Tyron, worth having?

[Michelle_374548359]

Hi,

Have just bought my first caravan and have been recommended to have Tyrons fitted to both wheels. Apparently they help you keep your vehicle/caravan under control in the event of a puncture or blow out.

Do you know about these and are they generally thought of to be worth having? Hav been quoted £125 including fitting for both wheels (single axel van).

Your thoughts would be appreciated, thanks

 

[ProfJohnL]

Hello Michelle,

There has been a big debate about Tyron and other similar products on the forum. If you use the search facilities you may well find the previous postings.

Tyron make big claims for their product, but despite many requests they have not produced the technical evidence to support their advertising claims.

If they are as good as they say they are, then insurance companies would be insisting that they should be fitted to cars and trailers. It must tell you something when no such insistence is made.

Using what technical and engineering knowledge I have, I cannot see them offering any significant advantage, provided your tyres are properly inflated and in good condition, and some others on the forum hold similar views.

They do not stop blow outs, and the type of blow out they demonstrate are not the destructive ones that occur in reality, so the claimed benefits of the devices are at best of very limited use.

Having said that, if you FEEL they offer you some extra safety and the price is acceptable to you then go ahead. But do make sure the wheels are properly balanced after fitting the bands. but for me

 

[Lutz]

Tyron claim that they help keep the caravan under control in the event of a puncture or blowout, but they have never produced any conclusive evidence that they actually fulfil this claim. The videos that they have produced show how wonderfully stable the vehicles concerned were under such conditions without providing similar comparative information of how they would have performed without them. There is no proof that one would be any worse off.

I have personally experienced a blowout on a caravan without Tyron bands and the outfit remained rock steady until I was able to come to a standstill. I was doing about 60mph at the time and the weight ratio of the outfit was close on 100%. While slowing down I had to negotiate a motorway exit, so it was not a matter of simply having to hold a straight line. The conditions were therefore anything but ideal. Nevertheless, the only thing that happened was that the tyre, which stayed on the wheel rim despite the fact that no band was fitted, was close to catching fire by the time I stopped. Tyron bands would not have prevented that. For this reason I am more than sceptical of the benefits of the product.

This subject has come up before in this forum and, if I remember rightly, someone even contacted Tyron, challenging them to produce comparative data with and without Tyron bands under the same conditions, but they never obliged, so that would indicate that they themselves are not fully convinced of their performance.

 

[david_374531985]

Tyron claim that they help keep the caravan under control in the event of a puncture or blowout, but they have never produced any conclusive evidence that they actually fulfil this claim. The videos that they have produced show how wonderfully stable the vehicles concerned were under such conditions without providing similar comparative information of how they would have performed without them. There is no proof that one would be any worse off.

I have personally experienced a blowout on a caravan without Tyron bands and the outfit remained rock steady until I was able to come to a standstill. I was doing about 60mph at the time and the weight ratio of the outfit was close on 100%. While slowing down I had to negotiate a motorway exit, so it was not a matter of simply having to hold a straight line. The conditions were therefore anything but ideal. Nevertheless, the only thing that happened was that the tyre, which stayed on the wheel rim despite the fact that no band was fitted, was close to catching fire by the time I stopped. Tyron bands would not have prevented that. For this reason I am more than sceptical of the benefits of the product.

This subject has come up before in this forum and, if I remember rightly, someone even contacted Tyron, challenging them to produce comparative data with and without Tyron bands under the same conditions, but they never obliged, so that would indicate that they themselves are not fully convinced of their performance.

hi michelle tyron band are a good safety feature on any caravan when they were first introduced if you were unfortunate to have puncture it stopped the tyre from going through the wheelarch and damaging the floor ihave experienced a blowout on the m6 and managed to travel a good 5 miles on the tyron to the service station also they must serve a purpose as i am led to beleive the police and ambulances youse them on their vehicles best of luck on whatever you decide regards dave

 

[ProfJohnL]

I challenge David's comment.

There is no published evidence that the bands make add any significant safety to the caravan or other normal road vehicles.

David's blow out is inconclusive. He may still have travelled 5 miles on a tyre without a Tyron band.

The demonstration video Tyron use is very skilfully crafted. It shows how the emergency vehicles may perform with a Tyron band fitted, but critically they do not show the same test without Tyron bands in a scientifically controlled test.

There is also a further anomaly with their video. The age and condition of the tyres was not established.

