Motorhome as a towcar

[RogerL]

FPT are not relieing on exsiting VM designs.A new 3 litre diesel is underway,which even mercedes are fitting.
As Jonny says,without Fiat there would be nothing.By the way the insignia comes with the 1956 jtd,not 1910.

The new 3.0 V6 VM Motori diesel is just that, a VM Motori engine - damn good one too by all accounts. It's being fitted by Chrysler, not Mercedes-Benz as that alliance has ended because Chrysler is now owned by Fiat - the VM Motori engine is also going into Fiat/Iveco trucks.
Opel/Vauxhall simply wouldn't have survived without access to the Fiat diesels, there's no doubting that - but they're a generation old now and Opel/Vauxhall have moved on just as Fiat have moved on - but separately.
It was the Chevrolet part of GM that was using old VM Motori designs, perversely still built under licence by Hyundai despite Hyundai no longer using them - but now neing replaced with the new generation of GM diesels which owe nothing to Fiat.

 

[RogerL]

Surfer your choice,i find ignorance bliss.

The new engine's the best thing about the Grand Cherokee !

 

[seth1]

There is no such thing as VM anymore,it is now FPT or part of FPT.I think FPT has something like 11 factorys world wide,so yes they do know a little bit about compression ignition engines.The 3litre is a development from the FPT group.The takeover of VM can only be seen as good as VM produced resonable engines and had some clever ideas.Single heads on small engines being one of them.Rodger how do you deam fiat as being a generation behind?The original 1910cc jtd stretched to euro4,the 1956 jtd supercedes it.Im a bit lost by what you mean.

 

[RogerL]

This isn't really the thread to have a detailed technical discussion of the origins of engines - the car industry goes in and out of alliances with great frequency and the origin of engines gets complicated because of licencing arrangements, alliance termination rights and general incestuousness. Check out which Korean manufacturer designed the engine that Mitsubishi subsequently used as the basis for their legendary Evo units.
GM Europe have been starved of investment by GM Detroit for decades and haven't UNTIL NOW, developed their own comprehensive ranges of diesel engines but had to rely on a number of outside suppliers to supplement their own cash-strapped developments.
The Fiat-derived 1.9 JTD engines used by Opel/Vauxhall under the GM-Fiat Powertrain alliance were respectable engines but are outdated NOW in economy and emissions terms. Fiat are bringing in new versions for Fiat/Alfa/Lancia/Chrysler models but having ended the Fiat-GM Alliance, GM Europe are starting to roll out their own all-aluminium diesels starting with the new 1.6 CDTi to replace the 1.7 and 1.9 (120) units and this all-new range will be expanded as fast as practical. These new engines will also be used by Chevrolet's Korean-built models as well as driving GM's marketing of diesels in the US domestic market.
Until 2013 one of the mysteries of life was that neither Ford nor GM, two of the world's biggest car makers, had decent ranges of diesel engines, needing to rely on smaller makers like Fiat and Peugeot to supply them. GM Europe are in the process of changing that.

 

[seth1]

I fully understand what your saying Rodger.But the facts your saying are incorrect.The 1.9 jtd(1910) was ended at least 3 years ago.Since then its been replaced with a 2litre jtd(1956).The insignia was never made with the 1.9jtd fitted.I still dont understand how these can be seen as a generation behind.Where emissions come into it,as for every manufacturer is down to mapping.What i will say for Fiat is they are very conservative on power outputs,ie if its advetised at 120hp that is all it will make and no more.But i,d rather have that than VAGS idea of selling them at 170hp and "derating"them to 140hp on the first service because of dpf issues.

 

[Surfer]

Surfer your choice,i find ignorance bliss.

Previous experience with Fiats tells me to avoid anything Fiat. Luckily my experience is based on fact and and a low bank balance so ignorance is bliss.

 

[otherclive]

Don't leave us in suspense , what are the facts then?

