Double glazed window warranty

[Pedr01800]

My new in May caravan has a large curved front window, which lights up the interior a treat
But have noticed that a mystical pattern has appeared on the outer surface of the inner part of the double galzing.
There is a space of roughly one inch between layers.
Looking from inside out, in the upper section, there is a distinct but non obscuring pattern, similar to snake skin patterning.
As access to the surface is impossible without dissection, I have presumed there is a manufacturing defect.
My dealer has some photos I sent of the offending window, and agrees there is possibly a warranty claim for replacement window. But the manufacturer will have to see the part before agreeing to replace.
However, they will want me to return the caravan to them for inspection and perhaps rectification.
That would mean a 150 mile journey, one way, and go home to return another day.
Some 600 miles of diesel in my Discovery to pay for.
It seems I have no redress for that additional expense, to a van only 5 months old.
I have mentioned the Sale of Goods Act in correspondence today, as potential motivator for expenses reimbursement.
Do other contributors have any thoughts and advice for dealing with warranty issues with vendors, where expensive journeys are needed.. Look forward to replies.

 

[Damian]

If the window is faulty, and it seems that it is suffering from the two panes touching when being towed so should qualify for replacement.
The choice of dealer you bought from is your choice and you knew how far away it was when you bought, so whilst the repair is free, the cost to return is yours.
It is for this very reason that it is not always best to buy a long distance from your home base.

 

[ProfJohnL]

Hello Pedro

If the replacement is carried out under the Manufacturers Guarantee, then depending on the terms and conditions, you may well have to stand the inconvenience of having to return the caravan to a dealer for the inspection and repairs to be carried out.

You state your caravan is only 5 months old, and that could be good news, because the way the Sale of Goods Act works, changes when the goods are more than 6 months old from the date of purchase. In the case of a caravan the date of purchase will be the date you sign to accept the caravan when you collect it.

At up to six months any fault (that is not due to ware and tare) is assumed to have either been present at the point of purchase, or a latent defect which has taken time to become detectable. The seller should be offering a replacement window under SoGA.

If the dealer wishes to challenge the claim, they must prove the defect was not present at the point of purchase and that its has occurred due to unreasonable usage. However at 6 months old, the situation changes and the burden of proof then falls on the customer to prove the fault was present at the point of purchase.

The claim does not hinge on the manufacturer's assessment, as you have no contract with the manufacturer, only with the seller.

If a repair is carried out under SoGA, It should be the minimum of inconvenience to the customer. The seller is responsible for the retrieval of the item and to cover any losses incurred as a direct result of the fault and the means of rectifying it.

I suggest you Google, the "Consumer Associations" and then look up how to complain. They have stock letters you can use to initiate the process .

However if the caravan is 6 months old, as I stated above the burden of proof changes, and that could make the whole process a lot more difficult, and it may not be worth the effort to establish the evidence about the fault.

If you choose to have the work carried out under the Manufacturer's warranty, then try negotiating with the manufacturer to have the inspection and any work carried out at a more local dealer.

Good luck

 

[Craigyoung]

Hi Pedro ,
we have had a similar problem as what you are describing , we to have a large front window at the front of our caravan which lets light in my lovely , but on returning from a trip last year from France we discovered we had a mark on the front window - sort of like angel wings or as if a pigeon had hit the front of it but of course the wife blamed me for what I was cleaning it with but on returning to the place we purchased the caravan , they said straight away it will be replaced under warranty but then took about 6-7 weeks for new one to come in and like you but not at far we have a 100 mile round trip to where we got ours from it was replaced under warranty no problem but once again on returning from a long trip away we discovered it happening again less than 1 year from when new one has been put in so once again the caravan place where we bought it was contacted again and we were told that it may not be under warranty this time as it was replaced under warranty last time and that my origonal 2 year warranty on buying the van was to run out within the week when we we made the call but like yourself we mention the sales of good act and they took pictures . The claim has again been passed and now waiting for a second new window to be put in our caravan I am not happy that this is happening again but at least it is getting sorted again .
Hope you get your sorted.

 

[Gafferbill]

.......this problem is well known.

A large single plastic window across the front of a caravan often simply does not have enough rigidity to maintain the gap between the two panes of the double glazed unit when the caravan is being towed at speed.
The theory is that when towing the air pressure on the frontal area of the caravan forces the outside pane to flex against the inner pane causing the damage.

For this reason I would never buy a caravan with a large single front window......but that is just my opinion.

 

[Pedr01800]

The space between panes is about one inch, so unlikely to deflect that much during journey, besides which, I used a fabric stone protector which covers most of window.
The Swift rep told me yesterday at NEC that they would be contacting selling agent to see photos submitted, and would liaise with them regarding an potential replacement, bearing in mind my approved technician is recognised by sellers, but not yet on the makers list.
Seems possibility of getting window replaced without having to drive hundreds of miles.
Watch this space.

