Gas Bottles

[MichaelE]

I have seen an adaptor to do such bad things, don't think I would go to that extreme, a bit to safety consious. BP gas lites can be bought from B & Q and if you use the Wednesday discount , deal its another 15% off, so that makes a slightly better deal.

What bad things have you seen?
Perhaps he was talking if it didnt get taken over?
B & Q have never sold BP gas?

 

[Hutch]

Sorry folks, grey brain cells, Homebase,

 

[MichaelE]

Sorry folks, grey brain cells, Homebase,

I didnt know that Homebase did discount on Wednesdays, i only thought it was B&Q who did that for pensioners?

 

[Hutch]

Maybe I have got it totally wrong, but I do get my Green Sheild Stamps there, and from Bejams.
:woohoo:
Hutch.

 

[ProfJohnL]

There is of course one other way,
Minding my 'P' & 'Q' s here
If you have the right 'tool' and you are not in the UK - viz France
then the bottle proprietor's restrictions don't come into force
and if you can find a 'helpful' garage or supplier of LPG
then, Bobs your uncle and as you may find a huge
price differential it may be worth considering doing the
same again before coming back to these shores and back into
the vice like grip of our major UK LPG supplier
(There now, no names, no pack drill so as to upset no-one !)

Hello Mike,

With Calor bottles your lease agreement puts the onus on the bottle hirer, and if a hirer attempts to get it refilled anywhere, and Calor become aware of the fact, then you have broken your contract with Calor, and they can take action against you.

Apart from the moral and legal aspect of openly breaking a contract term, There is also the good technical reason why such actions are ill founded. As the Calor bottles do not have filling gauges built into them it would all to easy for a non authorised filler to overfill them and create a very real and serious risk to anyone around them.

Dont do it and don't encourage anyone else to attempt it.

 

[Gafferbill]

There is of course one other way,
Minding my 'P' & 'Q' s here
If you have the right 'tool' and you are not in the UK - viz France
then the bottle proprietor's restrictions don't come into force
and if you can find a 'helpful' garage or supplier of LPG
then, Bobs your uncle and as you may find a huge
price differential it may be worth considering doing the
same again before coming back to these shores and back into
the vice like grip of our major UK LPG supplier
(There now, no names, no pack drill so as to upset no-one !)

Hello Mike,

With Calor bottles your lease agreement puts the onus on the bottle hirer, and if a hirer attempts to get it refilled anywhere, and Calor become aware of the fact, then you have broken your contract with Calor, and they can take action against you.

Apart from the moral and legal aspect of openly breaking a contract term, There is also the good technical reason why such actions are ill founded. As the Calor bottles do not have filling gauges built into them it would all to easy for a non authorised filler to overfill them and create a very real and serious risk to anyone around them.

Dont do it and don't encourage anyone else to attempt it.

I agree with the Prof......the practice is not worth the possible consequences.

Unfortunately due to the high cost of container LPG as compared to LPG dispensed on garage forecourts the practise is on the increase.
I was recently shown an installation on a self constructed Van to Campervan conversion .......apart from the correct vehicle LPG gas filler on the outside of the vehicle there was nothing out of the ordinary to see.
The vehicle was in fact diesel powered......the LPG was for use in the appliances and the storage cylinders were 2 by 13 kgs size from a well known cylinder supplier.
The owner of this very well converted van insisted all was perfectly safe........filling was only done when a cylinder was empty with an exact amount of litres to prevent overfilling.

I am not qualified to say whether the installation was safe .....but I do know he was probably breaking the law when attempting to fill the cylinders and as for whether he was insured for all eventualities 😱hmy:

 

[Reevco]

I always refill my gas cylinders at the petrol station and have never had a problem.

Okay before you all jump on me I have gradually moved over to Gaslow I started a few years ago with just one bottle and used this keeping a Calor lite as a spare, then a year later bought a second bottle but soon got fed up having to remove them to refill all the time so then bought the full refill kit that fits permanently to the caravan. We have just bought a new caravan this year and the dealer moved the kit over as part of the sale deal

The point I'm trying to make is yes it is pricey to move over to a refillable system but you don't have to buy it all at once, just start with a single bottle and go from there, I will be moving it over to my next van as well.

I never have to worry about leaving home with half bottles as can just pull up on route and fill up before arriving at the campsite, it lasts well as well we camped for a six week stay last year and never needed to refill. Yes it was summer so didn't need to heat the caravan but we did use the BBQ most nights and yes we had EHU but it still did the six weeks

It did cost around £8 to fill a bottle but with gas now 20p cheaper than the last time i refilled it must be around £5 or £6 now to refill them

I think manufacturers should start thinking about moving away from Calor bottles and fitting a sealed permeant systems in all new vans or at least making it an option you could have fitted if you wanted.

Calor have such a hold on the camping market but I've broken free of it..... Question is now what do I do with my 3 full bottles of Calor Lite I still have 😉 lol

 

[Hutch]

Put them on Wash . BAY ETC. If they are full someone will buy and collect.
If you were in Beds Bucks I know people who would have them.
Hutch.

