a dearth of first-hand evidence.
 
Dec 16, 2003
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Thought you might like to read the following posted on a.n.o. site: Dear... Thank you for your enquiry. I would like to inform you that you are not the first enquirer with this question. Professor Hatch, our Clinical Advisor, has given the following previous comments: "I can give you a categorical assurance that it would not be possible to render someone unconscious with ether without their knowledge, even if they were sleeping at the time. Ether is an extremely pungent agent and a relatively weak anaesthetic by modern standards and has a very irritant affect of the air passages, causing coughing and sometimes vomiting. It takes some time to reach unconsciousness, even if given by direct application to the face on a rag, and the concentration needed by some sort of spray into a room would be enormous. The smell hangs around for days and would be obvious to anyone the next day. There are much more powerful agents around now, some of which are almost odourless. However, these would be unlikely to be able to achieve the effect you describe, and the cost would be huge enough to deter any thief unless he was after the crown jewels. The only practicable agent is probably the one used by the Russians in the Moscow siege - I advised the BBC on their programme about this. The general feeling is that they used an agent which is not available outside the KGB! Finally, unsupervised anaesthesia, which is what we are really talking about is very dangerous. In the Moscow siege about 20% of victims died from asphyxia, because their airways were unprotected. If the reports you talk about are true I would have expected a significant number of deaths or cases of serious brain damage to have been reported." I hope this information is helpful to you. Regards, Ms Shirani Nadarajah General Administrator Professional Standards Directorate The Royal College of Anaesthetists""

Taken from Practical Motorhome forum !
 
Jun 11, 2005
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Hi,

if a gas attack is likely to be sucessful, then how come our own criminal fraternity have not got around to using gas. After all the Brit criminals are not normally slow on the uptake. I reckon that you are more likley to be burgled without even knowing it happens. Best way to reduce risk is stay off of aires and use sites en route.
 

spj

Apr 5, 2006
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Hi all,

I do know a HGV owner driver who got gassed in his 4 series Scania Tractor unit at a services somewhere near Felixstowe about 5 years ago, his tv, wallet and other valubles were stolen and he woke up a number of hours later with a thumping headache, the gas used was not identified and as expected the police did very little.
 
Mar 16, 2005
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"the police did very little" I sometimes wonder what people

expect the police to do, set up road blocks?

What is becomeing clear is anyone who does claim a gas attack,

always has a thumping headache!

Its on par with aliens being little green men.
 

spj

Apr 5, 2006
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"as expected the police did very little" is what I posted, and that is what I would expect, as posted, after all what could they do?

The driver I know had no reason to lie to me, if he was fiddling an insurance claim then why tell me a story?

Maybe it happens, maybe it doesnt, but if it does I am sure it is no joke to the victims invloved.
 
May 4, 2005
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Football star and his family gassed while gang steals Mercedes

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/europe/article725541.ece
POLICE were questioning five men after burglars broke into the Riviera home of Patrick Vieira, the French football star, and used gas to keep the former Arsenal captain and his family asleep as they stole his car and other possessions.

The Juventus midfield player, who is now back in training with the French World Cup squad, realised that he had been robbed after he and Cheryl, his English wife, woke up in their house at Le Cannet, near Cannes, with bad headaches on Sunday morning. The couple and Mme Vieira's 17-year-old daughter suffered no other ill-effects.

"It is what we call a home-jacking - when there is a break-in to an inhabited home by people who want the keys to a vehicle," a Cannes police spokesman said. The 29-year-old footballer's British-registered Mercedes 4x4 was later found parked in Nice. Home-jackers, who are active on the C
 
May 4, 2005
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http://www.telegraph.co.uk/global/main.jhtml?xml=/global/2005/06/11/wcosta11.xml
Vigilante expats take on Spain's gangs

By Isambard Wilkinson in Alicante

Last Updated: 12:01am BST 11/06/2005

Britons living on the Spanish coast have formed vigilante groups to counter criminal gangs who use guns and knock-out gas to rob victims in their homes.

A series of robberies and the recent murder of a Briton have again highlighted the issue of security for many expatriates on the hundreds of miles of coastline from Marbella in the south to the east coastal region of Valencia.

Stephen Hall, 48, a telecommunications businessman who has lived in Spain for five years, was asleep at home when he was gassed and his house robbed.

advertisement"I knew nothing about it," he said. "I went to bed at 2am and woke at 7am. They had stolen jewellery, computers and mobiles phones. The usual."

George, an ex-publican who did not wish to give his surname, had been in Spain for a little over a week when he was gassed and burgled last week.

Like thousands of Britons, and other northern Europeans, he had come to Spain to live out his retirement in the sunny and relatively cheap "costas". He is now considering whether to leave.

A fortnight ago Winston Mills, 67, was shot dead in front of his wife at their villa at Gea y Truyols in Murcia in the south-east of the country. The killer was allegedly a 17-year-old who had escaped from an approved school who jumped over Mr Mills's garden fence. Mr Mills tried to chase the youth off the property but the assailant turned and shot him at point blank range in the abdomen with a 12-bore shotgun.

In another case a consular official, who did not want to give his name, described how he once woke up feeling groggy and staggered to the bathroom where he vomited before passing out.

He realised later that morning that someone had entered his home during the night and gassed him and his family before robbing them.

In reaction to the spate of crimes residents in one development near Benidorm blocked roads leading to their estate with sandbags and mounted vigilante patrols.

The costas often provide the most clement conditions for all types of criminal. The area is awash with feuding international criminal gangs, laundered dirty money and crooked local authorities feeding off a construction boom.

Wealthy retired northern Europeans seeking shangri-la in the sun provide just another source of petty cash for often savage small-time gangs.

Local mayors have promised to set up emergency task forces to cope with the crimes.

The Civil Guard has mounted Operation Insomnia and has had some success by arresting members of rapacious Albanian and Romanian gangs.

But a foreign resident pressure group, Enough is Enough, complained last week that extra police protection that was promised had not yet arrived and held a protest march demanding more security for the area.

The group's spokesman said: "They had promised that an elite Guardia Civil police unit would be deployed to the area, but in reality they were just trying to placate us."

Spanish officials and British diplomats are playing down the issue by stressing that the attacks are isolated incidents.

That view is also shared by a number of British residents who have set up neighbourhood watch schemes, often run by retired British police officers.

They reject the "Costa del Fear" epithet, saying that despite sensationalist claims in the British press of violent crime Spain is still a safer place to live than Britain. The neighbourhood watch schemes are set to take off across the entire region after their success in areas around Torrevieja.

James Herbert, a former detective who is the vice-president of one such association, said: "There has been a lot of scaremongering. OK, the Spanish police are now playing catch up as they become accustomed to the new brand of crime that has arrived with the wave of foreigners. But they are getting there."

Mr Hall, despite being the victim of a costa-style robbery agreed. "I have been beaten up at Gillingham railway station and robbed three times in four years in Manchester. There is crime everywhere. Look on your own doorstep," he said.
 

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