Service charges in restaurants and coffee shops

[Sam Vimes]

I don't know what you're thoughts are about coffee shops and restaurants adding a service charge to the bill. Personally I don't like it as I think it should be discretionary.

Some places its up front that you're going to get something added to your bill regardless of what the service was like; others its not so obvious.

Recently we went to a new to us coffee shop and you had to pay before you got your order - not uncommon. After the member of staff took the order at the till, my wife was told to check the screen in front of her which didn't have the amount but was asking for her to choose between 10, 20 or 30% service charge. No option to decline and this before getting the service. She got the staff member to do something to remove the option.

The service was slow despite there being more staff than customers and my grandsons hot milk was luke warm in a glass and in all for four drinks and two cakes it took over 30mins. We were not in a hurry and the drinks and cakes were ok.

Our local pub, under new ownership, is much the same and is now avoided by most residents. A 10% service charge plus a mysterious 2.5% for some items and all they do is take your order and plonk a plate on your table. Actually I could write reems about how not to run ( or ruin) our local pub.

 

[RogerL]

Service charges and tipping is an American tradition which is being imposed over here - unfairly as minimum basic wages are much higher here for waiting staff then they are in America - so in reality we're being asked to pay twice for service, once in the cost of the meal, etc and then again in the service charge.

 

[Jcloughie]

I like to choose what I give as a tip based on quality and service received. But to ask for a tip before receiving a service is very poor.

I agree it is an Americanism. My daughter discussed this with some servers in New York recently. Evidently the totally rely on tips.

I thought I did well last night in the Pub. We were charged for two good meals at a very reasonable price. I needed to ask them to add our wine a Guinness to the bill.


John

 

[Sam Vimes]

I seldom go to a pub and as mentioned previously avoid our local now but I was recently told someone was charged £7 there, for a pint a Skye beer that was flat and was told that Skye beer is supposed to be like that.

Is £7 excessive? Wouldn't be surprised as at one point they were charging over £19 for a gourmet hotdog.

 

[Jcloughie]

My bill in the pub last night for a curry and a pie, chips, veg and gravy. All are made on the premises. We enjoyed them. With the large wine and Guinness, it came to £33.50 (£11.50 for the drinks).

While there a group of paddle borders came in (leaving their boards outside). On leaving we walked back to the canal with them. I asked about the bigger boards they had, They said they had managed to get 4 on them and offered us a lift. We politely declined.





John

 

[audiorob]

Always puzzles me that some places charge an extra service charge if your group over a certain number - 6 maybe. Well if you are a group of 12 then you are eating 2x the meals of a group of six which presumably is generating profit and that's before you add in the drinks bill!

 

[otherclive]

The first time I noticed a pub service charge was last year. I was out with my son and he offered to contribute to the tip, and he would use cash. But the waitress said there was already 12.5% added, which was good of her. There has often been a service charge for larger group bookings such works do's or Christmas, but rarely for private bookings.

Another thing that we have noticed is that our local pub menus seem to be becoming more restricted and lack flair. We used to go out with friends about twice a month for lunch, now it tends to be monthly but when I went to book lunch at a local pub I decided to look at the menu. It didn't hold out much interest for either me or my wife. Plus it was quite expansive on main courses. that quite frankly were nota patch on what they used to serve. Do I really want a baked potato and brisket, or fish cake as a main course. If I wanted potatoes I would have chips!. Gammon at £17.95 and no other meats apart from burgers.. So we are now off to an Italian that has chicken in various guises, pork cuts, steaks, pastas, risottos, and fish courses, burgers plus pizzas too. We visited there many times now and the prices are good and local draught beer about £2.50 less than in Skye. No service charge either.

Here is the menu of the pub that we decide not to visit. Don't know how others feel about it; didn't ring our bells.

 

[Dustydog]

According to Which?
”

What can I do if service was poor or if I simply don't want to pay a service charge?​

According to Which, if you are told about a compulsory service charge you must pay it, unless the service was particularly poor and, if you don't receive an acceptable level of service, the restaurant could in fact be in breach of its contract. It says: "Under the Consumer Rights Act it is legally required to use reasonable care and skill when providing its service.

"If the restaurant falls below this standard you can refuse to pay some or all of a service charge, depending on how bad the service actually is. Some restaurants add a compulsory service charge to your bill, and others leave it to your discretion.

"In essence you have the right to refuse to pay the service charge in either circumstance if the service falls below a reasonable standard. If a service charge is compulsory, the restaurant must make this clear before you eat.”

 

[Raywood]

Generally you can demand the service charge be removed as it is shown as discretionary and I doubt we would use anywhere that did not say that. If the charge is not stated on the menu or brought to your notice prior to ordering it is not in the contract and you have a right not to pay it.
Staff are badly paid in this trade so I do accept that a tip for good service is right. I prefer to give the staff cash though as some businesses take a cut from the tip if presented on he bill. On that basis I always ask before I pay and will only pay on the bill if it all goes to the staff. Possibly I can be too stroppy on this but it is what I believe.

 

[otherclive]

Generally you can demand the service charge be removed as it is shown as discretionary and I doubt we would use anywhere that did not say that. If the charge is not stated on the menu or brought to your notice prior to ordering it is not in the contract and you have a right not to pay it.
Staff are badly paid in this trade so I do accept that a tip for good service is right. I prefer to give the staff cash though as some businesses take a cut from the tip if presented on he bill. On that basis I always ask before I pay and will only pay on the bill if it all goes to the staff. Possibly I can be too stroppy on this but it is what I believe.

