Moved from General to correct section of the Forum!
Pat
I spy with my little eye........ Replay to topic
17 Aug 2007 12:18 PM
Hello all,
We have recently returned from Cornwall and in both directions we noticed a decline in 4x4s towing caravans.Estate cars seem to be making a comeback.
Has anyone else noticed ?
Pat
Colinn Replay to topic
17 Aug 2007 12:31 PM ...oh dear, i spy someone sparking the 'death of the 4x4' debate again...ho hum...
Comment
Pat Replay to topic
17 Aug 2007 12:38 PM Hi Colinn,
It was just an observation.Unfortunately I was forced to sell my own 4x4 because I changed job and was given a company car.My frontera sport was a brilliant towcar.
Pat
Comment
Danny Replay to topic
17 Aug 2007 12:52 PM We are off to Cornwall tomorrow towing with our Sorento and our friends will be towing with their Ford Ranger, so thats two more on the road that should up the averages a bit !
Comment
Keith Replay to topic
17 Aug 2007 01:12 PM I was travelling on the bus between Tiverton and London on Monday morning this week.
First thing I noticed was the enormous number of caravans heading south on the M5 towards Devon and Cornwall.
Sad I know, but I started to count the number of cars pulling vans versus 4x4s.
Got fed up after a while, but went up to 100, and the final score was........ Cars - 63 4x4s - 37.
Not scientific, but I was surprised at those totals, given the amount of space the mags give to big tugs.
Keith
Norwich
Comment
Colinn Replay to topic
17 Aug 2007 01:31 PM I theorised on this Forum some time ago that the punitive measures levelled against big cars (including 4x4s) would cause the decline of the 4x4. I didn't say I supported it; I said it would inevitably happen.
The suggestion sparked a torrent of counter argument, of owner justification, and claims that it would never happen as the manufacturers are making more and more of them and they could not possibly get it wrong (!).
But if many owners (in cities, say) are priced out (or choose to drive something cheaper), they will sell. Many people selling causes a glut in the market. The market has few buyers for aforesaid reasons. That leads to massive depreciation. All of which adds up to a very significant decline in ownership.
I've no idea whether this is actually starting to happen already. But maybe, from your observations, it is....
Comment
Chrissylizzie Replay to topic
17 Aug 2007 02:11 PM We recently travelled to Edinburgh and back and I too was observing how many cars were towing as opposed to 4 x 4's. I didn't actually count, but there were definitely more cars.
Comment
Oldfogey Replay to topic
17 Aug 2007 03:35 PM I believe that the majority of big estates fall into exactly the same "high pollution" tax category as the big 4x4.
If people are moving from a big 4x4 to a big estate, then it is not for road tax reasons - more likely that the fad for the 4x4 has faded.
For those who would like one regardless of the fashion, and are happy not to buy new, this is good news - secondhand prices are down.
Comment
Garfield Replay to topic
17 Aug 2007 03:57 PM We have been on two caravan rallies this year and 4x4s outnumbered cars, about 25 4x4s and 5 cars/mpvs. Yes the big estates do use as much fuel as a big 4x4 if you compare a petrol estate to a diesel 4x4, our MPV would count as a big estate and you would be looking at a lwb shogun to match it for interior space yet it still averages 45mpg solo and mid 50s mpg on a run, even the little Honda CRV can not match that.
If you only do commercial sites then you are rarely going to need 4wd but it can be very useful on rallies!!!
Comment
Rioja Replay to topic
17 Aug 2007 03:59 PM For me it's a simple choice of fuel economy and performance. The Passat I drive does about 30 MPG towing. Most 4x4's are way down on that.
Solo I get 50 MPG and a better drive to my liking.
I am convinced the majority of 4x4 drivers choose to do so primarily for reasons other than towing, except in the cases were a very large caravan or horse trailer is to be towed.
Comment
Pat Replay to topic
17 Aug 2007 04:55 PM
When I sold my 4x4 ( the frontera )last year I had to sell at a vastly reduced price.It was in excellent condition with many extras ,but sadly the market dropped.
I now tow with a Megane Sport Tourer 1.9dci which I must admit is a brilliant towcar.I will need to change next year and I may have the chance of a new Passat 1.9 diesel.
