Coachman 2008 Buyer Beware

[Auvergne]

Took delivery of our 535/4 2008 VIP yesterday. Aggrieved to find that although brochure states "NEW microwave oven in NEW dedicated cupboard with vent and tambour door", the microwave was under the bed in a box. In the empty cupboard was a sticker saying "microwave to be taken out for transit". The microwave booklet states "There is no fixing kit available, microwave to be used on countertop only".

The salesman tells us that Coachman are the only company not fixing microwaves in situ. The only countertop available would put the microwave right in front of the telly, and it has to be lifted in and out and stowed each time - all for the fantastic price of £15,900!!!

Needless to say I am taking this further - misrepresentation/not fit for purpose - I'll let you know how I get on.

 

[mauron]

Hi Valerie,

Sorry to hear about your new caravan, it's not really good enough when manufacturers are expecting you to keep your end of a deal yet they can fob off their customers with anything they wish.

Surely, it can't be beyond the wit of these manufacturers to put a microwave in the designated position - to say that there is no fixing kit hardly an excuse.

It's a good job Coachman are not building space shuttles!!!!!!!

Let us know how you go on.

 

[Hedgehog1]

To be honest I would not hold out much hope as all manufacturers (across all of industry) reserve the right to alter and change any aspect of design and/or specification without notice.

T

 

[Auvergne]

As promised, here is today's progress (or not). I have received an email....

"The microwave oven can only be fitted in its designated cupboard when the caravan is static and must be removed for transporting from site to site. We would not recommend building it in as it is an extremely heavy object and additionally when in use generates quite a lot of heat which requries the ventilation provided".

Don't I know its extremely heavy - obviously not suitable for a mobile environment - not fit for purpose. This is not the end of it. I will update as I go along.

No Coachmans will have their microwaves fitted - you have been warned!!!

 

[Chaps]

When we ordered our Geist last year, the microwave was an optional extra with no dedicated 'home'. We really wanted one as, with kids, it makes life that bit easier so Geist fitted into a cupboard underneath the oven (it's not a full depth oven) and they have done a first class job. They put an extra electrical socket in, created a secure housing for the microwave and cut the door down to fit the space left underneath which has left us with a small, useful storage space. The result is a very tidy job - you'd never know it wasn't meant to be there and, in our opinion, is actually a lot safer and more practical than some of the housings you see in overhead lockers. Oh, and they did all of this for no extra charge!

Perhaps there is a cupboard that could be adapted in such a way in your Coachman. Know you shouldn't have to mess about but if it solves your problem then it's worth a go.

 

[Parksy]

Hi Valerie

It's such a shame when you buy something new only to have the shine knocked off by something like this. When you looked round the caravan showroom was the microwave in the cupboard, and was the fact that the microwave must be removed for transit purposes pointed out to you?

Could you use the microwave from inside your awning? Not ideal I know but at least it could remain in the awning for the duration of your holiday.

Our is fixed in an upper cupboard on our Abbey, and it remains there all of the time.

Good luck with whatever action that you take, and I hope that you enjoy your new caravan despite the microwave issue.

 

[Stephen_374341239]

Hi

Have you tried Trading Standards Yet.If the sales person did not say that the microwave had to be stowed for traveling I would think you have a good case.

 

[Dustydog]

Interestingly our new Wyoming had a sticker saying the glass turntable must be removed during transit . Otherwise the microwave stays where it is semi permanently mounted.

Keep on that them and follow all the other members thoughts.

Cheers

Alan

 

[davedee]

Hello Valerie. What make of microwave oven do you have in the VIP?

Our Laser has the Sharp R-259 according to the operation manual and cookbook but the Sharp R-249 according to the Coachman owners manual.

Whatever, the van handbook makes no mention of siting the oven or indeed removal during transit.

Turning to the Sharp operation manual, I see what you mean about the statement; "No built-in kit is available for this oven.This oven is designed to be used on a countertop only".

Worrying at first sight, but when you think about it, these ovens are not made solely for use in caravans but for the general domestic market. The way I read it, this particular oven is not suitable for building into a sealed kitchen unit - Hygena, mfi,b&q, etc.- like an integrated washer,dishwasher,fridge,etc.

