No battery

[Wendy-Norfolk]

Hello Wendy,

With reference to your response to my earlier comment,

My comment was just that, a comment. It was an observation, much as your own, I perceive that your own comment was not constructive either.

My comment was based on the principal that there was no battery on board, which had been established in the main reply.

You certainly do have more options if a battery is on board, but even without one, you may still be better of than at home, so my my comment is still valid.

If you want a constructive discussion, then consider the following:-

A power cut at home:-

Central heating wont work.

Your fridge wont work.

Your lights wont work.

If you have an electric cooker your stumped, but with gas you can still use a match to light a ring

A power cut in your caravan:-

You have the gas convection side to the heater.

You can't start your fridge, but if it is already running on gas, it will keep going.

Your lights wont work, but most caravanners have at least one torch close to hand.

You only have gas cookers, and they can be lit with a match.

In practice power cuts are not that frequent, and it is quite rare for there to be long term power loss.

In both cases you may have access to a generator, or in the case of a caravan you can use inverters to fitted to your car which will produce 230V, but not in the same quantity as an mains hook up, or hook you caravan up to the cars12V system and at least have some lights working.

So I repeat that a power cut in a caravan is no worse than at home, and in fact it may be easier to cope.

That's your opinion John L, and you are entitled to it!

At least in a power cut at home, for the duration, I can move into my caravan, complete with battery!!

ETTO

 

[ProfJohnL]

Hello Wendy,

With reference to your response to my earlier comment,

My comment was just that, a comment. It was an observation, much as your own, I perceive that your own comment was not constructive either.

My comment was based on the principal that there was no battery on board, which had been established in the main reply.

You certainly do have more options if a battery is on board, but even without one, you may still be better of than at home, so my my comment is still valid.

If you want a constructive discussion, then consider the following:-

A power cut at home:-

Central heating wont work.

Your fridge wont work.

Your lights wont work.

If you have an electric cooker your stumped, but with gas you can still use a match to light a ring

A power cut in your caravan:-

You have the gas convection side to the heater.

You can't start your fridge, but if it is already running on gas, it will keep going.

Your lights wont work, but most caravanners have at least one torch close to hand.

You only have gas cookers, and they can be lit with a match.

In practice power cuts are not that frequent, and it is quite rare for there to be long term power loss.

In both cases you may have access to a generator, or in the case of a caravan you can use inverters to fitted to your car which will produce 230V, but not in the same quantity as an mains hook up, or hook you caravan up to the cars12V system and at least have some lights working.

So I repeat that a power cut in a caravan is no worse than at home, and in fact it may be easier to cope.

Hi Wendy,

Yes of course you can, and I agree with you, but the point under discussion was that caravan did not have a battery, and under those circumstances I believe my contention has merit.

To avoid disappointment this Christmas, how about moving into your caravan, then if there is a power cut you will be self sufficient and you will be able to have your Turkey and enjoy the Queens Speech without interruption.

Have a happy Christmas ;-)

 

[ProfJohnL]

Hello Wendy,

With reference to your response to my earlier comment,

My comment was just that, a comment. It was an observation, much as your own, I perceive that your own comment was not constructive either.

My comment was based on the principal that there was no battery on board, which had been established in the main reply.

You certainly do have more options if a battery is on board, but even without one, you may still be better of than at home, so my my comment is still valid.

If you want a constructive discussion, then consider the following:-

A power cut at home:-

Central heating wont work.

Your fridge wont work.

Your lights wont work.

If you have an electric cooker your stumped, but with gas you can still use a match to light a ring

A power cut in your caravan:-

You have the gas convection side to the heater.

You can't start your fridge, but if it is already running on gas, it will keep going.

Your lights wont work, but most caravanners have at least one torch close to hand.

You only have gas cookers, and they can be lit with a match.

In practice power cuts are not that frequent, and it is quite rare for there to be long term power loss.

In both cases you may have access to a generator, or in the case of a caravan you can use inverters to fitted to your car which will produce 230V, but not in the same quantity as an mains hook up, or hook you caravan up to the cars12V system and at least have some lights working.

So I repeat that a power cut in a caravan is no worse than at home, and in fact it may be easier to cope.

Hi Wendy,

Yes of course you can, and I agree with you, but the point under discussion was that caravan did not have a battery, and under those circumstances I believe my contention has merit.

