Permanent Caravanning.

[Surfer]

As stated in earlier posts, we lived permanently in our caravan for 2 1/2 years and then moved back into a brick and mortar place. We now sincerely regret the decision as we have seen our expenditure increased by a large margin.

In comparison to what we used to pay, we now pay a minimum of an extra

 

[Gumbo]

Hi Steve

I don't know what part of the country you live in, but Aberdeenshire Council advertise for Wardens and Assistants normally around April time. It may be worth getting in touch if you fancy working for someone other than the " Clubs "

 

[Ogre]

Well, as promised, I have come back to update on our 'new life' which is, amazingly, almost 12 Months old .

No regrets at all. The past weeks and months have totally convinced us more than ever that the increasing costs of home 'ownership' are now well beyond any kind of a joke. The costs of owning a home in the UK are now a sad joke for most people, and all you do is work to exist to pay bills. That's no life for anybody.

Massive increases in Utility bills. Councils pretending that they have no funds, whilst slyly investing YOUR Council taxes in dodgy banks. Constant increases in mortgage rates, and falling house prices, have convinced us (as if we needed convincing), that our move was the best thing we have ever done.

Three of those couples who previously boasted to us of their 'nice houses' bought recklessly with mortgages they could barely afford, are now on their knees.

Two complete families facing bankruptcy, and the loss of their homes. So much for a swanky lifestyle that they couldn't afford. As if anybody really cared in this day and age what they had anyway!! The old British snobbery at work. The other guy is currently facing similar ruin after unexpectedly losing his 'safe banking job'. There are now precious few banking jobs around, and he knows it.

We wake up every day, and look out onto a beautiful countryside. Our fees are affordable, and we have everything that we need.

Now THAT is really LIVING rather than just existing.

Almost a year since we came...........and we love it. Wild horses wouldn't drag us back to the rat race.

Talk again soon. Bless you all........Ogre. x

 

[Surfer]

Hi Ogre, Glad you are still happy. We took on a council flat and now totally regret it. Funny enough it has been my wife that has brought uop the subject of moving back into the caravan.

We estimate that by living in a brick and mortar residence, it is costing us in the region of

 

[Ogre]

Hi Ian. Nice to hear from you again. Glad you're OK.

Get back to the caravan Buddy. Never mind the Rheumatoid Arthritis. I have a dodgy knee, and Mrs Ogre has a bit of trouble walking too (especially after a sherbert or two), but we have discovered a free remedy.

Strap a (free) Bunny Rabbit to each leg!!

Now that's hoppin.............Keep Well.

 

[nadsia]

Hi Ogre and all,We are still here too an just coming up to our 1st anniversary since we moved from bricks and mortar into our tourer.Well we love it still and would be very hard pressed to go back to that way of life.We have however stayed with our jobs so the income has stayed the same as it was before and the money we have saved by not being in the rat race will hopefully go toward our retirement when we get there(albeit we are only in our mid 40s)Now this time next year we intend spending a few months in france during the winter to hopefully learn about other ways of life and learn another language.In my opinion i think main land europe is where its all going to be at in the next 10-20 yrs both for jobs and a better climate,i'm not being un-patriotic this is just my opinion(the E.U. is strong unless you live on a small island like ours)Any way back to the main subject,we have met in the last 12 months many people who have either done or wish they had done the same as we have.We are happy we have met so many nice people too and hopefully have answered many a question they had.All in all we love our life and hope that when we get to old age we can both sit back read the diary we constantly update and recall all our memories from years gone past.Hope the rest of you carry on living the real life and hope that one day we can get together and exchange stories and experiences.Good look to you all.Kev & Christina.

 

[JohnKS]

You all seem very happy with your lot and I wish you success in living in your vans.

My one main question is, what happens when your health lets you down and you can no longer live in a caravan?

Are you going to expect those of us who pay the council tax to keep you in a home because we have been stupid (according to some)to have invested in property?

The only thing Mrs Thatcher got right was the poll tax so that everyone pays!!!!

 

[Wendy-Norfolk]

Having been reading and watching this thread with great interest, I take my hat off to those of you who have, for what ever reasons, resorted to taking up full timing (envious really!!)

John, in reply to your question regarding falling ill. It is obvious that all contributors to this thread are in full time employment, paying Income Tax and NI. Irrespective of whether they own bricks and mortar, they are entitled to full medical care the same as anybody else.

If somebody lives in rented accomodation, should'nt they have medical care if they need it?

