Towcar for Hobby 650??

[Oldfogey]

RogerL - There probably aren't caravans about with the specs I said - what we have is an 80's Sprite Compact Pop-Top (similar to a Musketeer in layout). With the lid down it is only a few inches higher than the RR, so makes for a very docile and economical tow. I can even see straight through it on the interior mirror.

It becomes clear, from this and other discussion here, that the towing rules are already more complicated than they should be for easy comprehension, and I am sure there are a lot of people out there who are towing illegaly but don't know it simpley because they have misinterpreted the rules.

And I suspect many will continue to get away with it because the police are not necessarily much more expert in more arcane aspects, such as the Hobby issue, and towing cars behind motorhomes, currently under discussion elsewhere here.

 

[GrahamSouthBrum]

Thanks for explaining the 3.5 tonnes weight problem to me.

Good job I can tow my 2200kgs ulw 4x4 & 1600kgs gross caravan on my C+E licence with no probs.

 

[KnL]

Phil,

Have to agree with Icemaker on this one, Tony A is way off mark and can say that a number of northern police forces also regularly check caravans on the move.

Whether we agree with all the rules or not, the legislation is there to protect us all (the general motoring public), whether it relates to speed, weights, sizes or condition of vehicles.

I agree that you would have to be unlucky to get spotted and stopped by a cop with enough time and enough legal knowledge to deal with an oversize caravan, but if you do get stopped I don't think Tony A will be rushing to pay your fine for you....

....And in 'a worse case scenario' if you lost control of your caravan and a resulting fatality could be contributed to you towing an illegal outfit that could be proved to be dangerous driving, Tony A might just be visiting you at Her Majesty's leisure (Up to 14 years !)

This isn't going to help you get rid of your van, but you can't just ignore that the fact that the van is too wide to be towed by normal towcars on UK roads.

 

[Lutz]

Like I've said before, the width restriction for caravans has nothing to do with road safety or roads being too narrow. If it were, then it would also be illegal for lorries to be 2.5m wide. It is therefore purely a whimsical law that defies logic, but one has to abide by it in order to stay out of potential trouble.

 

[RogerL]

Caravans over 2.3m wide, eg Phil's Hobby 650, are classed as residential caravans in the UK - that's why they're zero-rated for VAT, not 17.5% like touring caravans.

Unlike the rest of Europe, the UK is an over-populated, cramped country with narrow roads away from pan-European design motorways. It's no wonder HM government has made a conscious decision not to legalise touring caravans over 2.3m. It's of no consequence that these are legal and popular in more spacious countries.

 

[Lutz]

The few 2.5m wide caravans that one would have on UK roads if they were legal are hardly going to make a noticeable difference to traffic flow when compared with the number of 2.5m wide lorries already there. Besides, if 2.5m wide caravans were such a hazard, why not ban them altogether rather than allowing them to be towed behind a truck-like towing vehicle? It doesn't make sense.

 

[KnL]

Apologies, but I still don't get that width restrictions are nothing to do with road safety.

It is not simply the width that is at issue, it is the driver's ability to cope with the width, otherwise as Lutz states, it would be illegal for HGV's to be 2.5 m wide.

Once you pass your normal DOT driving test to the required standard you can only drive up to a certain size and class of vehicle (for obvious safety reasons).

Some of the motoring public then go on to spend a good deal of time and a good deal of money to get their HGV or PCV entitlements, to show that they can safely drive wider, longer and heavier vehicles.

If they then want to progress to hazardous or extra-ordinary loads, they require even further training (again, for safety reasons).

The restrictions have to kick in at some point and in relation to towing widths, it has been deemed that 2.3 m is the maximum safe width, unless you have proved to the driving authorities that you are competent to drive larger/wider vehicles and hold the required entitlement on your licence.

Thus, you are entitled to tow wider caravans with vehicles over 3500kg, due to the fact that the towing vehicle and trailer are of similarly widths.

Even in the 'sensible' world of caravanning, we already see regular examples of dangerously mis-matched units and excessive towing speeds. Can you imagine just in this one area of motoring, what would happen if the width, weight and speed restrictions were lifted.

Like I've said before, whether we agree with all the rules or not, the legislation is there to protect us all.