 

[intransient1]

I still use my 15lt safefil which I have used since 2012.
Being disabled I needed a bottle I could still lift when full.
it fits the bill perfectly, its cheap to fill, and I only need to carry 1 cylinder.

 

[Sproket]

Yes it is expensive to purchase the re-fillable bottle, but the last time i filled it it was equivalent to £1.10p per kg of propane compared to £3.85p per kg of Calor light

When i bought my first bottle it cost approx £160.00 well if you divide the price of a Calor refill into that price it's approx 6.8 bottles or 40.8 kg of gas.

That's equivalent to four refills @ approx 10kg per time with a cost of approx £44.00 so you see there is quite a big saving to be made but only if you do your homework first.

The other thing is the light weight of the bottle & I know that there will be a safety check when it get's to it's required age, but even the cost of that will have been recouped by the amount of savings every time it's used due to the price fluctuation at the pump .

 

[ProfJohnL]

Put them on Wash . BAY ETC. If they are full someone will buy and collect.
If you were in Beds Bucks I know people who would have them.
Hutch.

You do not own Calor bottles you hire them thus you have no legal title to sell them. You can return them to your Calor dealer and provided you have the hiring agreement you will get you deposit back for them.

 

[Hutch]

I agree with the legalities,,Prof, but with Calor wanting back their hired bottles back to refill, and people not having their original forms, I have one form but have three calor lite bottles, people are not willing to give the bottles over to dealers for a slip of paper that states you may get a refilled bottle sometime in the future.
I would rather see someone sell a bottle illeagally than try to fill a calor lite illeagally .
You also do not get a full refund only a partial on an decreasing scale.
Hutch

 

[ProfJohnL]

I agree with the legalities,,Prof, but with Calor wanting back their hired bottles back to refill, and people not having their original forms, I have one form but have three calor lite bottles, people are not willing to give the bottles over to dealers for a slip of paper that states you may get a refilled bottle sometime in the future.
I would rather see someone sell a bottle illeagally than try to fill a calor lite illeagally .
You also do not get a full refund only a partial on an decreasing scale.
Hutch

I'm sorry Hutch but I cannot condone any post that suggest or implies it is acceptable to undertake an illegal transaction. Calor gas bottles are the sole property of Calor. an they are theirs only to fill.

 

[Hutch]

Ok Prof, I will fully accept your posting.
Hutch.

 

[Reevco]

They where empty till they had the recall and Calor sent them back full :lol: I will use them up in the heater I have in the garage. I normally have one of the big ones from Flowgas in the garage but this can go back now it's empty..

 

[Reevco]

Thing is, with Calor we would be really careful of how much we used, now with the much cheaper autogas we can have the heating on far more, when out leave it on low so the caravan is nice and warm to come in to, cook and BBQ away to our hearts content and know it's not costing £22 + a bottle to refill also we can just go away on a CL and not worry about EHU so another saving there as well...

I think it was a good move on our side to get a fitted system especially as we tend to use the caravan all year around, I'm happy camping anywhere so long as I can put the kettle on and put my feet up.

 

[MichaelE]

I always refill my gas cylinders at the petrol station and have never had a problem.

Okay before you all jump on me I have gradually moved over to Gaslow I started a few years ago with just one bottle and used this keeping a Calor lite as a spare, then a year later bought a second bottle but soon got fed up having to remove them to refill all the time so then bought the full refill kit that fits permanently to the caravan. We have just bought a new caravan this year and the dealer moved the kit over as part of the sale deal

The point I'm trying to make is yes it is pricey to move over to a refillable system but you don't have to buy it all at once, just start with a single bottle and go from there, I will be moving it over to my next van as well.

I never have to worry about leaving home with half bottles as can just pull up on route and fill up before arriving at the campsite, it lasts well as well we camped for a six week stay last year and never needed to refill. Yes it was summer so didn't need to heat the caravan but we did use the BBQ most nights and yes we had EHU but it still did the six weeks

It did cost around £8 to fill a bottle but with gas now 20p cheaper than the last time i refilled it must be around £5 or £6 now to refill them

I think manufacturers should start thinking about moving away from Calor bottles and fitting a sealed permeant systems in all new vans or at least making it an option you could have fitted if you wanted.

Calor have such a hold on the camping market but I've broken free of it..... Question is now what do I do with my 3 full bottles of Calor Lite I still have 😉 lol

In terms of safety i wouldn't think that a permanent gas tank surrounded by wood and plastic in a caravan would be a good idea?
If you have the system fitted if you ran out you would have to pack and drive somewhere to top up?
Im sorry to say that cylinders are for sale all the time on well known auction sites? Sometimes you get lucky and get an empty one that hasn't been recalled, so you get a full bottle too?

 

[Reevco]

I would have thought some kind of system built in by the manufacturer would be a lot safer than having cylinders, you could have bigger shaped tanks that fit in a corner somewhere with factory sealed joints the technologies there, cars have had bespoke systems fitted for years.

Yes that is a drawback of a fitted system you would have to leave site to refill, we always fill up on route and as above we have had gas left over after a six week camp so can't see this as a problem.