To avoid disappointment this Christmas, how about moving into your caravan, then if there is a power cut you will be self sufficient and you will be able to have your Turkey and enjoy the Queens Speech without interruption.

Have a happy Christmas ;-)

 

[Wendy-Norfolk]

Hello Wendy,

With reference to your response to my earlier comment,

My comment was just that, a comment. It was an observation, much as your own, I perceive that your own comment was not constructive either.

My comment was based on the principal that there was no battery on board, which had been established in the main reply.

You certainly do have more options if a battery is on board, but even without one, you may still be better of than at home, so my my comment is still valid.

If you want a constructive discussion, then consider the following:-

A power cut at home:-

Central heating wont work.

Your fridge wont work.

Your lights wont work.

If you have an electric cooker your stumped, but with gas you can still use a match to light a ring

A power cut in your caravan:-

You have the gas convection side to the heater.

You can't start your fridge, but if it is already running on gas, it will keep going.

Your lights wont work, but most caravanners have at least one torch close to hand.

You only have gas cookers, and they can be lit with a match.

In practice power cuts are not that frequent, and it is quite rare for there to be long term power loss.

In both cases you may have access to a generator, or in the case of a caravan you can use inverters to fitted to your car which will produce 230V, but not in the same quantity as an mains hook up, or hook you caravan up to the cars12V system and at least have some lights working.

So I repeat that a power cut in a caravan is no worse than at home, and in fact it may be easier to cope.

Thank you for your good wishes John L.

Alas, I shall not be moving into my caravan for Christmas, I shall not be watching the Queens speech, and neither will I concern myself with a turkey. Rest assured though, I will not suffer any disappointment from this deprevation, as I shall spend the New Year in my caravan instead!! :O)

 

[WilliamLX]

Hi,

I did keep my water bottles, step, various other accessories, gas bottles I swapped for same size propane ones for the price of a refill. The battery however I did not keep as I got a good price for my old van in a private sale. The buyer would not buy without the battery.

Overall I got a very good deal from the dealer compared with list price. I don't blame him, I blame Bailey. Now that I have collected the van I can confirm that the manual says you must have a battery installed even if using on a ehu site.

 

[ed1]

hello william,

i know of your annoyance, we too purchased a new caravan in august and there was no battery included. which we said we would eventually get one. on our first trip away which was 2 days after we took delivery, all the 12v system failed which meant no lioghts, no flush toilet, no ignition to cooker, no aerial. it reminded us to get a battery, and a box of matches. but.....it would have made no difference if we had have had a battery, as the whole system had failed, and attaching the battery would have made no difference. i think a battery should be an essential item, especially when you realise all your lights are 12v, (compass corona 2008). ED

 

[STEPHEN_374226156]

I find it hard to believe that so many of you accept this I have never failed to get a battery thrown in (110amp) it is so easy just do the deal and then just as you close it remind the salesman you need the battery thrown in if he refuses walk away he always come running

 

[STEPHEN_374226156]

I find it hard to believe that so many of you accept this I have never failed to get a battery thrown in (110amp) it is so easy just do the deal and then just as you close it remind the salesman you need the battery thrown in if he refuses walk away he always come running

 

[prjohns]

John L mentions in his post that newer caravans now come with essentially a transformer which are "quit sophisticated".

These transformers which are sold for approx

 

[ProfJohnL]

Hello Peter,

Yes your did copy my quote correctly even down to the small matter of the missing e from 'quite'

However I am very careful not confuse the terminology when it comes down to technical matters.

I did not refer to a 'transformer', but to a power supply. These are very different beasts and the title is not interchangeable. Most power supplies do contain a transformer of some sort, but modern switch mode power supplies use high frequency devices that need far less metal in them making them much lighter.

The same hf switch mode technology is used in most computer power supplies.

You mention the costs, and there is a big difference in both cost of computer type power supplies and those deigned for caravans and battery charging. The main reason for this is the volume of computer supplies is vast compared to the number of caravan power supplies produced. There is economy in volumes.

Don't forget that the 12VDc form a computer supply will be true 12Vdc, where as the caravan supply whilst it is called a 12V supply actually produces typically 13.8Vdc which is necessary to to charge a battery to a reasonable level. a true 12Vdc will only about half charge a lead acid battery.