It is most likely tyres they used were of new stock, and in good condition. Such tyres do not normally suffer blow outs. The simulated blow out is induced in a good tyre by a small explosive charge, which produces a very localised rupture in the tyre wall. In real life most blow outs occur because a tyre is already in poor condition, and the rupture when it occurs is usually much bigger and the tyre tread will be far more likely to detach even with a Tyron band.

The fact is that Tyron bands are not fitted to all police and ambulance vehicles.

 

[Lutz]

At best, Tyron bands can only prevent the tyre bead from coming off the wheel rim (although my experience is that it will stay on the wheel even without Tyron bands), but they cannot stop the tread from separating from the rest of the tyre. In that case, the tread alone can do quite a lot of damage, but there is no way of preventing it other than to fit run-flat tyres.

 

[vernon]

I've had four blowouts, at differing speeds, in 37 years, and they all stayed on the rim, and in control, WITHOUT Tyrons.

One did damage the wheel arch on the caravan, but Tyrons would not have prevented that damage, as it occured through the tread.

Incidentily three were Dunlops, and the other was a crossply, (years ago!).

Tyrons may have a use on an Army Landrover when the tyres are shot out, and they have to get away very quickly and drive for a considerable distance.

 

[Mel]

We had Tyrons sold to us when we bought our first (still current) van. We had a slow puncture, not a blow out, and discovered it as we were about to leave a pitch, so put the spare on to get home. We then discovered that you can't just take the flat wheel to your local tyre depot, you have to get an approved Tyron lot to do it. Mobile Kwik Fit came out and changed the tyre and put the wheel back on the van. They were very good; but you need to know that you have fewer options. We were obviously completly green when we bought our first van. Having read the threads on here since then I don't think I'd bother with Tyron on a future van.

mel

 

[ProfJohnL]

I would expect that if these companies making and selling these bands had good proven evidence of a real advantage, they would be telling us and showing the complete evidence, and there would be a real clamour to have then fitted to all wheels from insurers and safety organisations.

More companies would be making them, and you would see them at every tyre depot on prominent display.

The absence of this activity casts doubt in my mind about the efficacy of the products.

 

[WatsonJohnG]

Tyron claim that they help keep the caravan under control in the event of a puncture or blowout, but they have never produced any conclusive evidence that they actually fulfil this claim. The videos that they have produced show how wonderfully stable the vehicles concerned were under such conditions without providing similar comparative information of how they would have performed without them. There is no proof that one would be any worse off.

I have personally experienced a blowout on a caravan without Tyron bands and the outfit remained rock steady until I was able to come to a standstill. I was doing about 60mph at the time and the weight ratio of the outfit was close on 100%. While slowing down I had to negotiate a motorway exit, so it was not a matter of simply having to hold a straight line. The conditions were therefore anything but ideal. Nevertheless, the only thing that happened was that the tyre, which stayed on the wheel rim despite the fact that no band was fitted, was close to catching fire by the time I stopped. Tyron bands would not have prevented that. For this reason I am more than sceptical of the benefits of the product.

This subject has come up before in this forum and, if I remember rightly, someone even contacted Tyron, challenging them to produce comparative data with and without Tyron bands under the same conditions, but they never obliged, so that would indicate that they themselves are not fully convinced of their performance.

That was me and their response was dire

 

[WatsonJohnG]

I would expect that if these companies making and selling these bands had good proven evidence of a real advantage, they would be telling us and showing the complete evidence, and there would be a real clamour to have then fitted to all wheels from insurers and safety organisations.

More companies would be making them, and you would see them at every tyre depot on prominent display.

The absence of this activity casts doubt in my mind about the efficacy of the products.

It does me but I have then just in case!!

 

[david_374531985]

TO ANSWER JOHN L WHO CHALLENGED MY COMMENTS REGARDING TYRON BANDS I WILL HAVE TO DISAGREE WITH HIS COMMENTS REGARDING TYRON BANDS NOT BEEN FITTED TO POLICE CARS AND AMBULANCES AND ALSO MILITARY VEHICLES IF HE GOOGLES TYRON BANDS FITTED TO POLICE VEHICLES HE WILL FIND THAT THEY ARE DAVID

 

[Lutz]

In John's defence he didn't say that Tyron bands weren't fitted to police cars or ambulances in general, but to all police cars and ambulances. If the product were really so convincing, then no police force or ambulance service would be without them. Besides, car manufacturer's would also have offered them as a regular production option by now. Run flat tyres, on the other hand, have already found their way in the price lists of a handful of car makers.

 

[ProfJohnL]

Hello David,

First of all there is no need to shout, I challenged the accuracy of your posting not you personally.

