Testing the new consumer-rights

[Raywood]

Just wonder whether motor homes are any better or worse with regard to damp ingress I can't recall hearing anything about them . Anybody kno1w?

l think this depends on what you buy. If you can live with a simple van conversion then you should have very little to worry about. The coachbuilts are built by the caravan manufacturers and other using the same techniques and certainly I have heard of some problems although the extent is not clear. You then have the larger A class which should be Ok but at a cost.

 

[ProfJohnL]

I don’t think the size of ‘coachbuilt’ motorhomes has much to do with their water ingress issues, it’s more down to the construction techniques, and the manufacturer’s Quality (Cough cough) control. But there are some possible differences between caravans and motor homes may affect the reliability of bodies.

I have seen some diverse motor homes with water ingress issues, and of special note was one continental make whoes products are usually raved about for attention to detail and build quality which was leaking like a sieve, and needed a complete new floor, and lower panels both inside and furniture.

The first is the number of motor homes produced is much smaller and so it is just possible there may be more care taken by the production staff.

The second is the structure of the under chassis. Most motorhomes are based on commercial vehicles, and in many cases the mass of the motorhome body is well within the weight capacity of the chassis, so it may well be stiffer which means the coach built body will have lower structural movement than say the equivalent touring caravan.

 

[Dustydog]

Hi Prof
Does that include all the Fiat / Peugeot based models that arrive at the manufacturer as two conjoined cabs. The two are separated and an Al-ko chassis bolted on. It looks to me like these chassis are the same as those on most British caravans. Even the rear axles are Al-ko , nothing at all of the original van. Just wondered. Obviously the Winebago must be different!!

 

[Pedr01800]

My previous uses of motorhomes highlighted the fact that they do leak. Sometime from construction defects, others by poorly installed components. Indeed my 3 day old new van was found to leak, when tried for first time, the shower waste had been incorrectly fitted, so discharged straight onto floor to flow into built in furniture. Not happy, as chipboard had absorbed water, leaving it failing moisture test fro 3 years of warranty.
I am curious enough to ask, do the manufacturers road test their products before sale.?
I wonder if the damp ingress is caused when vehicle is bounced over few UK lanes for few hours ?
Testing on nice A class roads cannot put the same strain on all the parts, and were manufacturers take time and trouble to subject vehicles to realistic tests, after manufacture but before passing onto vendor , such imperfections might come to light prior to purchaser having to find it.

 

[ProfJohnL]

Hello Dusty,

I suspect it will to some extent, for three main reasons, The first is being a motor vehicle it will be subject to more rigorous construction standards, and secondly which indirectly linked to the first, is the cab manufacture will almost certainly have to approve the chassis connected to their cab, and I am pretty sure they would veto any design they were not happy with.
The Third, is the cab anchorage points will be more stable in several axis and possible motions than the hitch on the a frame of a caravan

 

[Raywood]

My feeling with motorhomes is that although they may have a more rigid chassis, the body is subject to a lot more road use. With a caravan it tends to be towed to where it is going and be left there, a motorhome they then may leave the site on a regular basis so pushing up the mileage and many of them work on a night here and move on more than caravans. On top of that one of our neighbours has a small coachbuilt which they use as an everyday vehicle which means far more exposure to what is left of our roads than any caravan.

 

[ProfJohnL]

Good point Ray

 

[intransient1]

Hi Everyone,
I have today received confirmation from the finance company that they have received the funds back from the dealers and the account is now closed.

The new consumer-rights act is definitely works if you exercise the right.

 

[ProfJohnL]

B) Congratulations

 

[Raywood]

Hi Everyone,
I have today received confirmation from the finance company that they have received the funds back from the dealers and the account is now closed.

The new consumer-rights act is definitely works if you exercise the right.

A good result and if more people did this the manufacturers might find it cheaper to get it right. The problem is some poor mug will now be sold the caravan probably as new but I hope after the problems have been rectified correctly!

 

[Damian]

Quote " The problem is some poor mug will now be sold the caravan probably as new "

To do that would be illegal and could land the dealer in lots of trouble.
It can only be sold on as pre owned.

