You couldn’t make it up!!

[Dustydog]

Unbelievable. People using wood burners for heating are cancelling out all the eco friendly cars trying to tackle air pollution 🙃🙃
I wonder if the 2030 deadline death of ICE will change🤞

 

[otherclive]

Must tell my son of your concerns as he has two acres of wood which borders onto an extensive area of woodland. He and the villagers are like Hobbits when a tree comes down, out come the chainsaw brigade. But he seasons the wood and their new wood burning heater meets all the latest regulations.

 

[Dustydog]

Must tell my son of your concerns as he has two acres of wood which borders onto an extensive area of woodland. He and the villagers are like Hobbits when a tree comes down, out come the chainsaw brigade. But he seasons the wood and their new wood burning heater meets all the latest regulations.

But isn’t it what they burn , not the stove? This comes from todays DT

 

[Parksy]

I quite enjoy playing BBC news bingo.
We have to guess how far into the news bulletin we will get before 'climate change' is mentioned.
They continue to bang on incessantly about it, but they're having a hard time convincing an increasingly sceptical British public that this useless wet summer weather is the result of 'global warming'.
The headlong rush for Britain to become net zero without the infrastructure needed to achieve this aim, and by impoverishing us and making our lives more difficult, will prove to be electoral suicide, whoever tries to implement it. 🤪😜🤪

 

[otherclive]

But isn’t it what they burn , not the stove? This comes from todays DT

You have the advantage of me sir as todays DT sits 1 metre away not yet opened. But this link may shed some light on the new rules. But as with so many rules and regulations these days who enforces them?

Wood Burning Stoves Regulations: What Do The New Rules Mean For Your Fireplace? - HomeOwners Alliance

New wood burning stoves regulations came into force in 2022 affecting the type of log burner you can buy and the fuel you use. We explain all.

hoa.org.uk

 

[ProfJohnL]

Another startling headline designed to cast misinformation to sell newspapers.

Dusty I advise you to stop reading .......

 

[Mr Grumpy]

Unbelievable. People using wood burners for heating are cancelling out all the eco friendly cars trying to tackle air pollution 🙃🙃
I wonder if the 2030 deadline death of ICE will change🤞

Would this be the ECO FRIENDLY cars that need tons of lithium being dug up and transported half way round the planet on a ship burning tons of diesel?
Which is then used to make up batteries that are again transported around half the world before being installed in vehicles and making them a lot heavier than ICE vehicles this increasing potential for road surface damage.
The same batteries that seem to be developing a knack for self combustion when fitted in Ebikes, electric scooters and EV's?

ECO FRIENDLY, went out with the horse and cart.

As for heating the home as you're so interested in ECO FRIENDLY I trust you've invested in a Heat Pump as recommended by the powers that be!

Personally I'll stick with diesel and an open fire, much more cosy.

 

[otherclive]

Just made page 5. The report also says that agriculture is responsible for more than a quarter of urban particle pollution, particularly ammonia from fertilisers.

So perhaps all areas; cars, other vehicles, wood burners and agricultural need a concerted effort to clean up their act, rather than just headlining “wood burners”.

 

[Dustydog]

Another startling headline designed to cast misinformation to sell newspapers.

Dusty I advise you to stop reading .......

Well in part yes but no smoke without fire as Clive’s link has shown has shown.
We’re doomed, doomed🤪🤪

 

[Mel]

While we are on the subject of profligate energy use ( sort of): did you know that all the banks of servers that keep us all tapping away on t’internet here are using as much electricity as a large town? And there’s me turning the washing machine down to 30 degrees. 😱
mel

 

[otherclive]

Daughter popped around a short while back and gave me a Chilean Shiraz (Jack Rabbit) purporting to be carbon neutral. So I won’t feel so bad going over to South Wales tomorrow for a pub lunch. 🤣

 

[Hutch]

Daughter popped around a short while back and gave me a Chilean Shiraz (Jack Rabbit) purporting to be carbon neutral. So I won’t feel so bad going over to South Wales tomorrow for a pub lunch. 🤣

Has Wales implemented the 20 mph speed limit , yet.

 

[otherclive]

Has Wales implemented the 20 mph speed limit , yet.

Not yet, 17 September is the day. Not really a big deal as around where we live towns have certain roads at 20 mph. Be nice if I could average 20 mph though😂

Seven things you may not know about Wales’ new 20mph default speed limit | GOV.WALES

Wales became the first UK nation to pass legislation to lower the default national speed limit on residential roads and busy pedestrian streets from 30mph to 20mph when the Senedd voted in favour in July 2022.

www.gov.wales

 

[Buckman]

Daughter popped around a short while back and gave me a Chilean Shiraz (Jack Rabbit) purporting to be carbon neutral. So I won’t feel so bad going over to South Wales tomorrow for a pub lunch. 🤣

Is that to celebrate the Wales big win?

 

[otherclive]

Is that to celebrate the Wales big win?

Yes it was rather a nice surprise given the teams recent past form. But the trip over to the Principality is to see our son and give him his birthday presents, then Sunday lunch in his local. Sun shining what could be better eh?

 

[Buckman]

Yes it was rather a nice surprise given the teams recent past form. But the trip over to the Principality is to see our son and give him his birthday presents, then Sunday lunch in his local. Sun shining what could be better eh?

Very true. On 19th it will be Wales vs South Africa so that could be a very interesting match. Our daughter and family have tickets for the game.

 

[ProfJohnL]

Would this be the ECO FRIENDLY cars that need tons of lithium being dug up and transported half way round the planet on a ship burning tons of diesel?
Which is then used to make up batteries that are again transported around half the world before being installed in vehicles and making them a lot heavier than ICE vehicles this increasing potential for road surface damage.
The same batteries that seem to be developing a knack for self combustion when fitted in Ebikes, electric scooters and EV's?