There are other technical matters, such as the computer supply is not designed to be a stand alone device, It is designed to be fitted inside another case. Without the case it may not be adequately protected. They also require unobstructed ventilation. which the position most power supplies are fitted in caravans do not have.

Whilst a PC power supply will provide 12Vdc power it will be limited, and it may not be enough to run a modern caravan without the addition of a battery.

 

[xtrailman]

William

I agree with what you are saying, there should be a mention at lest in the sales literature.

When we bought our last van it came set up for twin propane, i only had butane, the dealer gave me a propane cylinder FOC.

Also i was offered a battery at a discount, but still found the price prohibitive, so bought one elsewhere.

Maybe as mentioned i should have negotiated the battery in the deal?

But usually when i buy a car or caravan, i have nailed the price down to the bare bones.

As for using a computer power supply, the fan noise alone would drive me mad! and although a 400w version would probably supply 12amps at 12v, it would be useless for charging the battery?

But if you can tolerate the fan noise, and don't want a battery, then there is no reason not to use one, provided it is safely enclosed.

 

[prjohns]

A few points to raise here.

Buld quality for PC PSU are built to high standards due to sensitivity of computer components. Although they are massed produced they are esentially the same as the units supplied to caravans. Granted you do need 13v to charge batteries but as some caravans no longer come with an option to use a battery that is not neccessary an issue. Ventilation and noise depends on what psu/converter you have, infact the key with using a PSU from a computer is ensuring you have one that can deliver enough amperage with minimal effort. I.e. If the max you are going to draw is water pump 4amps and 2x8w lights 1.66amps then total required 6amps a 350w psu will easly provide that with very little heat generated and depending on PSU no use of fan (no noise). The PSU I have fitted is a silent runing aquired from a dell computer and as there is no demand on PSU the fan runs silent.

 

[Lutz]

Caravans with batteries are the exception rather than the rule over here on the Continent, so the battery cannot be considered an essential item.

 

[xtrailman]

Peter

Point taken, i was of cause referring to my own experience with two desktop computers were the cooling fan constantly ran.

In adition the original PSU in my present van, were the fan would cut in at night and wake us up, nightmare, the psu is fitted under the bunk.

I convinced the dealer that a 20amp psu should not require a cooling fan to run at night, with only the battery to possibly top up, he agreed and fitted one that sensed high current flow before the cooling fan cut in, rather than a heat sink thermostat. Hence my comment.

 

[Guest]

When buying new van, we tell the dealer the WHOLE PACKAGE that we want.

ie. Caravan, Battery, EHU cable and adaptors, step or whatever we need.

The sales person then has the full picture and has to come up with one complete price.

We got caught many years ago, we'd not realised that the caravan we were buying didn't come with spare wheel. Faced with a lost deal as I told them to 'keep' their van they found that they had an as new spare wheel with a new tyre that they could "kindly offer" us.

Decide the whole package you need to get you started before negotiating the deal.

Make it clear. No deal, no sale!

 

[cheryl_374453357]

Hi dont really know why the dont put the extras with new caravans they used to put it all in the price so you didnt need to spend anymore money. When we sell our caravans weather they are new or secondhand we always put a new battery, gas bottle, step, winder, spare wheel, chocks, so our caravans are ready to use straight away and we dont charge any extra for these items. so why cant the other dealers? Well they wouldnt be making extra profits from there customers if they included all these items. Always make sure they give you a spare wheel if nothing else. you never know when you will need it. regards

 

[Jo-AnneFairway5402010]

ring chipping sodbury and ask them for a deal they might be a bit of a way for you but you could get a better deal aswell. they put an outside satalite socket on ours for free, also a hitch cover which most you have to pay for now. its worth a phone call ring and ask for jamie. its a nice family company

jo-anne

 

[Royston]

The main reason for not suppling a battery with the new van is the weight.

All manufactures give you two weights ie MIRO(unladen)and MTPLM

maximuim towing weight)

Example if the new van is supplied with internal radio tv microwave spare wheel, then this is included within the MIRO weight,If the new van is not supplied with any of the above ,then you must add the indivual weights to the MIRO weight.

Battery weight vary depending on what type you purchase and must always be added to the MIRO weight.

Royston

 

[Lutz]

The MTPLM is the maximum technically permissible laden mass, not the maximum towing weight. The towload is the axle load of the caravan, not its total weight.