Don't let the doom and gloom about UK caravan build quality stop you from checking the obvious and cause you to jump to conclusions.

[JezzerB]

As you all know and some of you have sadly experienced, a lot of people have found build quality of UK caravans on occasion, shall we say, lacking! We've had two brand new vans after our wonderful little Avondale (which did seem to have an issue on every trip out, but it was of a good age). Both have been good and pretty painless in terms of ownership, but this Buccaneer, our latest one has been outstanding. The quality of fit and finish, and the application of sealant in particular , has particularly impressed after I spent a day removing excess from various areas of our Bailey. We have had two small faults; after a torrential storm and a service the same week a small amount of moisture was found in the locker; new one due to be fitted imminently. And the sticky awning alarm relay leaving the awning light on permanently; pet hate of SMBO.
Any way we were away for the bank hols week and of course it was lovely for a couple of days before-with all windows open. Then the heavens opened and so did, apparently, the skylight of our van-a sudden waterfall appeared. Instant panic, I mopped up, rang the dealer and as soon as the rain stopped borrowed site ladders and got the gaffer tape at the ready. Only to find that some dope (yes me) hadn't shut the skylight properly leaving it on a sort of second step or vent setting. What a.................... sheepish and apologetic email to the dealer etc etc. Hopefully no damage done and no stains or marks anywhere! But the moral of the story; check the obvious and never jump to conclusions !!!!

 

[PTA]

Maybe Hymer's large cash injection into Elddis is now paying a quality dividend?
( I know Hymer has been taken over by a US group).

 

[otherclive]

Hope it hasn’t got any lasting damage. A bit like when we were in France watching a real cracker of a storm from within the van. Our neighbours were doing the same from their awning. Then after the storm they went in to get more wine and oh the anguish when they realised the roof light had been left fully open. We helped by supplying towels and taking some stuff into our awning to help drying out. Easily done.

 

[Buckman]

Wish it was that simple with cracks in panels!

 

[Beachball]

Last time out we were next to a seasonal van, after a day of windy weather I noticed that their heki was open and banging around. Went to inform the site owner who contacted the owner to come and close it. He came went in closed it, but no thankyou for being a good neighbour. Felt a little put out as not even a knock on the window to say thanks for helping, sad to say it does make you wonder about people and if they would do the same for you?

 

[Buckman]

Last time out we were next to a seasonal van, after a day of windy weather I noticed that their heki was open and banging around. Went to inform the site owner who contacted the owner to come and close it. He came went in closed it, but no thank you for being a good neighbour. Felt a little put out as not even a knock on the window to say thanks for helping, sad to say it does make you wonder about people and if they would do the same for you?

It is probably unlikely that the site owner would have told them who reported it as everyone is scared of data protection as they do not understand it fully. 😏

 

[Dustydog]

Maybe you have been lucky Jezzer. All my caravans from new have had issues, cracked panels, all corrected by the Dealer under warranty. Lots of little things have failed over the years , mostly fixed by me. The longer I keep a caravan the better it becomes😉. Must be all the diy😜I think the, roll of a dice , may determine a good or bad product. As discussed many times it’s all down to the quality of skill employed and quality control. Some people have been unlucky.
Check the manufacturers accounts and you will be surprised how much money they hold in reserve for warranty issues.

 

[ProfJohnL]

I estimate that if caravan manufacturers really managed their production properly with a view to reducing incorrect construction, they could potentially reduce their sale prices by more than £1000. Amazingly they would maintain their profit on a smaller turnover, and have far more satisfied customers and dealers. Seems like a win win for everyone. But ........ don't hold your breath....

 

[Sam Vimes]

Coming from an industry that was very quality conscious, the message was that it always costs more to put things right after shipping than doing it right first time. Unfortunately as time went on the bean counters began to rule and billing was more important than repairing.

 

[Dustydog]

I wonder how detailed the PDI is by the Dealer. If we buy a brand new caravan again I’m seriously considering getting my AWS engineer to do a thorough check. Has anyone done this or is it over cautious?

 

[ProfJohnL]

I wonder how detailed the PDI is by the Dealer. If we buy a brand new caravan again I’m seriously considering getting my AWS engineer to do a thorough check. Has anyone done this or is it over cautious?

I suspect that calling the work a dealer is supposed to do before selling a caravan is more of a Pre Delivery Preparation, rather than an Inspection.

They will have a predefined list of jobs such as removing plastic bags off the soft furnishings and setting them in place, and I suspect the "Inspection" is more of "if you see anything falling off", rather than a detailed thorough check on the condition of everything.

Dealers should not have to do a PDI. Its an industry cop out that allows product to be shifted from the factory even though it may not have been fully checked at the factory, and passing the buck to the dealer.

Based on the number of reports of customers finding significant flaws with new caravans, demonstrates the PDI system does not work properly, so why should customers pay for it?

