Payload advice please

[Anita_5109950]

Travelling to Italy this year we are going to be fairly near our limits on payload weight. I've often been given conflicting advice as to what is included in the MiRO, perhaps someone can help.

As I understand it, the MiRO is the weight of the unit as is comes off the line, but to what extent does this go. If the caravan is supplied with a spare wheel as standard, is that included. What about small things, like a supplied washing up bowl and removable drainer, and removable carpets. All little things I know, but it all adds up.

A Phantom tracker must have a weight, anyone know what it is.

I know I'm worrying again, but I don't relish the thought of leaving half our belongings at the Swiss border if we turn out to be overweight and they pick up on it.

Thanks.

Anita

 

[BarryB_5039906]

Hi Anita

I think the MIRO figure is as you would pick the 'van up from the dealer; ie as the original specification. So if you have had a spare wheel and carrier fitted then this will 'eat' into your payload allowance. When we were near the limit we would try to put heavy but small items into the car. We used to take a supply of tinned food and when boxed up would sit on the floor between the children in the back. If possible put the awning on the floor; when our girls were little it was somewhere for them to rest their feet. If you carry water, keep it to a minimum: 1 gallon is 10lbs. I always keep the gas bottles in their special place as I feel this is a safety issue. Don't take wine and beer with you.............its cheaper in Italy. Try and pack the outfit so that it does not look overloaded. A huge top box, bikes on the A frame and the car's back window blocked by pillows will cause the guards at the frontier to notice you. It sounds like a huge task but it may be worth weighing things as you put them into the 'van. There again you may frighten yourself to death!!!!!!!!I have never been stopped but I do understand your worry. I hope you have a good trip.......by the way........we are off to Italy too..........look out for a mini towing a twin axle.!!!!!!!!hehehe No we have a Disco and a Buccaneer Schooner......We are off to Florence, Rome and then to Lake Garda.

Happy travels BarryB

 

[Anita_5109950]

Thanks Barry, but as the spare wheel is supplied with the caravan at no extra cost, is this considered part of the spec or not. This has always confused me. The carrier is mentioned on the spec list.

I know what you mean about weighing things. We've got a spreadsheet with everything listed and it is amazing how much some everyday items weigh.

We are going to Lake Garda, so I'll look out that that mini/twin-axle match!!!

Anita

 

[BarryB_5039906]

Hi Anita

It sounds as though the spare wheel is not part of the original spec., therefore it will use up some of your payload. It may be possible to travel with the 'van spare in the boot but if the rear suspension is not up to it then in the carrier will be better. Just what are the weights you are working with.?

Happy travels BarryB

 

[Anita_5109950]

Thanks Barry,

I won't dare tell you the weights we are talking about, I'm afraid we live by the "I'd take the kitchen sink if I could" philosophy, time to be a bit more sensible I think.

It doesn't help that our motor mover eats up 42kg. We've also got a plate upgrade so we daren't go overweight, even by a small amount.

It just amazes me how much stuff some people seem to get out of their vans at sites, bikes, weighty garden furniture, BBQ's, childrens toys etc etc, the list goes on. We often sit and wonder how they do it, or do they just chance it?

Anita

 

[Lutz]

Unfortunately, contrary to data for motor homes and cars, there is no standard definition of MIRO for caravans. Therefore, you will have to ask the dealer or caravan manufacturer for their interpretation of MIRO.

The safest solution would be to weigh the caravan when you're loaded up but I guess it would be a bit late then to decide what to take out if you're over the limit.

 

[Anita_5109950]

Thanks for all your help guys. I've just phoned Elddis and they confirm that the spare wheel is included in the MiRO (and the washing up bowl for that matter). It's the first time I've ever had a straightforward answer from a manufacturer. They usually confuse me with technobabble.

Anita

 

[ProfJohnL]

Hello Anita,

I'm glad that you have had some strightforward advice from elddis re the MIRO.

Barry has made some useful suggestions re loading, but also consider changing to camping Gaz, and using only 1 small bottle whilst travelling, leaving you free to purchase a larger one when in Italy (I am assuming camping Gaz is available there). This would save you several Kg whilst towing.

Only take the minimum of food/water/liquid with you and purchase at journeys end. apply that same strategy to any consumables to keep weight and bulk down.