Having said that, the one thing that I did spot in the Sharp book was the minimum 15cm required headroom. I can't check ours yet as the van's in storage but I would doubt that there is anything like 6ins of clear space between the oven top and the top of the cupboard.

If you check yours for headroom would you post it on here please - save me a 12mile round trip!

I don't think the micro would become dislodged in transit due to the feet being trapped to some extent in the round securing socketty things in the cupboard. And the tambour door feels fairly secure.

The only reason I can think of for Coachman saying it must be removed for travelling would be that the construction of the cupboards is not sturdy enough to take the weight over bumps etc.

They may think that the oven, tambour, cupboard and the whole shooting match will end up on the floor via the galley worktop.

Regards, Dave (Yorkshire)

 

[Alan_374342797]

Valerie

I also have a new Coachman Amara Festival 380 on order with the microwave potential issue. But I read up and noticed it was brought up in a caravan mag not sure which, I have read that many, and Coachman stated it was for safety reasons they recommended it was removed too the floor for traveling. When you think 15+Kg at near roof height they may have a point. The tester also commented that there was a handy wooded batten that could be used to fix it(no details where it came from) but of course did not condone this. But stated he wondered how many caravanners would lift such an heavy item down for traveling.

Personnally I dont think this is anything to worry about, I will

find a nice wooded batten and fix it, but of course I will always lower it for travel.

No problem at all, we have chosen the best made caravans you can buy in the uk, we looked at the Hymer at

 

[davedee]

Hi Alan. I would tend to agree with you wholeheartedly about Coachman. At the end of the day we bought one because of the shear quality in the build.

I too feel that Valerie has little to worry about - we put the micro in the cupboard, use it normally and then stow it away for travelling.

My one worry is that the headroom in the cupboard is not as per Sharp's minimum requirement. I'm not sure on this - as I said previously, our van is in storage so I can't check it until tomorrow.

I agree that 15+kg at that height is pushing it a bit. But who knows? One day I may just try it out on the road.

Maybe a lighter weight micro that doesn't need so much headroom may be the answer - they're cheap enough!

Enjoy your van,Alan. And Val - try to enjoy yours aswell.

Dave.

 

[Del_374232870]

We have 2005 Lunar Delta, this has a fitted micro wave oven which is at eye level and is fixed in place with no problems. There is a vent to the rear of the micro wave and approx 6in free space above with a removable front on this space to allow access for cleaning. never had any problems whilst towing with the van . If lunar and other manufacturers can fit microwaves I can see why coachman cant. As it is a removable item is the weight of the microwave included in the van weight or does it take up some of the load margin.

 

[davedee]

Good point,Del re micro weight inclusion in van weight.

As the Options Payload is only 3kg, I would say it will be included in the allowance for Essential Habitation Equipment....or is it???

BTW, Alan. The 'handy wooden batten'thing. It comes with the van and has two magnetic catche to fasten it to the top of the cupboard framework to fill in the gap to the micro.

Dave

 

[Auvergne]

Hi, me again.

Well, Coachman advise that all their "tests with the UK Sharp agents have been carried out using the designated cupboard, and the installation of the microwave for this area during use has been approved. Obviously, caravan installation is a minimal part of Sharp sales and therefore they do not provide a dedicated handbook referring to the installation of their unit in our product, but as stated previously the unit is approved for use in the location specified in our literature."

We went legal and were advised that the Coachman spec is a clear misrepresentation in that it says about the microwave being IN the dedicated cupboard with vent and tambour door. However, we learned that as our contract is with the dealer and not with Coachman, it is the dealer we have to take to task. This seems somewhat unfair but we are told that the dealer becomes responsible for all the advertising literature of the product et al when they enter into a contract to sell.

This weekend we took the van our for the first time and....the door dropped 2" on the Friday night and had to be lifted to be closed and opened if you please. We were up at the crack of dawn on the Sunday and drove the 96 miles back to the dealers where the caravan remains.

Whilst there we mentioned diplomatically the situation re the microwave and the dealer has spoken to Coachman direct and agreed to build it in to the cupboard for us. They are confident they can do it so it looks like its all systems go. After all, we have it in black and white from the Aftercare Operations Manager at Coachman that the microwave is "an extremely heavy piece of equipment". There is a possibility they are leaving themselves open for claims of injury, particularly with older caravanners, whilst moving the microwave to and from the housing.