As Lutz spotted, and has already explained I deliberately used the word ALL. There is no doubt that some police, ambulance and other emergency vehicles do have Tyron bands fitted, but not all.

I did exactly as you suggested I Googled "TYRON BANDS FITTED TO POLICE VEHICLES" and all I got was Tyron's advertising and few sites selling Tyron bands. There was one site" www.caravan-advice.co.uk" that gave an inconclusive narrative that I suspect was effectively a paid for editorial. It contained a link ( now defunct) to what was a Tyron web site. They make the erroneous connection to the issue of the police and emergency services fitting them. They fail to point out that their use of them is for very different reasons than normal driving.

The important factor here is to consider is who is telling you that the bands are fitted to these emergency vehicles and why are they telling you, and the answer is Tyron, and it plays on the fear that people have of tyre failures. Failures must be taken seriously and can lead to very unfortunate outcomes, but they are pretty rare, and blowouts are not necessarily guaranteed to lead to sever results the advertisers would like you to think.

It has been done in such a way to shock and give the impression that their product is an essential part of the emergency services equipment.

None of sites gave any evidence based results that show conclusively that rim bands make any significant contribution to caravan or motor safety. Tyron were asked to supply the scientific evidence for their claims in 2007 but have so far not responded to the request.

Tyron have been around for many years now. If the principal had any significant value to the ordinary motorist, other companies around the world would be producing them in large numbers. I did a Google search looking for manufacturers, and I could only find Tyron and a company in South Africa. The technology is not that complex so it's not that they are difficult to design or produce.

Bearing in mind the way the Americans are so litigious about Health & car safety, an effective device for controlling a car in the event of puncture or blow-out would be standard fit - but they are barely used in the USA or in fact anywhere. So I repeat, that if they were as effective as the company implies, then insurance companies and safety organisations would be telling every one to get them fitted.

I think it is important to open people's eyes so they can make an informed decision, and possibly save themselves some money.

If people want to fit them, well that is fine, it's their money, but if they are fitting them because they think they will improve the safety of their car/caravan, then they are being mislead.

I would welcome Tyron's response provided it gives the balanced evidence that supports their advertising and claims.

 

[Steve L]

To be quite honest here.

If tyron was such a good system, it would of been endorsed by the likes of, Captain slow, Hamster and the loud mouth from yorkshire.

One would also find insurance companies offering discount for their use or making them mandatory fitment on sports cars etc.

You would find adverts all over the place.

So it's realy upto the individual. If they want to wear belt and braces or have a security blanket then fine. But the cost is a consideration too.

Carefull checking of tyre conditions and pressures on a regular basis will indicate a problem before it happens, the only exception to that is running over an object in the road.

 

[david_374531985]

Hello David,

First of all there is no need to shout, I challenged the accuracy of your posting not you personally.

As Lutz spotted, and has already explained I deliberately used the word ALL. There is no doubt that some police, ambulance and other emergency vehicles do have Tyron bands fitted, but not all.

I did exactly as you suggested I Googled "TYRON BANDS FITTED TO POLICE VEHICLES" and all I got was Tyron's advertising and few sites selling Tyron bands. There was one site" www.caravan-advice.co.uk" that gave an inconclusive narrative that I suspect was effectively a paid for editorial. It contained a link ( now defunct) to what was a Tyron web site. They make the erroneous connection to the issue of the police and emergency services fitting them. They fail to point out that their use of them is for very different reasons than normal driving.

The important factor here is to consider is who is telling you that the bands are fitted to these emergency vehicles and why are they telling you, and the answer is Tyron, and it plays on the fear that people have of tyre failures. Failures must be taken seriously and can lead to very unfortunate outcomes, but they are pretty rare, and blowouts are not necessarily guaranteed to lead to sever results the advertisers would like you to think.

It has been done in such a way to shock and give the impression that their product is an essential part of the emergency services equipment.

None of sites gave any evidence based results that show conclusively that rim bands make any significant contribution to caravan or motor safety. Tyron were asked to supply the scientific evidence for their claims in 2007 but have so far not responded to the request.

Tyron have been around for many years now. If the principal had any significant value to the ordinary motorist, other companies around the world would be producing them in large numbers. I did a Google search looking for manufacturers, and I could only find Tyron and a company in South Africa. The technology is not that complex so it's not that they are difficult to design or produce.