 

[ed1]

hello all,

we may be living in the caravan before long, as hubby has not as much work(plasterer for 30 yrs) due to building sites closing, he has been on very very short time for the last 11 weeks, and all our savings have now gone. how do you get round the being on one site more than a few weeks, where do you do your washing, and we also have 2 dogs, living in the van doesnt phase me, its just how do you do it where is your fixed abode and such things, if we can manage to keep hold of the car and caravan before the bailiffs come knocking, and sell the house in the mean time im quite looking forward to it. oh and we tried talking to the bank, but until we default on the mortgage they wont talk to us, and then ill put money on it being talking nasty to us. regards to all, ed

 

[JohnKS]

Having been reading and watching this thread with great interest, I take my hat off to those of you who have, for what ever reasons, resorted to taking up full timing (envious really!!)

John, in reply to your question regarding falling ill. It is obvious that all contributors to this thread are in full time employment, paying Income Tax and NI. Irrespective of whether they own bricks and mortar, they are entitled to full medical care the same as anybody else.

If somebody lives in rented accomodation, should'nt they have medical care if they need it?

Don't disagree that everyone is entitled to medical care whatever they are doing but most old peoples homes are run by the local authority who get their funds from the council tax.

My complaint is that anyone living in any accomodation with an address pays council tax rented or owned. People in mobile vehicles of any size or shape do not so they are using the facilities provided by the rest of us for free. Even our friends the travellers pay council tax if they are on a fixed site.

I know, I am an ex-councillor.

 

[Wendy-Norfolk]

Having been reading and watching this thread with great interest, I take my hat off to those of you who have, for what ever reasons, resorted to taking up full timing (envious really!!)

John, in reply to your question regarding falling ill. It is obvious that all contributors to this thread are in full time employment, paying Income Tax and NI. Irrespective of whether they own bricks and mortar, they are entitled to full medical care the same as anybody else.

If somebody lives in rented accomodation, should'nt they have medical care if they need it?

What about people living on benefits - many of those do not pay council tax, and it doesn't matter whether you rent or are in private accomodation, the bill is picked up by the tax payer!

No difference, IMO!

 

[JohnKS]

What about people living on benefits - many of those do not pay council tax, and it doesn't matter whether you rent or are in private accomodation, the bill is picked up by the tax payer!

No difference, IMO!

I still say it is unfair that those who have a permanent address still pay for those who don't, on benefit or not!

 

[Ogre]

Hi again, Wendy & Kev, and others who have been following our venture into permanent caravanning. lovely to hear from you all, and Yes Thanks, we're fine.

OK. Let's take some of these points. Johm has a bee in his bonnet about the Council Tax issue. We don't own property John, so we don't pay Council Tax, which is, of course, levied on PROPERTY.

NO.. I don't expect you to subsidise me. All my working life, I have paid my dues, and have NEVER claimed one penny in benefits, despite being made redundant a few times. I have paid (and continue to pay, and so does my Wife) taxes, bills and NI contributions just like you. Therefore I am entitled to a Doctor and Dentist and free prescriptions ....just like you.

If we fall THAT ill, then we will end up in an NHS Hospital (just like you), and we will either get better, or die. Just like you. But then we'll return to our caravan. If it gets to a 'HOME' situation, then believe me, we have made personal arrangements, which are ours to know about.

Ed. Just DO it. You'll never look back.

Find sites in your area that are open 12 Months of the year. Approach them for a LONG STAY pitch. The ONLY stipulation is usually (varies from site to site) that you MUST be away from the site for 48 hours every month. We go for a weekend with my Mum.

As to whether you can 'hack it' that's a personal matter, but let's say that having enjoyed this lifestyle through gales, snow, ice, and everything else, there is NO way we'd want to live in a bricks and mortar property again.

Nice to hear from you all. Ogre x

 

[Surfer]

Should I pay council tax only for some half wit to lose it by investing it in an overseas bank that goes bust? Why are some councils able to squirrel away millions of pounds but every year increase council tax by a higher than inflation rate?

Anyway the owner would have factored in council tax into his rent and as there are many of us sharing the council tax it becomes a negligble amount so in essence we were paying council tax! I begrudge paying council tax as you never seem to see any improves around except for better conditiosn and pensons for council folk. The same potholes in the road are there year in and year out although the council has several million stashed away.

We were lucky as we only had to get off once year for a month instead of once a month. Made life so much easier.

 

[nadsia]