Pat
Comment
Pat
I spy with my little eye........ Replay to topic
17 Aug 2007 12:18 PM
Hello all,
We have recently returned from Cornwall and in both directions we noticed a decline in 4x4s towing caravans.Estate cars seem to be making a comeback.
Has anyone else noticed ?
Pat
Colinn Replay to topic
17 Aug 2007 12:31 PM ...oh dear, i spy someone sparking the 'death of the 4x4' debate again...ho hum...
Comment
Pat Replay to topic
17 Aug 2007 12:38 PM Hi Colinn,
It was just an observation.Unfortunately I was forced to sell my own 4x4 because I changed job and was given a company car.My frontera sport was a brilliant towcar.
Pat
Comment
Danny Replay to topic
17 Aug 2007 12:52 PM We are off to Cornwall tomorrow towing with our Sorento and our friends will be towing with their Ford Ranger, so thats two more on the road that should up the averages a bit !
Comment
Keith Replay to topic
17 Aug 2007 01:12 PM I was travelling on the bus between Tiverton and London on Monday morning this week.
First thing I noticed was the enormous number of caravans heading south on the M5 towards Devon and Cornwall.
Sad I know, but I started to count the number of cars pulling vans versus 4x4s.
Got fed up after a while, but went up to 100, and the final score was........ Cars - 63 4x4s - 37.
Not scientific, but I was surprised at those totals, given the amount of space the mags give to big tugs.
Keith
Norwich
Comment
Colinn Replay to topic
17 Aug 2007 01:31 PM I theorised on this Forum some time ago that the punitive measures levelled against big cars (including 4x4s) would cause the decline of the 4x4. I didn't say I supported it; I said it would inevitably happen.
The suggestion sparked a torrent of counter argument, of owner justification, and claims that it would never happen as the manufacturers are making more and more of them and they could not possibly get it wrong (!).
But if many owners (in cities, say) are priced out (or choose to drive something cheaper), they will sell. Many people selling causes a glut in the market. The market has few buyers for aforesaid reasons. That leads to massive depreciation. All of which adds up to a very significant decline in ownership.
I've no idea whether this is actually starting to happen already. But maybe, from your observations, it is....
Comment
Chrissylizzie Replay to topic
17 Aug 2007 02:11 PM We recently travelled to Edinburgh and back and I too was observing how many cars were towing as opposed to 4 x 4's. I didn't actually count, but there were definitely more cars.
Comment
Oldfogey Replay to topic
17 Aug 2007 03:35 PM I believe that the majority of big estates fall into exactly the same "high pollution" tax category as the big 4x4.
If people are moving from a big 4x4 to a big estate, then it is not for road tax reasons - more likely that the fad for the 4x4 has faded.
For those who would like one regardless of the fashion, and are happy not to buy new, this is good news - secondhand prices are down.
Comment
Garfield Replay to topic
17 Aug 2007 03:57 PM We have been on two caravan rallies this year and 4x4s outnumbered cars, about 25 4x4s and 5 cars/mpvs. Yes the big estates do use as much fuel as a big 4x4 if you compare a petrol estate to a diesel 4x4, our MPV would count as a big estate and you would be looking at a lwb shogun to match it for interior space yet it still averages 45mpg solo and mid 50s mpg on a run, even the little Honda CRV can not match that.
If you only do commercial sites then you are rarely going to need 4wd but it can be very useful on rallies!!!
Comment
Rioja Replay to topic
17 Aug 2007 03:59 PM For me it's a simple choice of fuel economy and performance. The Passat I drive does about 30 MPG towing. Most 4x4's are way down on that.
Solo I get 50 MPG and a better drive to my liking.
I am convinced the majority of 4x4 drivers choose to do so primarily for reasons other than towing, except in the cases were a very large caravan or horse trailer is to be towed.
Comment
Pat Replay to topic
17 Aug 2007 04:55 PM
When I sold my 4x4 ( the frontera )last year I had to sell at a vastly reduced price.It was in excellent condition with many extras ,but sadly the market dropped.
I now tow with a Megane Sport Tourer 1.9dci which I must admit is a brilliant towcar.I will need to change next year and I may have the chance of a new Passat 1.9 diesel.
Pat
Comment
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