 

[intransient1]

In this instance I know that the van will be returned to Elddis as the dealership won't stand the loss as the repairs required are extensive and costly and as the van has been rejected there is no customer to make the warranty claim for.
At this time I would still urge all purchasers to use their rights fully to force an improvement in quality.

 

[Dustydog]

In this instance I know that the van will be returned to Elddis as the dealership won't stand the loss as the repairs required are extensive and costly and as the van has been rejected there is no customer to make the warranty claim for.
At this time I would still urge all purchasers to use their rights fully to force an improvement in quality.

So Guys.
What do Elddis do with the dog????????

 

[NigelHutson]

Dusty,

Speaking with a local dealer recently, they told me that caravans rejected under the Consumer Rights Act (after they're given the opportunity to repair) are either rectified by them or the manufacturer and then sold as "used". That was their understanding anyway. I suppose until there's a stated case on a court ruling things will be as clear as mud.

Nigel.

 

[Dustydog]

Thanks Nigel.
Interesting.
I wonder how much "disclosure" regarding the original problem will be revealed. ??

 

[intransient1]

Most probable option is strip for parts for warranty claims, easy to pawn off parts that way.

 

[NigelHutson]

Thanks Nigel.
Interesting.
I wonder how much "disclosure" regarding the original problem will be revealed. ??

Probably very little/none Dustydog, but how much genuine history do you get with a used caravan of any sort? I suppose it would be up to the potential buyer to ask the right questions, bearing in mind it would be a very up to date caravan.

Nigel

 

[ProfJohnL]

Bear in mind this caravan is going back to the manufacturer for repair.

At least the manufacturer should have all the correct materials, and because it will one of only a few returned to them it is likely to receive very careful attention. I would like to think it might be repaired to a better standard than when it was new! It will have to be described as manufacturer refurbished or equivalent wording, and it will probably be offered with a full warranty package. - A virtually new caravan built with real care, at a knockdown price. Potentially it could be a cracking (no pun intended) result for anyone who is offered it.

Unfortunately I don't know if the full history will follow the van to the dealership selling it, because the contract rules between the manufacturer and the dealer are not controlled in the same way that retail sales to end users are (Consumer rights Act).

So even if the the potential purchaser does ask the right questions, the dealer may genuinely be able to say we don't know what faults it had.

However as I suggested above, a manufacturer's refurbished product has every chance of being as good as it gets, in terms of function, and in this case water resistance, so provided it looks good, it may be a better bet than a brand new one.

Even though it might be a good deal for a new customer, it still is unsatisfactory that the original customer has had so much grief with the caravan.

With regards to using the old SoGA and newer CRA, I strongly urge customers to remind sellers (not just caravan dealers) that they haven't ordered faulty goods so when they do go wrong use your consumer rights to get what you have paid for - goods without faults. The more pressure customers put dealers under in this regard will force them to live up to their statutory obligations, and correspondingly make it more difficult for manufacturers to ignore design and productions and quality failings.

Lets make 2016 the year that "the customers turned" and bite back to stand up for what is rightfully theirs - better and more consistently built caravans.

 

[Raywood]

The thing that might arise suspicion is that this will be sold used yet be under a year old. If you get to view a caravan this young then you would have to ask why it was back on the market. If you find the salesman lied then it could result in another claim.
Given it will have been rebuilt by Eldiss with its history known you would have to assume they will have made sure it was near perfect as they would not want it back again so may be it would be a better buy.
Makes you wonder who retails it, would the original dealer want it back knowing its history and if not is there a dealer out there who takes these and what guarantee do you get?

 

[Martin24]

I suppose it may end up on the forecourt of a second hand dealer, perhaps the sort that buy up and sell unsold new vans from main dealers? Just a thought.

 

[Dustydog]

I suppose it may end up on the forecourt of a second hand dealer, perhaps the sort that buy up and sell unsold new vans from main dealers? Just a thought.

Martin
You are spot on.
Elddis will "rebuild" it and farm it out though a well known caravan outlet as a "ssecond " They will probably describe why it is a second.
Ironically at the right price it will probably be a bargain