Green Toilet Fluids

[Gozza2]

These are the rules on this site
Customers are only permitted Green Organic Environmentally Friendly Toilet Fluids
We no longer permit the use ,or on-site disposal ,of Pink & toxic formaldehyde -based blue chemicals

This is exactly why I said that if I was that interested in staying on that site, I'd call them in advance to check exactly what their requirements were. Because based on the second line of the rule, it seems like my formaldehyde-free blue chemical would be accepted, and that the "Green" in the first line refers to the environmental credentials of the product rather than its colour.

But as the site have specified what they allow, using one word ("Green") that has more than one meaning in common use, and another word ("organic") that has no legally-supportable definition in this context, only the site can tell us what they really mean.

Either way, the new information - that my caravan is going to be searched, and the contents of my bottom tank tested, on arrival - means I'm not going there, whatever the rules.

 

[otherclive]

Yes, but to a chemist "organic" means a chemical with carbon in the molecule, e.g.



Outside of the food industry, as far as I know there is no legally-supported definition of the word "organic", other than the chemist's one above.

So, get some formaldehyde-based loo chemical, dye it green, and you seem to have exactly what this site are asking for - despite formaldehyde being almost certainly what they're looking to avoid.

I'm not having a crack at Beachball, I know he's only passing on someone else's requirements, but as I said a couple of posts above this is exactly the sort of thing I come across often in my working life, with someone making specifications or requirements based on what some bloke told them down the pub, or on a common, rather than a technical, understanding of a word.

Specifying that a green-coloured chemical is better than a different substance, chemically identical but with a different dye and with different words on the label, is exactly the kind of thing that I couldn't be bothered with in my leisure time, and would make me choose to go elsewhere.

Organic as an adjective in chemistry does include the element carbon, but the word has a wider definition according to the Cambridge English dictionary.

 

[Beachball]

Yes, but to a chemist "organic" means a chemical with carbon in the molecule, e.g.



Outside of the food industry, as far as I know there is no legally-supported definition of the word "organic", other than the chemist's one above.

So, get some formaldehyde-based loo chemical, dye it green, and you seem to have exactly what this site are asking for - despite formaldehyde being almost certainly what they're looking to avoid.

I'm not having a crack at Beachball, I know he's only passing on someone else's requirements, but as I said a couple of posts above this is exactly the sort of thing I come across often in my working life, with someone making specifications or requirements based on what some bloke told them down the pub, or on a common, rather than a technical, understanding of a word.

Specifying that a green-coloured chemical is better than a different substance, chemically identical but with a different dye and with different words on the label, is exactly the kind of thing that I couldn't be bothered with in my leisure time, and would make me choose to go elsewhere.

That was from there site with the Rules I followed it word for word
That the last comment

 

[otherclive]

Beachball I’ve got an idea for a odour free organic non carbon containing fluid. H2O.
🚾 Back to the days of Sir Thomas and his water closet. 😂

 

[audiorob]

Aldi currently has stocks of blue pink and green. I have been using the pink in the top flush tank for several seasons, but after cleaning out black bits last autumn and this spring, treating with a Milton dilution, I am going to try a different make. A 'top and tail' version would suit as one less thing to carry!

 

[JezzerB]

Camper life are eco friendly and the business for us in terms of smells. You get a choice.

 

[Gagakev]

Wow that was some response, thanks folks.
I currently have Elsan blue and a BIO Blue in a green bottle so not sure
what it says on the label of the BIO one so will check that bit out.

Site I'm on allows both, they have separate disposal points but did comment it is more expensive to dispose of the blue. Think they must have septic holding tanks and not connected to the mains.

 

[Hutch]

Wow that was some response, thanks folks.
I currently have Elsan blue and a BIO Blue in a green bottle so not sure
what it says on the label of the BIO one so will check that bit out.

Site I'm on allows both, they have separate disposal points but did comment it is more expensive to dispose of the blue. Think they must have septic holding tanks and not connected to the mains.

Thats confused the hell out of me, . I will stay at Woodovis, when we visit.

 

[Beachball]

Thats confused the hell out of me, . I will stay at Woodovis, when we visit.

Looks like a nice site enjoy your visit when you see kev

 

[Beachball]

Camper life are eco friendly and the business for us in terms of smells. You get a choice.

I am in agreement with you

 

[CustardAvenger]

I've been using the One Chem product for a couple of years, it isn't labelled "organic" or coloured green, but it IS formaldehyde-free, which I think is what these sites actually want (to make it safe for septic tanks). It's sold as OK for both tanks and I use it that way, no black bits or problems that I've noticed.

That's exactly it: "Formaldehyde-Free" is the operative wording. Green/Organic/Bio colouring and labelling is just to visually differentiate from the regular "Blue" or Formaldehyde-based products.

Personally, I prefer to use the "Green" stuff (Elsan 'Organic', which just happens to be green) as it is more pleasant to handle when refilling the cassette. So despite only staying on one site which mandated its use, I've switched to using it full-time; the remainder of my 'Blue' being used as an end-of-season cassette flush.

Elsan Organic is also suitable for the flush-tank, but I just use plain water.

 

[Beachball]

That's exactly it: "Formaldehyde-Free" is the operative wording. Green/Organic/Bio colouring and labelling is just to visually differentiate from the regular "Blue" or Formaldehyde-based products.

Personally, I prefer to use the "Green" stuff (Elsan 'Organic', which just happens to be green) as it is more pleasant to handle when refilling the cassette. So despite only staying on one site which mandated its use, I've switched to using it full-time; the remainder of my 'Blue' being used as an end-of-season cassette flush.

Elsan Organic is also suitable for the flush-tank, but I just use plain water.