So there we are, hope this little tale has been of help to somebody - thanks to everyone for your comments and best wishes.

Happy caravanning!

 

[davedee]

Thanks for that Valerie. You've put a lot of effort into resolving this problem.

Dave

ps Do you have the number for ClaimsDirect? - I'm still lifting in and out!

 

[Auvergne]

Ha ha. You won't be laughing if you strain your greens Dave!!!!!

Val.

 

[davedee]

Ha ha. You won't be laughing if you strain your greens Dave!!!!!

Val.

Never heard them called that before,Val.

When you get your van back,do you think you could let us know how they've modified the cupboard to house the micro permanently.

Incidentally, who is your dealer. If you can't name names, an area will suffice.

Thanks, Dave

 

[Forbes1]

Valerie, I'm sorry to hear your disappointment as I've got an Amara which is fantastic. However if you look in the Practical Caravan mag when they tested the 2 berth, you can see quite clearly the sticker at the back of the microwave cupboard stating that it must be removed for transit. Something I found a little odd I must say! Hope it goes well for you.

 

[Auvergne]

Valerie, I'm sorry to hear your disappointment as I've got an Amara which is fantastic. However if you look in the Practical Caravan mag when they tested the 2 berth, you can see quite clearly the sticker at the back of the microwave cupboard stating that it must be removed for transit. Something I found a little odd I must say! Hope it goes well for you.

Thats the point Ron, in the showrooms the microwave is placed in the cupboard for show, thereby covering up the sticker. We were told by the dealer that it would be fitted.

Glad you like your Amara, we're very pleased with our VIP on the whole, we were thankful for the build quality on Friday night in those horrendous winds!

 

[davedee]

Hi Val. When you get the van back from the dealer,would you be so kind as to let us know how they've modified the cupboard to take the microwave permanently.

BTW, who is your dealer or what area if you can't name names (I'm talking caravans here,nothing else).

Dave

 

[Auvergne]

No prob, don't think its going to be ready till Thursday. Will let you know.

 

[davedee]

Thanks Val.

Dave

 

[Icemaker]

to be honest i think a microwave at eye level is a disaster waiting to happen and being an avid coachman fan im surprised they have even considered putting the machine so high, i know other manufacturers do this but coachman have a reputation for quality and this is not a desition i would think worthy of them.

just imagine lifting something out and you catch the edge of the dish on the lip of the turntable the contents spill out and your scalded probably all over your face, its an horific thought and one which im sure will happen sooner or later.

valerie, which door are you talking about regarding the 2 inch drop ? is it the cupboard door or are you refering to the main van door ?. i imagine your talking about the cupboard as the main hinges are only able to move a few milimeters unless they come off completely, but looking at the cupboard doors i cant see how they could drop 2 inches either without coming right off. i am only asking as im interested to know what the fault is.

We are now on our 4th new coachman we have had a pastiche 520/4 a vip 520/4 a laser 590/4 and now a 2007 vip 530/4 and hand on heart i have never had one single fault on any of them, they have all been superb and totally reliable despite being used every 3 weeks all year round.

personally i wouldnt have the microwave fitted in any of my vans i know its each to theire own but if it can be cooked in a microwave then in my opinion its not worth eating.

 

[Auvergne]

Hiya,

Sorry for confusion, it was the main door to the van that had dropped. The dealer said he'd never come across such a fault and I felt he was genuine.

I understand totally your point about the microwave at eye level - we don't think it'll be a problem in our house as we are a tall bunch, my son is 6ft5"!

I must admit, working full time the last thing i want to do is cook when I go away for the weekend. My motto is "if you can ping it, pack it!"

 

[ValA.]

We've been looking at various vans recently - and the 'high-up' microwave seems to be popular. Like the previous poster, I just wonder how soon it will be before someone badly scalds themselves - I know how often I've caught and tipped dishes in my top oven - which is nowhere near as high up, or difficult to reach, as in some of the vans we've seen. Fortunately I've done no damage to myself, but dropped a dish onto the tiled kitchen floor and cracked a tile - but better on the floor than on me!!