SOLD OUT

[cris_408518]

Mr Blair is kicking us in the teeth again along with the German leader Angela Merkel.

Churchill and no doubt many thousands of others would wonder why they bothered with the Weasel selling us out yet again.

The basic thread of the tale is here - http://www.thesun.co.uk/article/0,,2-2007190119,00.html

If you object to Blairs parting shot - http://www.writetothem.com/

 

[Lutz]

I wouldn't have expected anything else from the Sun. Just typical of the tabloid press to stir up trouble without giving anyone any background information.

 

[cris_408518]

http://today.reuters.co.uk/news/articlenews.aspx?
type=topNews&storyid=2007-04-

20T005944Z_01_L19611296_RTRUKOC_0_UK-EUROPE-TREATY-BRITAIN.xml

-------------------------------------

http://news.scotsman.com/latest.cfm?id=608452007
-------------------------------------

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/latest/tm_headline=blair-tells-
media-no-referendum-on-new-eu-

treaty&method=full&objectid=18932728&siteid=89520-name_page.html

-------------------------------------

http://www.openeurope.org.uk/media-centre/bulletin.aspx?bulletinid=54
This has been all over the Press Lutz.

The UK can not trust Europe and something has to be done to stop Blair signing over out choices to some unknown Eurocrat.

Talk of Blair meeting to talk "Strategy" with Merkel who is desperate to see more growth in the German ecomomy again has to be of concern to the UK.

Blair is going and at what cost to the UK will any treaty come at!

We can't even trust the French and their mptives re actions around Calais, to trust Blair and Merkel over the UK future choices is madness for the UK people.

If the deal is good tell us why and be open about it and let us make our own choice and vote on that. Blair does not represent the mojority in Britain and he and Merkel and others would do well to remember that.

 

[cris_408518]

http://today.reuters.co.uk/news/articlenews.aspx?

type=topNews&storyid=2007-04-

20T005944Z_01_L19611296_RTRUKOC_0_UK-EUROPE-TREATY-BRITAIN.xml

-------------------------------------

http://news.scotsman.com/latest.cfm?id=608452007
-------------------------------------

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/latest/tm_headline=blair-tells-
media-no-referendum-on-new-eu-

treaty&method=full&objectid=18932728&siteid=89520-name_page.html

-------------------------------------

http://www.openeurope.org.uk/media-centre/bulletin.aspx?bulletinid=54
This has been all over the Press Lutz.

The UK can not trust Europe and something has to be done to stop Blair signing over out choices to some unknown Eurocrat.

Talk of Blair meeting to talk "Strategy" with Merkel who is desperate to see more growth in the German ecomomy again has to be of concern to the UK.

Blair is going and at what cost to the UK will any treaty come at!

We can't even trust the French and their mptives re actions around Calais, to trust Blair and Merkel over the UK future choices is madness for the UK people.

If the deal is good tell us why and be open about it and let us make our own choice and vote on that. Blair does not represent the mojority in Britain and he and Merkel and others would do well to remember that.

Quote from Blair. " "I don't want to negotiate in public what a simplified treaty, an amending treaty would look like."

And that is less than a week after it was announced thet Brown lost over

 

[Lutz]

http://today.reuters.co.uk/news/articlenews.aspx?

type=topNews&storyid=2007-04-

20T005944Z_01_L19611296_RTRUKOC_0_UK-EUROPE-TREATY-BRITAIN.xml

-------------------------------------

http://news.scotsman.com/latest.cfm?id=608452007
-------------------------------------

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/latest/tm_headline=blair-tells-
media-no-referendum-on-new-eu-

treaty&method=full&objectid=18932728&siteid=89520-name_page.html

-------------------------------------

http://www.openeurope.org.uk/media-centre/bulletin.aspx?bulletinid=54
This has been all over the Press Lutz.

The UK can not trust Europe and something has to be done to stop Blair signing over out choices to some unknown Eurocrat.

Talk of Blair meeting to talk "Strategy" with Merkel who is desperate to see more growth in the German ecomomy again has to be of concern to the UK.

Blair is going and at what cost to the UK will any treaty come at!

We can't even trust the French and their mptives re actions around Calais, to trust Blair and Merkel over the UK future choices is madness for the UK people.

If the deal is good tell us why and be open about it and let us make our own choice and vote on that. Blair does not represent the mojority in Britain and he and Merkel and others would do well to remember that.

At least the respected press is only reporting that Blair will not hold a referendum. Whether he does or not is entirely up to him. Countries are free to decide for themselves. So I don't quite see what the sell-out is. What is being sold?