Hi again all,well here goes.Firstly well said ogre,Secondly who do some people think they are to assume we(permanent caravaners)are just out to sponge off the system!!!.Well far from it My wife and i have never been out of work have always paid our taxes and have never chosen to take out credit on anything.Apart from our mortgage at the time of course.Well the reason we gave up bricks & mortar was for a number of reasons:-1,we got together in our forties our kids are all grown up and we had a 3 bed-semi that we were just both rattling round in.So we sold it to a young family that would benefit more from a house of that size than we were.2,my wifes sister got bowel cancer 2 years ago and underwent major surgery followed by chemo,thankfully she survived and has now been given the ok.3.My wife had major spine surgery 18months agoin which we were told by the surgeon that she had a 60% chance of being parralysed if the operation didn't work.Thankfully it worked and she has never looked back even though she now has plate & pins holding her spine together.On top of that it got infected and for a while there was talk that the metalwork may have to come out which would have been catastrophic,but thakfully she made a recovery.and only took 12 weeks off work.4,A work colleague who retired at the age of 65 bought a motorhome to travel round this lovely countryside of ours and 2 weeks into the trip had a massive heart attack and died,leaving a loving wife of 40yrs and 2 kids.5,so on top of all this we decided to take life as it comes we will no longer follow the crowd and if we want to try something different then we will,that includes the way we lived,where we lived what we do for a living and so on and so forth.Remember when you all read this that nothing in life is guaranteed only that we were born and that we will pass over one day.For those that feel we(permanent caravaners)are not doing the right thing then maybe you should choose not to follow this subject!We beleive in live & let live & take each day as it comes and be thankfull for what you have.All The best to you all.Kev & Christina.

 

[Del_374232870]

I have to admit that the thought of permanaent caravaning apeals to me,by using CL's in the home counties i could still comute to London to work.

One question to those who are permanent vanners, how do you insure the van, as all insurance policies that I have had for the van exclude using it for permanent residence

 

[Guest]

This is becoming a thread with no conclusion. There will always be people on both sides of the argument.

The only points that I would like to interject are that as a personal choice situation, people are free to do exactly what they wish. Living in tents, caravans, motorhomes, boats, houses whatever is entirely up to them. Each scenario has positive and negative aspects. I have also wanted at various times in life to sell up andd sail away, and that is possibly my slant on the deal. I would like to 'sail away' and consider that something the size of a decent boat is the best option. However the price of these are as much as a house so the idea remained just that.

But where I still believe, and will continue to put forward, is that in my opinion this is a lifestyle choice, not an answer to a debt problem. To my mind it is a bit like those con adverts about loan consolidation. Looks great until you are in and then you find you are in an even bigger mess. I also feel it is very important for anyone who is considering this to really understand what they are doing, and not try to justify, especially in their own minds, something that is risky. There are indeed many problems in the housing market and it is understandable why anyone would consider not getting involved. But these times are not the general rule and one should always look at the long term perspective. Taking a long hard look at your own situation is the first step. Looking at ALL the options, not just the one you would like to follow is the 2nd. Take as much advice as you can, even if you don't like it. A possibly poor analogy is the case of the man who is diagnosed with cancer and told he has 6 months to live. He goes out and blows all his savings only to be told after 5 months that his condition has cured. Oops is possibly not the right phrase in this case.

Owning a house used to be a indicator of pride, not owning one is not a stigma at all. Where it went wrong was when people decided that houses were not homes, but merely investments. However, that will correct itself and very many people have lived their lives with houses, and found there were benefits over the long term.

To each his/her own, but ensure you do what you decide for the right reasons. Remove the rosetinted spectacles.

 

[Gumbo]

It's not a lifestyle choice, it seems to be a cost of living choice for some. Is that the same thing ??? I don't presume to have the skill to judge. For us we could sell and downsize, and use the money difference to tour for 6 months and then come back to base.

That would last for 10 years or so without any worry about money.

I agree with SL this is a Horses for Courses scenario what suits some don't suit others, but hey we are all here once this is not a dress rehersal for the next time!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Steve L]

We have been permanent caravanners now for ten months. Prior to that we used to own our own home, all be it mortgaged to the hilt.

Had we of stayed in the mortgage trap, we would now of been in negative equity for sure. These days I realy cannotsee the attraction of living in bricks and mortar, as all you seem to be doing is lining the pockets of inept banks and and utility companies who make outragious profits and still want to charge more!

As for being a sponger by bucking the system I AM NOT! It's the system that has failed us the tax paying public by making what most think should be a basic living standard where you can afford a house and it's running costs on the average wage. In the 33 years of my working life, I've only claimed benifits for 3 weeks and that amounted to

 

[Barking]

Kev

Our reasons for grabbing life by the neck were much the same as yours, saw too many friends/relatives suffering death or serious illnesss before having the chance to enjoy life to the full. Also fed up to the back teeth working long hours to pay tax that is increasingly spent on the wide range of welfare benefits available that we had never been able to claim.

We are still doing some work, but with much, much ore time off, and pay tax and NI contributions - we are certainly not sponging off the sate.

We have not clicked up a year yet, only 9 months, but have no egrets at the decisions we have made.

Scoth Lad

I agreee with much of your last posting, especially about it being a decision for a differernt lifestyle and not one forced upon you by debt.

 

[Guest]

One point that seems to be fairly common is that those who have made this choice are still at the very early stages. In certain instances we are still looking at 1 year or less.