 

[Sam Vimes]

I suspect that in some instances the buck is passed beyond the dealer to the customer. There has been some anecdotal evidence that some manufacturers ship stuff that's not fully tested or inspected and let the customers find the problems.

 

[Raywood]

I know that feeling with the roof light. When we bought out Trophy many years ago the weather was hot and dry and the forecast more of the same so I left the roof light open to keep it cool before the next days trip and guess what, the forecast was wrong. Luckily the carpet was all that got wet and it did dry out without staining. I also once got a phone call from the storage to say it was open.
As for problems the only serious one we have had was damp on the previous Lunar, but it was fixed under guarantee with no problem. The dealers good service meant we bought the latest from them.
Other problems have been modest, so may be we have been lucky and unlike what most said about them, the Avondale was virtually trouble free.

 

[Buckman]

I wonder how detailed the PDI is by the Dealer. If we buy a brand new caravan again I’m seriously considering getting my AWS engineer to do a thorough check. Has anyone done this or is it over cautious?

I doubt if some dealers inspect the caravan before delivery. This was one of a number of faults on delivery. Others include door knob falling off. Decal peeling off. On arrival at the first campsite after collecting the caravan cracks were found around the offside grab handle. All these issues should have been picked up at the PDI. As it happened we rejected the caravan 11 months later!

 

[Buckman]

Dealers should not have to do a PDI. Its an industry cop out that allows product to be shifted from the factory even though it may not have been fully checked at the factory, and passing the buck to the dealer.

TBH I do not think that they check for quality or anything on any caravan coming off the line as dictated by the bean counters as it would cost too much! Anyway if a caravan had a fault, the manufacturer probably would not have the skilled manpower to rectify the issue.

 

[ProfJohnL]

TBH I do not think that they check for quality or anything on any caravan coming off the line as dictated by the bean counters as it would cost too much! Anyway if a caravan had a fault, the manufacturer probably would not have the skilled manpower to rectify the issue.

I agree with teh sentiment of your first sentence, but I do know the reality is some things are checked but perhaps not very well which gives the impression that nothing is checked.

For far too long all the caravan manufacturers have allowed unsatisfactory products to leave the factory, becasue, they supposedly have the PDI system where dealers are expected to capture and correct faults. But as we know that system frequently fails witnessed by the numbers of faults the dealers allow to reach the end user.

For a fault, however small, to get through two stages of inspection and then to rely on the customer to complain or raise a warranty claim is indefensible. Caravanners have been a soft touch, mainly becasue they have been groomed (by historical experiences) to expect their new caravans to have faults, and in some cases they don't even bother to report small faults, preferring to correct it themselves which is quicker, often simpler and cheaper. Unfortunately this acceptance of faults by the end user has allowed the whole caravan supply and manufacturer to become very careless in their duty of care to produce faultfree products.

 

[JezzerB]

But it happens in other industries too; cars undergo pdi, just like caravans and of course with caravans there are many items that aren't put in at the factory but are dealer fit even thought they're simply bought as optional extras-for eg aircon and solar panel on ours are done by the dealer. Lots of scope for damage to the van en route too so a PDI is essential. Amazing how many cars are damaged in transit to a dealer or in storage apparently.

Plus of course they're a bit different to cars; shower doors cupboard doors etc; all bound to settle as the caravan gets hammered down the motorway on our lovely road surfaces; we looked at a swift once-new and the shower door wasn't fully in place. I'm not making excuses but i do think a pdi is essential just like it is in cars and snagging in a house-all the same sort of thing; and i do think many issues are actually caused by dealers not being conscientious enough-either by not spotting issues or testing and checking, or by not nagging the manufacturer about the amount of work they have to do if they have to do it!

 

[Buckman]

But it happens in other industries too; cars undergo pdi, just like caravans and of course with caravans there are many items that aren't put in at the factory but are dealer fit even thought they're simply bought as optional extras-for eg aircon and solar panel on ours are done by the dealer. Lots of scope for damage to the van en route too so a PDI is essential. Amazing how many cars are damaged in transit to a dealer or in storage apparently.

Plus of course they're a bit different to cars; shower doors cupboard doors etc; all bound to settle as the caravan gets hammered down the motorway on our lovely road surfaces; we looked at a swift once-new and the shower door wasn't fully in place. I'm not making excuses but i do think a pdi is essential just like it is in cars and snagging in a house-all the same sort of thing; and i do think many issues are actually caused by dealers not being conscientious enough.

We have never had an issue with a new car that involved us running back and forth to the dealer even for a small issue unlike a caravan when in the first few months you have numerous hassles even though it was supposed to have a PDI.

I agree with teh sentiment of your first sentence, but I do know the reality is some things are checked but perhaps not very well which gives the impression that nothing is checked.

For far too long all the caravan manufacturers have allowed unsatisfactory products to leave the factory, becasue, they supposedly have the PDI system where dealers are expected to capture and correct faults. But as we know that system frequently fails witnessed by the numbers of faults the dealers allow to reach the end user.