 

[ProfJohnL]

...
In terms of safety i wouldn't think that a permanent gas tank surrounded by wood and plastic in a caravan would be a good idea?
If you have the system fitted if you ran out you would have to pack and drive somewhere to top up?
Im sorry to say that cylinders are for sale all the time on well known auction sites? Sometimes you get lucky and get an empty one that hasn't been recalled, so you get a full bottle too?

Hello Michael,

I don't see any safety problem with a properly formed tank conforming to the required safety standards, probably safer that the individual portable cylinders. I do agree the down side is the refilling issue when on site, but if the system had a change over valve where a portable cylinder could be attached if necessary, that would resolve short term 'running out' issues.

However there would be other downsides to contend with, I'll bet such a system will have a considerable cost increase added to the caravan as bespoke tanks aren't cheap. The added weight of tank and its fitting are likely to be more than a couple of lightweight portable tanks. and here in the UK, to make it worthwhile you would need to have access to an LPG filling point. In addition the system would need to be recertified at least every ten years for compliance with pressurised fuel containment requirements.

 

[Reevco]

...
In terms of safety i wouldn't think that a permanent gas tank surrounded by wood and plastic in a caravan would be a good idea?
If you have the system fitted if you ran out you would have to pack and drive somewhere to top up?
Im sorry to say that cylinders are for sale all the time on well known auction sites? Sometimes you get lucky and get an empty one that hasn't been recalled, so you get a full bottle too?

Hello Michael,

I don't see any safety problem with a properly formed tank conforming to the required safety standards, probably safer that the individual portable cylinders. I do agree the down side is the refilling issue when on site, but if the system had a change over valve where a portable cylinder could be attached if necessary, that would resolve short term 'running out' issues.

However there would be other downsides to contend with, I'll bet such a system will have a considerable cost increase added to the caravan as bespoke tanks aren't cheap. The added weight of tank and its fitting are likely to be more than a couple of lightweight portable tanks. and here in the UK, to make it worthwhile you would need to have access to an LPG filling point. In addition the system would need to be recertified at least every ten years for compliance with pressurised fuel containment requirements.

Can't see much issue with the weight one bigger tank may well work out lighter than two cylinders and could be fitted more central reducing nose weight some cars have them running underneath along the sills similar tanks could be fitted to the inside of the caravan chassis and could run the whole length of the van you would never know they where there.

No one knows what will take on in years to come, back in the 80s when I started caravanning with my parents I could never have foreseen underfloor heating, microwaves, large fridges showers wet heating and solar panels caravan movers what will the next 20 years bring?
Slide out sides, dishwashers, washing machines, tumble driers, coffee machines, taps that give steaming hot water, bigger TVs projectors built in wifi, caravans that park and level themselves then inflate there own awnings what will get looked on as the must have standard fittings we all look on our caravans as a mini extension to our own homes that we can hitch up and just take with us and we are all shouting out for our home comforts be it just a place to put your glass down, microwave or shower.

For me now getting older it would be anything that saves on setting up and packing up time and makes setting up easier and quicker. and that includes moving around gas bottles.

 

[starlightdj]

Hi we swopped from 2 x calorlite bottle to 1 single safefill.

The safefill cost me £140 holds 13kg of lpg compared to a calorlite at 6kgs.

Our calor centre now wants £23.50 to fill the calorlite but I can fill the safefill for under £10 or 59p per litre at our local garage. Big savings

I have long since lost the original receipts for the calorlites so I sold an empty one on a caravan site for £25, the other one is full as I swopped it during the recall & sitting in my garage, will take it with me next time im out & sell that one as well as I've gone a year carrying it around just in case lol.

Use the van for rallying so use a lot of gas so it made sense for me to change, plus I like the fact you can always see the level inside, so easy to gauge when to refill.

The bottle is very safe, it doesn't have to be empty so you never run out of gas & when you refill it auto cuts off at about 85% so you cant overfill.

Hope this helps
Cheers
John

 

[Reevco]

For someone just starting out buy a bottle don't rent by the time you have had a calor bottle 5 years or so you won't get much of your deposit back anyway

 

[ProfJohnL]

For someone just starting out buy a bottle don't rent by the time you have had a calor bottle 5 years or so you won't get much of your deposit back anyway

See
https://www.calor.co.uk/gas-bottles/buying-gas-bottles/gas-refills-exchanges-returns

 

[Dustydog]

For someone just starting out buy a bottle don't rent by the time you have had a calor bottle 5 years or so you won't get much of your deposit back anyway

See
https://www.calor.co.uk/gas-bottles/buying-gas-bottles/gas-refills-exchanges-returns

I own up and admit I have never ever "rented" a Calor gas cylinder.
The originals came foc from the local waste dump. Got exchanged for refilled ones and so on over the years.I am not alone doing this. 😉

 

[Hutch]

No Dusty you are not alone, Calor are possibly at fault with their system where bye if you have a contract with them, you should then get an electronic card stating you have a contract. As far as they are concerned you give a dealer a bottle they give you one back.
Looking recently at Calors website on lites , saying they have 100,000 bottles for the new season. I can see , some folk "borrowing" botles from each other on Wash bay , giving them in and getting chitties for full bottles, if they ever come back on the market.