Site water fed into Water Barrel or directly into Caravan?

[Saxo Appeal]

Hi folks,

What is the general view of taking the sites water tap and feeding it either directly into the caravan or into a water barrel with a float valve?

I must admit, we tried the float valve for the first time when last on site, and the water flowed through our van taps very consistently.

Also using the float valve technique, I presume this is safer if there’s sudden high water pressure surge.

If you have a leak in the caravan, either way it’s not going to stop the water, which will keep feeding in on both of the above.

 

[Mel]

You will find divided opinion on this. We used a direct feed for years with no problem. However, we did have a small leak into the van on one occasion ( probably NOT caused by the direct feed-the van was a lemon). Couldn’t repair when we were away so had to keep turning on and off at the site tap whenever we wanted water. ( various puppy pads soaking up the leak). If we had a float we could have just turned the pump off in the van. This and the reduced flow you get wit direct flow sent us back to the float. We use a Colapz fresh mini instead f an aquaroll.
You pays your money and takes your choice. Direct feed means not having to take an aquaroll and it is plug and play; but there are some drawbacks.
Mel

 

[Buckman]

We have not used our aquaroll or wastemaster for several years as always direct feed into the caravan.

 

[Andy Norfolk]

We use the float in the aquarol. My main reason is occasionally we use sites that are not fully serviced so we need an aquarol for these. As others have said it's just what works for you. I'm generally cautious and would be concerned about a leak in the van if I went for the direct feed. Whatever I'm using I normally turn the water off at the external tap, and the pump, overnight and when we go out.

 

[ProfJohnL]

There are a number of different makes of direct to caravan hose systems.

It's important to understand that like the strength of a chain is only as good as its weakest link, the max water pressure a caravan can manage is limited by the maximum pressure of its weakest item. That is usually 1.5 Bar for the cold water entering the water heater. This allows for the increase in water pressure caused by heating water.

Mains water pressure can easily reach 6Bar. occasionally you can get extra high pressure pulses of pressure due to some types of valves closing on the feed. For that reason all direct hose solutions must include a water pressure regulator. This is not a simple valve it is a clever real pressure regulator.

There will be thousands of caravanners who have used these without problems, but there are a few where the pressure regulator has failed in use, and the caravan has been fed with normal mains pressure, and significant damage has occured.

The use of afloat valve and external tank (e.g. Aquaroll) eliminates any possibility of mains water pressure reaching the caravan.

However there are two other issues which using an float valve and tank can eliminate. There have been many comments over the years that the volume of water you can get through some of the pressure regulators is not as good as using the caravans pump. This can affect showers. Again using the float valve and tank means your going to get the performance of caravan pump, and your not affected by the Pressure Regulators through put limits.

And the last point, is if the caravan sites supply is over stretched at peak times with so many caravans taking water at the same time, you may find the reduced flow rate affects you. Again the use of a tank and float valve eliminates this limitation.

In favour of the direct hose, you have less water standing around which might be a problem in hot weather.

Just to be clear I used to work in the industry, and having seen a number of caravans where there has been a major problem, I personally do not recommend the use of a direct hose simply to eliminate any possibility of the negative issues above.

But its up to you.

 

[DaveA1]

I have used both. must admit felt uneasy when using direct connection. Use float valve now. Or as it used to be call " Ballcock"

 

[Saxo Appeal]

Thanks all

We are heading out for our 2nd last trip this week before storage.

Looking forward to getting away again, and will continue using the float valve solution

 

[Beachball]

When we had our caravan we always use the float in the Aquarol like what some else i did not feel at ease with the direct connection but its what you prefer that matters .

 

[izzy]

We use the float in the aquarol. My main reason is occasionally we use sites that are not fully serviced so we need an aquarol for these. As others have said it's just what works for you. I'm generally cautious and would be concerned about a leak in the van if I went for the direct feed. Whatever I'm using I normally turn the water off at the external tap, and the pump, overnight and when we go out.

Exactly my reasoning also!
We take the aquarol and wastemaster and the hose and float valve are in a bag in the corner of the front locker.
I think that this covers us pretty much for most situations

 

[RogerL]

I've used both - the direct connection has a pressure limiter which reduces the flow at the taps, compared to using the barrel with a submersible pump - so now I never use the direct connection but use the hose to top-up the barrel each morning, hardly a chore.

 

[Beardy]

We use a Colapz fresh mini instead f an aquaroll.

That's a handy bit of kit if you normally use serviced pitches.

 

[Mel]

That's a handy bit of kit if you normally use serviced pitches.

It is useful, especially if space is at a premium. It is a bit of a fiddly so and so though. The lid doesn’t clip on, so easy to dislodge and the weight of the hose makes it unstable when setting up. However, once it is set up, it works very well. Would almost certainly freeze up very quickly during very cold spells.
Have to say that we are a sucker for gadgets. They probably saw us coming 😀
Mel

 

[Dustydog]

I fully endorse the Profs last post.

I have both but haven’t used the direct system for years.

Taking Prof’s post a step further my system uses an onboard pump which operates no matter which method of water feed is used.

Frankly my old girl is getting on and her joints are aching. Why overload her ? Aquaroll mains fed via the ballcock system sits very comfortably with me.

 

[Buckman]

Thanks all

We are heading out for our 2nd last trip this week before storage.

Looking forward to getting away again, and will continue using the float valve solution

Don't let the doomsayers get to you as there is NOTHING wrong with using direct feed. Whether you have the float system or direct feed, if there is a leak in the caravan both will still flood the caravan.

Modern systems in a caravan are generally very robust and if you have been using the water system for a couple of months with no issues, why should one occur just because you are using a direct or ball feed?

However as said it is up to you and for you to enjoy yourself.