Just a legal note- You imply that you might have knowingly overloaded the caravan with its original plate. The law takes the applied plate as the absolute limit, and if you are over it you have overloaded the van! Just because the manufacture can uprate the van does not mean that the higher limit would be accepted by the courts if it had not been officaly applied to the specific caravan. Overloaded is illegal and your insurance will be void.

I cannot understand why manufactureres do not automatically rate the MPTLM of thier caravans to the maximum the design will allow. In some cases it is simple a paper exercise with no mechanical changes required!

 

[Anita_5109950]

Hello Anita,

I'm glad that you have had some strightforward advice from elddis re the MIRO.

Barry has made some useful suggestions re loading, but also consider changing to camping Gaz, and using only 1 small bottle whilst travelling, leaving you free to purchase a larger one when in Italy (I am assuming camping Gaz is available there). This would save you several Kg whilst towing.

Only take the minimum of food/water/liquid with you and purchase at journeys end. apply that same strategy to any consumables to keep weight and bulk down.

Just a legal note- You imply that you might have knowingly overloaded the caravan with its original plate. The law takes the applied plate as the absolute limit, and if you are over it you have overloaded the van! Just because the manufacture can uprate the van does not mean that the higher limit would be accepted by the courts if it had not been officaly applied to the specific caravan. Overloaded is illegal and your insurance will be void.

I cannot understand why manufactureres do not automatically rate the MPTLM of thier caravans to the maximum the design will allow. In some cases it is simple a paper exercise with no mechanical changes required!

It has been hinted to me that the reason manufacturers do not automatically put max MTPLM on their plates is that they know people do go overweight, and so from a purely technical (not legal) position, the caravan would be 'man-enough'to take it, also that by having a lower plated MTPLM more cars would be able to tow the caravan. The differences do seem excessive though. On our Elddis we have been given 100kg upgrade, but on our last caravan, a Swift, we were given 200kg, which even to me seemed ridiculous.

 

[ProfJohnL]

Hello again Anita,

Yes it is a point of good design to engineer a margin of safety into any product, so by increasing the MPTLM by issuing a new plate, that must errode the margin! - and if customers tend to overload against the lower MPTLM, then they are just as likely to overload on the higher MPTLM, both of which are illegal and are not the manufactures problem, that rests soley with the driver of the outfit.

If a caravan sells more because it has an artifically restricted MPTLM, then the buying public do not understand the law (which is quite possible).

I do not know the answer, but I find very difficult to reconcile your hint with my experience of having worked in a business that has many of its products installed in UK caravans.

MPTLM is an upper limit for the total mass of the trailer/caravan. As a user you do not have to use the total payload capacity, you can part load, and the mass of the trailer will be lower than the MPTLM and could fall within the car manufacters allowance for a given vehicle.

You report increases of 100 and 200Kg in the MPTLM for two caravans. Whilst you do not state if any mechanical works were involved, it raises the question of how can such large gains be ahieved, or are the manufactures effectively short changing the buying public by keeping MPTLMS low?

 

[Anita_5109950]

Hello again Anita,

Yes it is a point of good design to engineer a margin of safety into any product, so by increasing the MPTLM by issuing a new plate, that must errode the margin! - and if customers tend to overload against the lower MPTLM, then they are just as likely to overload on the higher MPTLM, both of which are illegal and are not the manufactures problem, that rests soley with the driver of the outfit.

If a caravan sells more because it has an artifically restricted MPTLM, then the buying public do not understand the law (which is quite possible).

I do not know the answer, but I find very difficult to reconcile your hint with my experience of having worked in a business that has many of its products installed in UK caravans.

MPTLM is an upper limit for the total mass of the trailer/caravan. As a user you do not have to use the total payload capacity, you can part load, and the mass of the trailer will be lower than the MPTLM and could fall within the car manufacters allowance for a given vehicle.

You report increases of 100 and 200Kg in the MPTLM for two caravans. Whilst you do not state if any mechanical works were involved, it raises the question of how can such large gains be ahieved, or are the manufactures effectively short changing the buying public by keeping MPTLMS low?

No mechanical work involved, you just get sent a new plate to stick on in place of the original!!