Bearing in mind the way the Americans are so litigious about Health & car safety, an effective device for controlling a car in the event of puncture or blow-out would be standard fit - but they are barely used in the USA or in fact anywhere. So I repeat, that if they were as effective as the company implies, then insurance companies and safety organisations would be telling every one to get them fitted.

I think it is important to open people's eyes so they can make an informed decision, and possibly save themselves some money.

If people want to fit them, well that is fine, it's their money, but if they are fitting them because they think they will improve the safety of their car/caravan, then they are being mislead.

I would welcome Tyron's response provided it gives the balanced evidence that supports their advertising and claims.

HI JOHN MY APOLIGIES IF YOU THOUGHT I WAS SHOUTING THE PROBLEM WAS I SIGN ON IN CAPITALS WHEN GOING ON FORUM AND FORGOT TO GO BACK TO LOWER CASE APOLIGIES ONCE AGAIN REGARDS DAVID

 

[Sedo]

Hi

Not throwing a spanner in the works.

I know that the tyron band issue always ends up like a game of tennis but did you know that Michelin are testing an airless tyre.

A friend sent pictures last year of a car testing at the Carolina plant but I took it as a joke.

I've been sent more pictures again and am sure it's not a joke.

The tyre looks like a conventional tyre with the sidewall missing, and between the 'wheel band' and the 'tread band' are flexible 'spokes' in place of air.

I haven't a clue what the cost would be, or if they'll come out any time soon but they'd be a godsend for caravanning.

Tom

 

[Steve L]

Michelin tried out cycle tyres 30 odd years ago. Don't think they caught on.

I wonder if they will be approoved? Some idiot is bound to try running them down to the rims.

I regularly see tyres worn to the cord and suprisingly not on old bangers.

Dunlop had denovo run flat tyres back in the late 70's they never took off.

Steve l.

 

[penfold]

Hi,

The big thing about the Tyron bands is that you would hope never to rely on them. The other thing is that should you need to have a tyre changed some tyre fitters won't fit them due to having tyron fitted.

 

[Sedo]

Steve

These aren't run flats, they can't go flat because there's no air in them to escape.

Have pictures in the e-mail but don't know how to upload them to the site.

They'll obviously be special wheels to suit but the only thing to do is change them when they're worn.

They come on the picture up as Michelin Tweels. On the pictures they're testing with an Audi A4.

Tom

 

[TimM]

I have tyrons fitted. I know they won't help with all types of blow out. We had the tread start to come off a Matador tyre last year and it would not have stopped the damage from that. However it will stop the tyre bands from going in to the wheel well on a deflated tyre so I feel they are worth having but its down to personal choice. Regarding removal of tyres, we carry a small kit from Tyron that pushes the edge of the tyre in to fit and remove the bands. It works really well as we found out when all our above tyres were replaced under warranty.

 

[Lutz]

The point is, however, that the likelihood of the tyre bead going into the wheel well is pretty remote on a modern 'hump back' design of wheel. It certainly stayed in place when I experienced a blowout, even though I was negotiating a bend at the time.

 

[Steve L]

I understand that Tom.

Having worked in direct product developement with the likes of Lotus and Aston Martin plus Jaguar, I have had access to prototype products for evaluation years befor their public debute.

For obvious contractual clause reasons i cannot go beyond basic dicussion.

As I said Michelin brought out a puncture proof cycle tyre about 30 years ago. the tyre was twice the price of a conventional casing and tube affair. The make up of the tyre was a high density foam rubber witha conventional cycle pattern outer casement. There were no mountain bikes in those days so only a basic nobbly pattern tyre was offered for off street use.

As pedal cycles only came under vary basic fit for purpose design regulations compared to cars, it was relatively easy to test public oppinion and see what competition cyclist's made of it before any motor vehicle based trials.

By thee time line between that and what we see now, I suspect the product has undergone major developement and will need much more test trial before we see a progression to mass usage.

I think they would be a good product for caravans and other trailers where there is no major requirement for cornering or acceleation performance, but as for motor vehicle useage, there's much more developement to take place.

ATB Steve L.

 

[Lutz]

The above responses suggest that run-flat tyres are not in full scale production, but this should only be understood to refer to the Michelin development of an airless tyre (which I am sure we will not see in production for a long time to come). However, most large tyre manufacturers have run-flat tyres in their programme and even a few car manufacturers are already offering them as a regular production option.

 

[xtrailman]

The vehicle that transported our slag pots had solid tyres, they were filled with foam, perhaps 20 years ago not sure on the time, but its not a new idea, but it only operated on plant and never exceeded 10 mph.