For a fault, however small, to get through two stages of inspection and then to rely on the customer to complain or raise a warranty claim is indefensible. Caravanners have been a soft touch, mainly becasue they have been groomed (by historical experiences) to expect their new caravans to have faults, and in some cases they don't even bother to report small faults, preferring to correct it themselves which is quicker, often simpler and cheaper. Unfortunately this acceptance of faults by the end user has allowed the whole caravan supply and manufacturer to become very careless in their duty of care to produce faultfree products.

As mentioned earlier, surely all the warranty claims must make an substantial impact into their profit margin? Dealers do not like warranty claims as they are paid a lower rate than if they are doing the same repair out of warranty.
I am in the group that makes the dealer repair even very minor faults and if we had more people doing the same thing, just maybe dealers would put pressure onto manufacturers to improve the end product, but then pigs may fly!

 

[JezzerB]

You're lucky re cars then but not really what I meant. There are plenty out there who struggle to get repairs on new cars too , to their satisfaction but it has improved massively. There was a recent article in the press where a Landrover owner parked his vehicle outside the dealership blocking access and advertising to all they'd had numerous goes at fixing it!
Re our caravan we're very lucky there have been no little things to fix-just the two items I mentioned. 2 1/2 years and over 70 nights away in 2021 and so far delighted. Lucky?

 

[Dustydog]

You have to look deeper to how the caravan Industry is run and dare I say governed. The alleged “ruling” body is the NCC. Look who are the main players? A few big Dealers, Manufacturers.CRIS, a few others. A very cosy if not clandestine group🤔. No pressure from anywhere else. A very nice earner for those involved . But the Industry as a whole needs a big shake up and perhaps more focus on the end consumer than those on the NCC.

 

[ProfJohnL]

You have to look deeper to how the caravan Industry is run and dare I say governed. The alleged “ruling” body is the NCC. Look who are the main players? A few big Dealers, Manufacturers.CRIS, a few others. A very cosy if not clandestine group🤔. No pressure from anywhere else. A very nice earner for those involved . But the Industry as a whole needs a big shake up and perhaps more focus on the end consumer than those on the NCC.

The NCC is not the ruling body, it is only a trade organisation that is funded by its members.

It may provide a focal point for contact with the industry, but it most certainly does not rule or force any associated business to undertake any activity against their will.

The members of the NCC may approve the NCC to represent the industries interests by participating in national or international standards committees, and lobbying members of parliament and government bodies to press the industries point of view.

In its position it may facilitate industry wide consultations and produce technical advice that interpret legislative or regulatory requirements which its members agree to follow.

The only sanction the NCC can enforce is the expulsion of a member from the NCC.

There is no legal requirement for any business to follow NCC guidelines and contrary to popular belief caravan products do not have to be approved by the NCC before sale to the public.

 

[Raywood]

I do believe some dealers do not do the PDI and just see if the customer complains and deal with those. On our last caravan the PDI form which was a tick box to be checked off as they went round was still in the customer welcome pack although to be fair we did not find any serious problems.
Another dealer we had previously used were better and set aside Mondays to do them and doing other work in the rest of the week. They possibly did some work on a Monday if they had time.
Like any industry there are good and bad dealers and quite a few in between.

 

[Buckman]

I do believe some dealers do not do the PDI and just see if the customer complains and deal with those. On our last caravan the PDI form which was a tick box to be checked off as they went round was still in the customer welcome pack although to be fair we did not find any serious problems.
Another dealer we had previously used were better and set aside Mondays to do them and doing other work in the rest of the week. They possibly did some work on a Monday if they had time.
Like any industry there are good and bad dealers and quite a few in between.

On a previous brand new caravan the dealer noted on the tick sheet that no shocks fitted although shocks had been fitted by themselves!
At another time we had a service done and all we got was an invoice so I asked for the tick list and also the damp report. The person disappeared into a back office however unknown to them I could see their reflection in the door glass.
It looked as it the person only pulled out the forms for the tick box and damp report and sat there ticking all the relevant boxes which should have been done at time of service. the damp report stated no damp over 10% detected, but the diagram was not marked with the relevant readings!

 

[JezzerB]

On a previous brand new caravan the dealer noted on the tick sheet that no shocks fitted although shocks had been fitted by themselves!
At another time we had a service done and all we got was an invoice so I asked for the tick list and also the damp report. The person disappeared into a back office however unknown to them I could see their reflection in the door glass.
It looked as it the person only pulled out the forms for the tick box and damp report and sat there ticking all the relevant boxes which should have been done at time of service. the damp report stated no damp over 10% detected, but the diagram was not marked with the relevant readings!

Good grief, you wouldn't be going back there-shocking!

 

[Buckman]

Good grief, you wouldn't be going back there-shocking!

Nope that was only the beginning of a catalogue of failures by that dealer. Annoyingly over the years we had bought at least 4 caravans from them.