Max towing weight **MUST** be more than MTPLM - discuss?

[Lutz]

Unfortunately, there is no requirement for car manufacturers to provide details of the kerbweight of each vehicle as it leaves the production line and published figures in handbooks, brochures, etc., can only serve as a guideline.

In borderline cases, like the one you are referring to, this can make it difficult to work out whether a category 'B' licence is adequate, strictly according to the word of the law, or not. On the other hand, I have yet to come across a car with a kerbweight which was not heavier than the manufacturer's published data so I would say you'd be pretty safe in assuming that the actual kerbweight will be over 1000kg.

However, this still leaves an open question: What source of information on kerbweights do the authorities go by when determining whether a 'B' licence is adequate or a 'B&E' is required? As accurate information is not provided to the customer in any form, this is an issue worth taking up with the DVLA (or, in your case, the French equivalent). I have a feeling that it was overlooked by the technocrats in Brussels when then respective Directive governing EU driving licence categories was written.

 

[Lutz]

Quite right, Chris.

Unfortunately, it's not only the police that don't always appear to be correctly informed but also the writers of car handbooks are using misleading terms. The term 'maximum braked trailer weight' suggests that the total weight of the trailer is implied whereas the regulations very clearly refer to the axle weights only when towing limits are specified.

The confusion arises because for the purpose of the regulations, the noseweight is not considered as part of the braked trailer weight but as part of the braked weight of the towing vehicle.

ps: The brakes act on the axle, so it is only the load that the axle is subjected to that counts as braked weight. The noseweight acts on the rear axle of the the car. That is why it is treated as part of the braked weight of the car.

 

[Steve L]

I'm afraid Lutz, the average policeman is not a rocket scientist and they vary between weighing the car with the van hitched or unhitched to varify the gross weight of the tow car. This is also dependant upon wether or not the weigh bridge is level with the surrounding yard or if it is stood above it. (often by around 400mm).

I have been pulled over a few times and both coupled and uncoupled methods hev been used.

Just to illustrate how confused they get I can recall an occassion about 20 years ago. I was driving my company's transit pick up loaded with brass swarf which I was delivering to a brass mill in Aldridge (Mc Kechnie metals, when I was stopped by a motor cycle cop as I exited Jcn 10 M6, he advised that he thought I was over weight and instructed me to follow him to the testing site.

Now I knew I was well over weight by about 680Kgs as we'd weighed the truck the day before on loading the swarf as it is an expensive comodity (

 

[Lutz]

Same applies on the other side of the Channel, too, Steve. We were taking our caravan to Ireland and got stopped on the border between Germany and Belgium. They asked us to drive over a set of scales to measure the (axle) weight of the van. They recorded 1430kg. Then they asked me how high my noseweight was. I said 75kg, so they subtracted the 75kg from the 1430kg to arrive at 1355kg which would have been barely on the limit allowing for margin of error (the car was rated at 1300kg).

Trouble was, they should have used the 1430kg figure to check the towload without subtracting anything and, besides, the caravan only had an MTPLM of 1300kg and to check that, they would even have had to add the 75kg on top of the 1430kg.

However, they let me go. I was off as quick as a flash before they could have realised their arithmetical error.

 

[JamesFrance]

Lutz, thankyou for the advice, I won't worry about it then.

It must be hard for anyone to weigh the ex works figure, presumably they would have to drain the fuel tank and wash any mud off the bottom.

For some reason France is ignoring the EU requirement that a B + E should be in the same medical category as B only and they have instead put it with the Cs and Ds.

 

[Lutz]

Lutz, thankyou for the advice, I won't worry about it then.

It must be hard for anyone to weigh the ex works figure, presumably they would have to drain the fuel tank and wash any mud off the bottom.

For some reason France is ignoring the EU requirement that a B + E should be in the same medical category as B only and they have instead put it with the Cs and Ds.

Not drain the fuel tank, James, but top it up to 90% of its capacity. I can't see the police forking out the money for a fill up of a near-empty tank before weighing the car. But you're right about the mud. Also, they'd have to ask you to remove everything that wasn't fitted to the car ex-works and that could include the towbar, for example. In view of the fact that some towbars weigh around 40kg, that's not an insubstantial amount.