I would be more reassured if there was a much longer time scale involved. Having personally moved around the world for many mnay years I have lived in different places. Each had its attractions for about 24 months then monotony set in and the negative faults became more important. I also agree that returning home has the same effect. After about 2 weeks of Messrs Broon and Co and we are usually ready to jump back on a plane. It maybe we have moved so often that we will never settle as some do. However, at a very early stage in our expat careers my wife insisted that we had a 'base' to return to. She did not care what size or where it was situated, but she wanted somewhere to come back to when anything untoward happened, which did on occasions. She also felt it was important to her to have her own 'bits and pieces' somewhere safe. I am not talking housefulls of furniture, but important personal items.

I am not suggesting that this should justify a house purchase but it does suggest that there are certain limitations on what we can do in order to have within ourselves, happy lives. We enjoy each other's company but also enjoy space of our own. On cold dark days we retire to our own rooms to indulge in our particular hobbies. My wife is a painter, I am more into mechanical things, and as we get older these become even more important. In summer months we enjoy the van for long periods of time.

I fully accept the comments regarding paying excessive costs for a house, whether it be mortgage or rent, although in the UK these costs are often no more expensive than other EU countries. My rent for a 1 bedroom apartment here in central Europe is 800 euros per month. Fortunately, I do not have to pay this one, but I do in the UK even although I am not there. Striking a balance between income and outgoings is an issue for all of us, unless your surname is Windsor perhaps.

So, there are no conclusions that I can see at this time.

 

[Ogre]

I said, over a year ago, when I started this thread (4/10/2007) that I could see the property market crashing, (everybody fell about laughing, because they were on cloud nine at the time), credit card debts going through the roof, banks going to the wall, and lots of reposessions. I also said that the whole mortgage, and banking business was riddled with corruption.

Many friends of ours thought we were mad when we set out to do what we now do. Time has, of course, come full circle.

Now, I can tell you all, there is NO WAY I would EVER trust a Bank, Building Society, Politician or Uncle Ton Cobley and all with ONE PENNY of my money ever again.

Anyone want to convince me I was wrong?

I see that there are even 1 million pound houses being reposessed in Sandbanks, which is/was Millionaires Row near Poole Dorset...............

 

[nadsia]

Hi again all,I think that after all this time the conclusion is that wether ya live in a mansion or a little Eriba Puck it will always come down to personal choice,The only contributor being circumstances to the individual concerned,so enough now of the why we felt we were doing the right thing or not.Now how about changing the direction of the subject a bit and maybe start givin advice that may be beneficial to those that are permannent vanning or maybe considering doing it.For example how to battle through the winter months,How to deal with the elements,how to keep ya van in top condition,what to do when the winds are rockin ya van all over the place.keeping ya van warm & water-tight etc etc.No doubt many of us are dotted around all parts of the country so come on folks lets give each other and people thinking about doing the same thing as us some good advice and pass on experiences we have had to deal with.Remember we all have the same thing in common (caravans)so lets all help each other out by sharing our knowledge.Hope this doesn't come across as condescending,but until we did this move from bricks & mortar to the tourer we had only holidayed in a caravan once!!.Even for us advice would be greatfully appreciated.Here's my tip, in the high winds of last we filled as many containers with water and placed them low down in the van so the van became heavy thus making it more stable.Must admit there was a couple of times we wondered what field we might wake up in!!.Anyway all the best to you all,Kev & Christina.

 

[David.O]

I have followed all of the above and except your reasons for doing what you have, but I would like to ask what prevision you are making to replace your vans and what sort of lifespan do you expect your vans to have, this must be part of your costing when making the decision to give up the bricks and mortar.

 

[Guest]

While I understand Ogre's comments, I think we all share them to a certain extent. However, he is forgetting that if he did indeed follow his statement he is throwing money away. By presumably keeping everything in cash under the bed he is subject to inflation eating away the value of his cash at quite a high rate, whether he likes it or not. At current rates the value of his cash is dropping 5% per annum regardless of what prices do. So whether we like it or not, we have to do whatever we can just to stand still even if we cannot get ahead, and there is only one way to do that. Gamble with your money in some way or another. There is indeed a banking crisis but noone has lost a penny of savings. The only ones who have 'lost' are those of us with shareholdings and even here if you do not have to sell, then the 'loss' is only on paper and can change back again. Demand and supply will see to that in due course.

I fully appreciate his comments regarding the Government. They have had 10 years in which to destroy the best economy in the world and make us to the state where the recession is going to affect us worse than anyone else. Yet, according to some media pundits Broon is a saviour. Possibly, but only because he knew where the leak in the boat was, because he made it.

This thread has been mainly about changing a lifestyle, and that is important. However, it inevitably involves financial transactions and that is another world. The idea of joining 'The Good Life' works on TV, it is much harder in real life. In fact i would state it is impossible in the UK, but possible in other parts of the world, but then again the life there may not be to your liking. Back to choices again.