I also got this in the caravan (Elsan Organic ) that is what i was using at that site

 

[chatter]

So now realising i have to buy this stuff which one has the least aroma or more pleasent aroma, and why blue or green in the receiving cassette but a pink in the water tank - what purpose does the pink have? and it seems that the pink seems to cause black bits - why?
The last time i caravanned they had portapotties in, and you put blue in the bottom and just water in the top part

 

[Gozza2]

Some people put a chemical in the top tank, others as you say just use plain water, so that option is still open. I think the fluid is meant to make the flush do a better job of cleaning the toilet bowl but I don't really know.

The older blue chemical that you remember had formaldehyde in it, which can't be used in newer bio-waste treatment systems, which some caravan sites have: Instead of just filling a septic tank up with whatever comes out of your caravan loo and waiting for a big lorry to take it away, they use bacteria to start breaking the matter down, and the formaldehyde would kill the bacteria.

Some blue chemicals these days (like the One-Chem I mentioned near the top of this thread) are formaldehyde-free and are safe to use with these newer treatment systems, but two things you can be sure of (as far as I know) are:
1) Any bottom tank chemical coloured green will be formaldehyde free
2) Any bottom tank chemical with formaldehyde will be blue.

If you're only going to go to sites which allow formaldehyde chemicals then it's up to you what you use of course, but the lifetime of a bottle of chemical is fairly long (for me anyway!) and I doubt you know which sites you'll be staying at over that time period. For me it makes sense to settle on formaldehyde free which can be used anywhere.

You don't need two different chemicals - the One-Chem that I use (and some other chemicals) can be used in the bottom tank, and at a weaker dilution in the top, so you only have one bottle to carry. Also since I've been using One-Chem I've never had a problem with black bits in the top tank, but some people who use pink don't have that either, and as far as I know the jury is still out on exactly what it is about the pink that causes it.

As for which has the least offensive odour, I doubt you'll get much consensus on that as everyone has different favourites: All I can say is that Mrs Gozza's hyper-sensitive nostrils have no problem with the One-Chem.

 

[otherclive]

Some people put a chemical in the top tank, others as you say just use plain water, so that option is still open. I think the fluid is meant to make the flush do a better job of cleaning the toilet bowl but I don't really know.

The older blue chemical that you remember had formaldehyde in it, which can't be used in newer bio-waste treatment systems, which some caravan sites have: Instead of just filling a septic tank up with whatever comes out of your caravan loo and waiting for a big lorry to take it away, they use bacteria to start breaking the matter down, and the formaldehyde would kill the bacteria.

Some blue chemicals these days (like the One-Chem I mentioned near the top of this thread) are formaldehyde-free and are safe to use with these newer treatment systems, but two things you can be sure of (as far as I know) are:
1) Any bottom tank chemical coloured green will be formaldehyde free
2) Any bottom tank chemical with formaldehyde will be blue.

If you're only going to go to sites which allow formaldehyde chemicals then it's up to you what you use of course, but the lifetime of a bottle of chemical is fairly long (for me anyway!) and I doubt you know which sites you'll be staying at over that time period. For me it makes sense to settle on formaldehyde free which can be used anywhere.

You don't need two different chemicals - the One-Chem that I use (and some other chemicals) can be used in the bottom tank, and at a weaker dilution in the top, so you only have one bottle to carry. Also since I've been using One-Chem I've never had a problem with black bits in the top tank, but some people who use pink don't have that either, and as far as I know the jury is still out on exactly what it is about the pink that causes it.

As for which has the least offensive odour, I doubt you'll get much consensus on that as everyone has different favourites: All I can say is that Mrs Gozza's hyper-sensitive nostrils have no problem with the One-Chem.

Plus 1for One Chem. As regards smell I think its all a matter of taste, or if you've got Covid no smell.

 

[Kevin M]

I’ve just ordered some Elsan Organic so will see how that works. Got to be more convenient carrying and using the one fluid for flush and waste tank.

Kev

 

[JezzerB]

Try camper life. It's formaldehyde free and you get a choice of smells that really do smell good. We're on forest fruits at the mo.

 

[Hutch]

I have alway used Elsen Double Blue, and Elsen Pink, and when in the height of our touring carried a litre of Thetford Green as a just in case. I have only come across one site that specified Green only. But maybe things have change over the last couple of years.

 

[Gagakev]

Try camper life. It's formaldehyde free and you get a choice of smells that really do smell good. We're on forest fruits at the mo.

You smelling it or drinking it!!!!!!!! 😝

Looking at trying the summer rose one, thanks JezzerB.

 

[chatter]

ive sent for the lavender and lemongrass one
maggie

 

[JezzerB]

Just take care as the blue in it can stain badly. Don't spill it.or keep it in the van.

 

[Beachball]

I’ve just ordered some Elsan Organic so will see how that works. Got to be more convenient carrying and using the one fluid for flush and waste tank.

Kev

Hi Kev I hope it works for you

 

[Beachball]

Try camper life. It's formaldehyde free and you get a choice of smells that really do smell good. We're on forest fruits at the mo.

We have camper life in stock only trying it out but on requested sites we use green organic only

 

[RogerL]

"Green" and "Organic" are a marketing executive's heaven as there's no universally agreed standard definition.

Formaldehyde is harmful to humans, causing Cancer, and animals as well as affecting the processes involved in septic tank sewage systems - it should be avoided, it's been banned in some countries and removed from most toilet fluid formulations for some years - after that, any restrictions are just virtue positioning with no meaningful effect on the environment.

As for sites actually checking the fluid in your caravan, how do they check those, like me, who transfer the fluid out of a tall branded container into a short unbranded container so as to fit in my side locker?

 

[JezzerB]

Often had the same thought myself about checking Roger- and totally correct re formaldehyde-when i think back about my student years at Hull and the amount of stuff we played with that is now hazardous or banned-mmm!