 

[Dustydog]

Saxo , remind the make model and year of your caravan. Does it have an onboard pump or use one in the aquaroll ?

 

[Saxo Appeal]

Hi Dustydog

It’s the Swift Challenger Grande 670 SE

It has an onboard pump and also internal water tank (but never used)

 

[Dustydog]

Hi Dustydog

It’s the Swift Challenger Grande 670 SE

It has an onboard pump and also internal water tank (but never used)

Thanks. Pretty new.
The pump will only operate when one of the taps is turned on.

Using the float in the aquaroll the water pressure should be maintained pump outlet side. Thus from the aquaroll through the caravan to the pump no pressure.

Using a direct feed mains pressure or that reduced with a reducer will be applying pressure continually through the caravan to the pump. It is between these two a possible hose joint failure could occur causing flooding. With the float method such failure will not flood the caravan.

Entirely your choice . As I said I have both but in deference for her age prefer the safety of the float method.
If you choose the direct method May I suggest you always turn of the water fed tap at the EHU as a safety measure.

 

[Hutch]

Don't let the doomsayers get to you as there is NOTHING wrong with using direct feed. Whether you have the float system or direct feed, if there is a leak in the caravan both will still flood the caravan.

Modern systems in a caravan are generally very robust and if you have been using the water system for a couple of months with no issues, why should one occur just because you are using a direct or ball feed?

However as said it is up to you and for you to enjoy yourself.

Just because you have been using a system for a couple of months without problems, doesn't mean that something can't go wrong, the journey to and from a site can cause pipes to " jiggle " around and disconnect, the joint, it shouldn't happen but it does.
I tend more for the float in the water butt, going out just switch off the pump. With direct feed , people get lazy and forget to turn off the tap.

 

[Saxo Appeal]

Ok what we will do in future is stick with the float idea, and when always going out we switch off the pump at the control unit above the door.

So if we’re out and a hose decides to burst, then it will only leak what’s left in the caravan piping, and will stop flowing when pressure has reduced.

Think this is the best way to cover ourselves, and just to get in the habit of

 

[ProfJohnL]

Don't let the doomsayers get to you as there is NOTHING wrong with using direct feed. Whether you have the float system or direct feed, if there is a leak in the caravan both will still flood the caravan.

Modern systems in a caravan are generally very robust and if you have been using the water system for a couple of months with no issues, why should one occur just because you are using a direct or ball feed?

However as said it is up to you and for you to enjoy yourself.

This issue is nothing about the operation of the caravan appliances and their risk of failure under NORMAL conditions. It is about abnormal conditions arising through the failure of the water pressure regulator fitted to direct to caravan hoses.

I acknowledge it is comparatively rare event, but the rarity is no consolation to those affected. I can tell you the victims would not accept your description of they're being "NOTHING wrong"

There is a risk of using these devices. And there is a simple low cost, easy solution to mitigate the possibility entirely, as well as eliminating other water supply issue of using a direct to caravan system on a large site.

Using an external tank with a float valve , if the valve fails the worst is the tank over flows outside, and does not damage the inside of the caravan.

It is up to each person to consider the risks, and to decide if they want to mitigate such risks.

 

[Buckman]

I have never heard of anyone on any caravan forum even mention that the pressure reducer on the direct feed failed. As said whether using the normal 12v pump, a float valve or direct mains, if a joint on the water system inside the caravan has come apart in the caravan you will still flood the caravan.

We were using an aquaroll and the pump when this happened and it also flooded under the drawers and front bunks. The dealer had not connected the pipes correctly when the filter was removed by them. All the carpets needed to be replaced.

 

[Dustydog]

Prof and Buckman.
Come on boys where are going with this?

I cogently explained in #17 how the failure will occur using either method.

The pressure reducing valve is a non powered physical piece of kit that inhibits water pressure. How on earth can that fail?

.Buckman , you have to appreciate it all depends where your pump is. In the aquaroll or on board. It makes a massive difference. See #17😎

 

[JTQ]

The pressure reducing valve is a non powered physical piece of kit that inhibits water pressure. How on earth can that fail?

Far too easily, they don't prevent excess pressure, they only try to.
All it needs is for their internal seal to leak, and quite quickly the controlled pressure is no longer controlled but on its way rising to whatever the supply pressure is.
How can a seal leak I expect is your response. A whole host of things can cause that, but its usually a speck of debris getting between the seating and the seal, or simply degradation of the polymer "rubber" the seal is made from.
Here we use hoses where algae debris forms within and migrates away from the hose, plus we make and break an store the hose all situations well capable of introducing that minute speck of, dirt or other debris that can end up bridging the reducer's seal.

On capital equipment "we", ie where the cost implications of reducers failing is high, couple them with some form of downstream relief, a "safety valve". Blowing a plane or ship's tank out of shape when filling it is not something readily accepted.

On a personnel level, I value our caravan too much to risk it on blind reliance on a reducer value, and most certainly not the low cost items used in this industry.

Avoiding the potential ramifications is easy, protecting the system from it is also not expensive, on the other hand risk it and cop the ramifications can be hugely expensive.

Ask the supplier if they cover the consequential costs if their product is not perfect? Their answer should be enough for most of us, unless we just value our vans as basically expendable items.

 

[Beardy]

How can a seal leak I expect is your response

I don't think anyone on a caravan forum would respond in that way.

But you're right, it's not a question of 'if' a valve (of any type) will fail in a water system, it's more a question of 'when'.

 

[JTQ]

I don't think anyone on a caravan forum would respond in that way.

But you're right, it's not a question of 'if' a valve (of any type) will fail in a water system, it's more a question of 'when'.

Yet we have them, expressing what can only be a blind faith in such products the industry want their money for, I suspect all too seduced by the benefits they offer and unfortunately being genuinely "ignorant" of the accompanying risks.