 

[RogerL]

GM has developed completely new ranges of diesels to replace the engines previously externally-sourced from Isuzu, VM Motori, Fiat and their own cash-strapped developments as well as new ranges of petrol engines to replace the ever-green Family1 and Family 2 Ecotecs. The fact that they've used so many different suppliers over the last couple of decades can legitimately be described as a "hotch-potch", in my opinion. These engines are starting to be rolled into production and the hotch-potch supply arrangements ended as soon as practical. As a long-standing fan of GM, I applaud this move.
As owners of Chrysler and Jeep, Fiat are developing the next Jeep SUV which will also have an Alfa version but this development has been seriously delayed because of difficulties in implementing the takeover arrangement at the highest level.

 

[JonnyG]

GM has developed completely new ranges of diesels to replace the engines previously externally-sourced from Isuzu, VM Motori, Fiat and their own cash-strapped developments as well as new ranges of petrol engines to replace the ever-green Family1 and Family 2 Ecotecs. The fact that they've used so many different suppliers over the last couple of decades can legitimately be described as a "hotch-potch", in my opinion. These engines are starting to be rolled into production and the hotch-potch supply arrangements ended as soon as practical. As a long-standing fan of GM, I applaud this move.
As owners of Chrysler and Jeep, Fiat are developing the next Jeep SUV which will also have an Alfa version but this development has been seriously delayed because of difficulties in implementing the takeover arrangement at the highest level.

roger i am not sure i understand where you are setting your Zero year? for your earlier remarks? Fiat diesel engines keep winning international awards every time they bring them out.. JTD..Mjet..ect ect....in real world test check out honest john mpg tables, there diesels mpg and therefore CO, are always nearer the mark than the new super xyz that supposedly does 200mpg!
your statement for me was unwise, as when fiat/gm engines were fitted to GMs back in 2003 they were as advance as you could have, around 2007 GM developed with sabb the new 2.0d again as good as anything in terms of performance fuel economy..... your statement please read it again read like GM hadnt had a decent diesel engine in there cars ever! and frankly tmade out like Fiat were tractor units! and trailing the norm! yet throughout the CR period 1997 onwards theve been trend setters over and over again!

 

[JonnyG]

Anything made by Fiat I would find very suspect and this feeling is based on previous experience. As much as we would love a new Jeep Grand Cherokee if we had the money as it now has the Fiat based engine we would avoid it like the plague.

Yep it has already been said ignorance is bliss.exactly which Fiat diesel have you owed that was such a problem,err and lets stick to CR [common rail] had more Fiat/alfa/diesels strenghing back to 87! thats my experience...

 

[seth1]

Well i just hope the latest GM diesels are better than the DTI series,and of course the "hotch-potch" of engines that have served me and my business for so long.There is not a single thing were GM have moved the game to a different level.They follow in the footsteps of the great Lingotto.I expect we,l see a great advance on the CR fuel system,maybe two turbos,maybe even camless valve actuation.No thats all left to Fiat,because their the daddys.and thats from a man whose spent his whole life around Cummins engines,which take some beating trust me.

 

[Mikaroony]

Why do we not see mortorhomes towing caravans

 

[otherclive]

Welcome back, isnt this a bit deja vu? We do see motorhomes towing caravans, not that many I grant you, but why would most motorhome users want to tow a caravan anyway? It's on a par with towing your caravan to a holiday cottage.

 

[DeliDave_]

Wellhouse leisure convert the Hyundai i800 into a camper and it is something I have thought seriously about as the conversion keeps the roof below 2 meters,its economical(relatively) and is good for popping offsite to beach etc with fridge and oven,getting changed and even a portaloo which can be useful in these days of council cutbacks.It tows 2300kg and using a standard i800 I know it is capable towcar.As stated you would have to have the B+E to tow almost anything as they are heavy but this doesnt seem to be a problem.There is also lots of room for guinea pigs to travel in as it is airconditioned .

 

[Lutz]

I guess it's only a matter of time before some enterprising manufacturer will come up with a design of motorhome towing a caravan with a direct walk-through connection between the two, rather like a bendy-bus.

 

[Mikaroony]

How much does the well house cost

 

[DeliDave_]

http://www.wellhouseleisure.com/hyundai/specs-prices/
hope this helps

 

[Mikaroony]

Thanks deli dave