ECO FRIENDLY, went out with the horse and cart.

As for heating the home as you're so interested in ECO FRIENDLY I trust you've invested in a Heat Pump as recommended by the powers that be!

Personally I'll stick with diesel and an open fire, much more cosy.

I can't let this diatribe of misdirections go unchallenged.

There are plenty of well respected studies from both commercial and centers of study that have been peer reviewed that show the use of EV's has a lower ecological and economic impact over their lifetime and energy and consumables usage than equivalent sized ICE vehicles. Please note I said lower not zero impact.

As for damage to the roads, there hasn't been enough real data to assess the impact of any increase in car weights on the road infrastructure, whilst more weight must affect the roads, but it's unlikely that the addition three to four hundred Kg of battery in present day EV's is going to make a massive difference to surface wear compared to the vastly increased number of couriers vans and HGVs that hit the roads over recent years. The UK roads are in the condition they are from past to present day traffic not because of EV's going into the future.

Fires caused by batteries when compared to other causes are very few in number and as a proportion of all fires. Some battery chemicals do have a higher risk of combusting, but only if something goes wrong. Such fires are a relatively new incident, which makes them grab the headlines. The reality is yes, there is a risk, but it's a low incidence, and there are many higher risk with higher incidence incidents not involving batteries, or where batteries were not the primary cause.

I understand that others may different opinions about going EV, but if you feel you need to justify it then please use facts not fictions.

 

[Sam Vimes]

Pretty much any human endeavour has an impact on the ecology of our planet. We should go back to living in caves and enjoy being hunter/gathers again. Of course it wouldn't be long before we had to pay tribute to council elders for just being.

I think most people, unless your Donald Trump, would be hard pressed to deny that the climate is changing. The changes can have a dramatic affect on peoples lives. Of course the real discussion is what's behind the climate changing - and that's a whole can of organic worms.

Along with climate change is the polution of the environment which equally has an affect on peoples lives in respect of health.

It makes sense to me to be conscious of these two factors and try and do our best to minimise the detrimental affects. However, its really hard to understand where best to apply our efforts because of the complicated nature of the chain involved in just living our lives.

I don't have too much problem with government annouced initiatives to improve things - although they mostly seem half-baked - it seems that the carrot in the form of grants/incentives is not working and is cancelled out by the real costs of the final outcome preventing people from adopting these measures.

Just like the Bank of England that has only one tool in its box - interest rates up/down. ( Can you imagine a group of highly paid bankers or whatever sitting around a table and saying - 'well what do you think this week up or down'. Doesn't affect them of course on their high salaries). The governments - central or local - seem to believe that forcing people to incur extra cost will force them to adjust their lifestyles to meet the new measures. Those that are hardest hit by whatever measure are probably those that can least afford all these changes.

I'm sure most people would like to support green inititatives right up until the point it hits their wallets.

 

[woodsieboy]

Last night I watched a programme about the summer of 1976, and the high temperatures for weeks, and the drought, and the standpipes in the streets for water,then when it started to rain it lasted several weeks. So it balanced out, at the time no mention of climate change, but as the programme ended a tag on suggested that we could expect more years like 1976 in the future due to climate change, I am naturally suspicious of most claims made in the media , not just climate, so will carry on with my gas boiler and diesel car thankyou.

 

[Woodentop]

The thing that I note is that HMG and everyone else is talking about NET zero, not absolute zero. Ergo you can still drive an ICE car so long as you counterbalance it with, say, try planting.

 

[Raywood]

I think the problem with the so called facts on EV's ae hat both sides of the argument come from people trying to support heir opinion and are often subject to some embellishment to help their argument. Their are many difficulties with EV's some of which should be overcome but others look problematic given the sheer amount of power needed. The MD of MOTO recently issued a statement covering the problems they have with planning and the inability of the grid to supply the power needed. the enormous amounts of power they need. He estimates that they alone will need to use a quarter of the power of a nuclear power station to service the cars they will get.

 

[Fraseb01]

I wonder what damage that burnt out cargo ship in the north sea done to the environment, there was a few ev's in that .

 

[Buckman]

Would this be the ECO FRIENDLY cars that need tons of lithium being dug up and transported half way round the planet on a ship burning tons of diesel?
Which is then used to make up batteries that are again transported around half the world before being installed in vehicles and making them a lot heavier than ICE vehicles this increasing potential for road surface damage.
The same batteries that seem to be developing a knack for self combustion when fitted in Ebikes, electric scooters and EV's?

ECO FRIENDLY, went out with the horse and cart.

As for heating the home as you're so interested in ECO FRIENDLY I trust you've invested in a Heat Pump as recommended by the powers that be!

Personally I'll stick with diesel and an open fire, much more cosy.

Excellent synopsis and very true.

 

[Dustydog]

I can't let this diatribe of misdirections go unchallenged.

I’ve re read the whole thread and in truth cannot find any of the diatribe of misdirections.

Australia aside who mine their Lithium sensibly, the rest are a disgrace to the 21 st Century employment laws. The general consensus is Lithium will be exhausted by 2030 and other rare metals are being investigated.
There are no right or wrongs or diatribe depending where you stand. The truth is we must be sensible and put the economy first .If we are not careful and far sighted we will have a broken country where EVs will be pushed into oblivion for decades.
For now my clean burn diesel is working fine and not polluting overall compared to other modes.
Sensibility must rule

 

[otherclive]

Very true. On 19th it will be Wales vs South Africa so that could be a very interesting match. Our daughter and family have tickets for the game.

Envious of Wiltshire 🤣.
May have to revisit the Principality that weekend to soak up the atmosphere and down a few Brains.