Not all serving staff are badly paid. At 17 our granddaughter worked for a chain of Italian themed restaurants and was on £10.30 an hour. She could also make up to £50 in table tips that went directly to her, plus her share of card tips which are shared across the staff. She now works part time at Pret A Manger at £11.45 per hour but no tips. The daytime hours suit her better plus it aligns better with her college course.

 

[Sam Vimes]

Just spoke to a friend that told me a G&T at our local will set you back £10.

 

[otherclive]

Just spoke to a friend that told me a G&T at our local will set you back £10.

That’s the NC500 off the bucket list then 😂

 

[Sam Vimes]

We're not on the NC500 but still hoping this will be island wide as we're sinking under the strain of tick box tourists, so anything to discourage them.

Not to mention cruise ships. I was told that two were in Portree last week. One with 2600 and the other with 1400 passengers.

Some of the tick box places are now getting bad reviews from tourists who complain about too many tourists and comments like Skye being turned into a theme park.

Keep the bad reviews coming people😄😃😃

 

[Mr Plodd]

If I see a "discretionary" service charge I always make a point of saying that I decide who, if anyone, gets a tip, and how much, and insist they remove that sum from my bill! Never yet had an arguement!

I even insisted on the something like £15 per day, per person "discretionary" service charge that was added to my on board account whilst on a Cunard Cruise. I have paid for my cruise so why should I be expected to pay an additional £105 per person per week? That woukd add up to a considerable sum of money if I cruised to Oz over something like 45 days! (Wish I could afford to )

I don't have to pay a service charge in Asda, or on a train or aircraft, and neither do I pay a service charge for the postman, bin men etc So what makes a restaurant think they are entitled to do so?

In case you are in any doubt I HATE the principle of anyone expecting me to automatically tip them. I do so at MY discretion, and nobody elses!

OK rant finished (for now)

 

[otherclive]

A pub we were in a couple of weeks ago did not wish to receive tips as part of card payment system. Any tips were discretionary and “cash please”. Cannot imagine why. 😂

 

[Mickyjb]

On leaving we walked back to the canal...

John,
Whereabouts on the canal?
Mick

 

[Mr Plodd]

John,
Whereabouts on the canal?
Mick

Probably to the path bit alongside it rather than the wet stuff??

(I'll get my coat )

 

[Jcloughie]

John,
Whereabouts on the canal?
Mick

By the Pilot Inn




John

 

[Mickyjb]

Thanks John, I know Sharpness to Frampton pretty well and the Gloucester end but I'm not familiar with that part of the canal!
Mr Plodd, take the rack as well!!

 

[Jcloughie]

Thanks John, I know Sharpness to Frampton pretty well and the Gloucester end but I'm not familiar with that part of the canal!
Mr Plodd, take the rack as well!!

I was over your way a couple of weeks ago and went to Brasserie Blanc. Queens Hotel. The Pilot is totally different. Basic, but good, reasonably priced food. Also friendly service. They are worth a tip.

John

 

[Mickyjb]

John,

Thanks for the tip, I'll need to take a trip with a view to leaving a tip.

Mick

p.s. Brasserie Blanc also has good, friendly service worthy of a tip.

 

[Paullus1959]

Service charges and tipping is an American tradition.

It is, but tipping originated in Europe during the Middle Ages.
When Americans started to travel they discovered the custom and introduced it back in the USA.
I learned the practice of tipping for an excellent meal and service from my parents and 10% of the total bill was generally the tip amount.
I'm still happy to tip 10% if everything is satisfactory but, I expect to have a choice on whether to tip or not.
I was caught out a couple of times after giving the bill a cursory glance and mentally reckoning it up to the figure I was expecting to which I added a 10% tip, only to discover later the practice of adding a service charge and not being notified. I now check my bills more carefully. These added service charges are more like a stealth tax.
In the USA however, tipping is very confusing and restaurant staff rely heavily on tips of between 15 to 25% to augment their frugal wages. A friend visiting America for the first time enjoyed a fabulous meal and left what he considered a reasonable tip of 10%. The waitress went ballistic demanding to know exactly what she had done to deserve such a paltry reward.
Don't get me started on tipping on American cruise ships where you have the choice to pay your tips upfront or at the time!!!

 

[Buckman]

Generally you can demand the service charge be removed as it is shown as discretionary and I doubt we would use anywhere that did not say that. If the charge is not stated on the menu or brought to your notice prior to ordering it is not in the contract and you have a right not to pay it.
Staff are badly paid in this trade so I do accept that a tip for good service is right. I prefer to give the staff cash though as some businesses take a cut from the tip if presented on he bill. On that basis I always ask before I pay and will only pay on the bill if it all goes to the staff. Possibly I can be too stroppy on this but it is what I believe.

Pub & restaurant staff get paid the minimum wage same as every other worker on a minimum wage, but do we give the latter a tip? Service is part of their job like the cleaner in a hospital so why should one pay the former an extra service charge?

How do you know that all the service charges collected that day are going to be split between the staff or will the manager simply pocket the lot?

 

[Beachball]

We went for a meal while we were away to celebrate my wife birthday this member of staff took me to a suitable table for my wheelchair she even got us a knives , forks and serviettes and came back for our order so we left her a tip and we saw her pick it up so we was hoping she kept it

 

[Dustydog]

We're not on the NC500 but still hoping this will be island wide as we're sinking under the strain of tick box tourists, so anything to discourage them.

Not to mention cruise ships. I was told that two were in Portree last week. One with 2600 and the other with 1400 passengers.

Some of the tick box places are now getting bad reviews from tourists who complain about too many tourists and comments like Skye being turned into a theme park.

Keep the bad reviews coming people😄😃😃

Just think of the expensive ice creams you could sell them🤪