 

[cris_408518]

http://today.reuters.co.uk/news/articlenews.aspx?

type=topNews&storyid=2007-04-

20T005944Z_01_L19611296_RTRUKOC_0_UK-EUROPE-TREATY-BRITAIN.xml

-------------------------------------

http://news.scotsman.com/latest.cfm?id=608452007
-------------------------------------

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/latest/tm_headline=blair-tells-
media-no-referendum-on-new-eu-

treaty&method=full&objectid=18932728&siteid=89520-name_page.html

-------------------------------------

http://www.openeurope.org.uk/media-centre/bulletin.aspx?bulletinid=54
This has been all over the Press Lutz.

The UK can not trust Europe and something has to be done to stop Blair signing over out choices to some unknown Eurocrat.

Talk of Blair meeting to talk "Strategy" with Merkel who is desperate to see more growth in the German ecomomy again has to be of concern to the UK.

Blair is going and at what cost to the UK will any treaty come at!

We can't even trust the French and their mptives re actions around Calais, to trust Blair and Merkel over the UK future choices is madness for the UK people.

If the deal is good tell us why and be open about it and let us make our own choice and vote on that. Blair does not represent the mojority in Britain and he and Merkel and others would do well to remember that.

Well you hit the nail on the head their Lutz "Countries are free to decide for themselves."

Not according to Blair as he is planning to ignore the country and make up his own mind.

So with a minority voting for him and about to take a hammering at the polls he is prepared to "sell out" are right to make our own choices and prepared to let others in Europe represent us.

 

[Val & Frank]

Cris

You need to stop taking the Sun mate !!!!!!!, go inside have a nice cold beer and leave it to Cameron.

Val & Frank

 

[cris_408518]

I don't drink Frank and can't take any form of Sun at present Frank.

And I don't trust Cameron either ;-)

 

[Lutz]

You don't drink beer, don't read the Sun, don't trust Cameron or Blair, no wonder you're anti-European too. Seems to be a general anti-everything and don't-trust-anyone syndrom as a matter of principle or at the very least an "I'm all right, Jack, never mind you" attitude. Where's the constructive criticism?

 

[sparkes]

WOW

Does this mean I will be able to tow a wider van! Go for it!

 

[cris_408518]

No Steve the rest of Europe will have to ban the wider vans and obey our rules re tow cars !

 

[cris_408518]

You don't drink beer, don't read the Sun, don't trust Cameron or Blair, no wonder you're anti-European too. Seems to be a general anti-everything and don't-trust-anyone syndrom as a matter of principle or at the very least an "I'm all right, Jack, never mind you" attitude. Where's the constructive criticism?

UK people have never had any vote over being part of the EU Lutz.

I'm not Anti European I love the rest of Europe but beleive that the Germans should do what they want as should the French, Spanish and Italians.

Telling us in the UK that the EU constitution has been ratified by enough countries to push it through when we have had no say and nor have most of the other people stinks. Merkel has admitted the agenda is to have a Constitution coming in to place in 2009.

I would neve trust any Politician and they should be more acountable to the people not ignoring the majority like Blair. If Merkel and Blair want to tell us what to do I expect a vote in German, French and other elections.

I don't take any papers, so what! I don't drink beer, so what!

Politicians are supposed to be accountable to the people, ignoring them and signing up to any foreign treaty that could effect our way of life and practices is wrong especially when the clown who proposes to do that is working out his notice period.

 

[Lutz]

Now you're talking democracy. Give me a bag of sweets and then I'll join your club.

 

[cris_408518]

Sorry Lutz, I don't eat sweets either and I can't even offer you a cup of tea as we don't drink that either. Blue Mountain or Peaberry coffee is about my only indulgence ;-)

 

[mcghee]

I remember my Grandfather, who was a POW during WW2 for 3 1/2 years, telling me as we watched the Berlin wall being torn down: "Twice before the Germans have been united, and twice we've had to stop them. Now, I have no grudge against Germans or any other nationality, but it really is time we as Brits stopped letting ourselves be walked over by the rest of Europe.

 

[colin(bridgend)]

The best attack on Blair regarding this topic is to vote UKIP in the May elections whether it be for local council/Welsh Assembley/Scottish Parliament. Use the ballot box to show the main parties what we think regarding their policy on the EU.

 

[Val & Frank]

McGee but it really is time we as Brits stopped letting ourselves be walked over by the rest of Europe.

Everybody in Europe is not Anti British which is what your post seems to indicate.We have as much of a say as anyone else !!!!!,

Pro british does not sell newspapers look beyond the headline and see if Europe is really all that bad.

"Unelected European Judges" was one I saw last week. Sure as hell I didn't elect any here, Did You ????

Frank

 

[Lutz]

I still get the impression that opposition to a European constitution (or treaty) is a matter of principle, not a matter of content. There is an awful lot of misunderstanding what it involves and there is much cherry picking concentrating only on specific negative issues without even attempting to get a balanced view.

 

[NorfolkMike]

Tend to side with Lutz.

To be fair thow I do have a sticker on the back of the rolling road block that says 'Leaving Britian for the elections' and no I did not register for a postal vote and I do leave on Wednesday. Turn right at Dover with a hand full of Camping Cheques and cheepo ferry crossing and Europe is the best place to be.

Now talking about the Sun. Do you remember the front page that asked the last one out to turn off the light bulb over Kinnocks picture, you tell me how many have not come back since, and how soon will it be Gordies mug shot.

ttfn

 

[cris_408518]

As so called Europeans we can't even agree and vote fairly at the European Song Contest. The Spanish have taken millions of Euro's in tax's on properties built illegaly and as most are owned by foreigners they plsn to knock them down.

Scots, Welsh and English can't agree and get on and all across Europe people fight with rival football fans from a few miles up the road let alone other countries. Amongst the countries there are also many legal, political,religion and cultural differences.

The UK has a history of the oldest government and legal system, the prpblem with European Government is that we don't have Brit's running it and the rest of Europe learning from our years of leadership and winning.

If Europeans think they need a constitution let the Brits sort it out and show the others how to do it, for a few years wo that they learn from the best.

 

[ProfJohnL]

Hi

I agree that we cannot trust any of the political leaders past or present, because too many of them have been exposed as liars, or they have been too economical with the truth.

Even if we were given a referendum about joining fully with Europe, I have absolutely every confidence that we would be given just a few well-chosen biased 'facts' by the government on which to base our vote.

How many times have we found our politicians lying? Blair has taken us into a war based on an emotive argument that has failed to live up to scrutiny, But its not just this Government that we cannot trust, there have dubious policy decisions taken by virtually all previous governments, though Messrs Brown & Blair have certainly ramped up the tax burden on us all, made criminals out pensioners who put the wrong type of rubbish in the bin, have begun a war of attrition against motorists. Tell us to moderate wage claims whilst allowing politicians to have massive hikes in expenses, and are now trying to make such payments part of the official secrets act.

As time goes by I find the proverb 'How can you tell when a politician is lying? - his/hers lips are moving' to be increasingly believable.

I have this level of distrust in our so called elected representatives, so how can I possibly have any confidence in the bunch of un-elected EU officials that can apparently tell our government and us what to do?

 

[colin-yorkshire]

ah but how many more bankholidays extra will we get to go vanning

 

[cris_408518]

Colin as many in t5he Uk rely on overtime to pay for the little extras in life if European working practices are forced upon us as the French, Germans etc don't want to be out done by us. You may get more holidays but many will not have the money to enjoy them ;-)

 

[JohnW1]

I'm not sure where some contributors get their information from. I sold a company in the UK a few years ago, having also had offices in several European Countries. I lived in Germany for a number of years, and we are currently living in Spain.Probably of relevance is the fact I speak fluent German, get by in French and am learning Spanish.I therefore feel qualified to comment on some of the xenophobic, inaccurate and downright misleading comments on this thread.

The standard of living is better in many European Countries than UK, the people are more friendly and the way of life far more tolerant (as least towards the British). I get rather annoyed by a minority of the British ex-pats who do nothing but complain about the European way of life whilst sitting in their villas enjoying excellent local food and wine and trying to create little England in another country.Even worse are the tourists who come out and then want to sit in a British Bar, watching football and drinking themselves silly.

I tend to agree with Lutz. We are badly informed about the European Constitution, and the majority base judgements without trying to establish any true facts. Politicians will say whatever is expedient at the time regardless of nationality.

There are good and bad facets to the EC just as there are to individual country's laws and policies. If we want to exert an influence we should do so from within in a positive and constructive manner.Leave the knocking and sound bytes designed to attract votes to the politicians.

 

[cris_408518]

Nicholas, you make some valid points.

I've lived outside the EEC and have worked around Europe for many years.

We see very good standards of living and far better behaviour around in our neighboutrs coountries, but the Brit politicians still sell UK people the wonders of the NHS and our edcation system and welfare state as making living in the UK the jewel of Europe. I would guess that having lived in Germany and Spain that you've had to learn their ways and sytems and abide by them unlike the constant moving of goal posts in the UK to suit various ethnic whims.

You comment on the British ways of some Spanish Villa owners and

behaviour of Brits on holiday a reason why we more or less abandoned UK camp sites for the more civlised european sites.

Many comments on this site can not go without comment to the importance of wine and beer etc.

Around Europe we have so many differents ways between the nations whilst our Politicians twist the story ignore the peoples views and wishes and hide the truth.

If Westminster and the Scottish and Welsh assemblies and MP's were to be abandoned for 1 European Government and a fair deal fo all across Europe I would be first at the polling booth.

Whislt we have the mish mash of Weasle like politico's playing with our futures with full agends well hidden. Forget it !