 

[WoodlandsCamper]

... besides which, I used a fabric stone protector which covers most of window.

A fabric cover will not stop windows deflecting when under pressure from travelling.

 

[RayS]

If you open the window to about 45 degrees and lock the stays you should be able to reach to either side of the window and press gently with one finger of each hand. The panes will probably deflect until your finger tips are very close together and may even cause the panes to touch.

I had a similar problem and the dealer indicated that their limit on warranty replacement - from the maker - was that the gap with moderate finger pressure should be 2mm. or less.

Having ascertained this was the case they then took photographs of corner of the window with all the data numbers in it (Not the Cris registration number) and a new window was supplied in around 8 weeks. There is no need to remove the defective window until the new one is available and fitting is a matter of minutes, so you don't need to leave the van with the dealer for the manufacture time not to discontinue using it if you wish.

On the matter of SOGA, suggest you do the research suggested by the Prof. but in the meantime write or email the dealer and register that you are reporting the fault formally within 6 months of purchase (i.e. the date you signed for the van) and that you expect the matter to be handled under SOGA not warranty rules. SOGA states that faults so reported must be repared without involving further cost to the purchaser, so you can insist that the dealer collects and returns the van or pays your costs of doing so.
Such insistence got my van inspected and the window fitted at my home, rather than two trips to the dealer. Admittedly this was not far out of their way, but it saved me time trouble and money.

On the more general matter of SOGA I had very poor experience in trying to find a solicitor who would even answer my enquiries about enforcement, despite getting a list of solicitors allegedly specialising in such matter from the Law Society itself. Complaints back to the Law Society were equally fruitless. So SOGA sounds good but may be very difficult to enforce and I suspect the dealers know this.

 

[Raywood]

You have reported the problem within six months so you should have an automatic right to replacement. I would ask if the dealer would accept photos of the damage although they have no obligation or an independent engineers report. I believe that you can in fact claim the costs back if they insist on you taking it in though.
If you are a member of either of the big clubs they have a legal helpline which might help. If not check your household insurer for one or union if you are in one. The citizens advice helpline could also be worthwhile trying.

 

[Pedr01800]

I met a Maker Customer Service agent at the NEC on Thurs last, and very understanding of the difficulties explained, regarding liaison between vendor and myself.
Requested to have the photos sent forward to maker. But told her the vendor has a set.
Now advised the two firms will be in touch to sort out a remedy.
Next phase awaited anxiously as time is fast disappearing.

 

[Craigyoung]

Hi Pedro ,
I have no doubt you'll get your window fitted no problem under warranty as I said in my last reply mine was fitted no bother within 1 year of buying the van and then once again in the last few weeks another one is getting ready to be fitted and that is both on return trips from France with a trip mileage of just under 3000 miles in 3 weeks , even though the windows should withstand any amount of towing this should not happen all the time but if it happened to be a common occurrence I will keep going down and trying to get another window if it happens again and again . Once again , I hope you get sorted .

 

[Pedr01800]

Thanks for thoughts Craig, Not heard of a resolution yet, but hopeful

 

[Craigyoung]

Hi Pedro , it's been a while , did you ever get your window warranty issue sorted as my 2nd one has been approved & delivered nearly 5 months later !! Now like yourself it's over a 1oo mile round trip to get it fitted - which will be done whilst I wait , took 2o minutes last time !

Craig .

 

[Hutch]

I had a center front window on a Coachman 545, with the same problem of marking between the panes, wqrranty replacment was done in about 20 minutes, the new window was about 10 mm further apart,, apparently the new model window.
Hutch.

 

[Pedr01800]

Swift thinks it can be replaced under warranty, when examined ?
. Trip to dealer to do that !
Dealer is happy to do fitting when Swift replacement available at the dealers premises.
Another trip possibly.
Still stuck with trip of couple of hundred miles return to carry out what "might be" replacement.
Not assured it will be done, but all think it ought to be done !
Indecisive.
But dealer is sure that they are not going to pay for my diesel, let alone time, whether replacing window or not as the situation demands.
Cleft stick situation.
Live with it or bite the bullet and travel to dealer.

 

[Raywood]

Swift thinks it can be replaced under warranty, when examined ?
. Trip to dealer to do that !
Dealer is happy to do fitting when Swift replacement available at the dealers premises.
Another trip possibly.
Still stuck with trip of couple of hundred miles return to carry out what "might be" replacement.
Not assured it will be done, but all think it ought to be done !
Indecisive.
But dealer is sure that they are not going to pay for my diesel, let alone time, whether replacing window or not as the situation demands.
Cleft stick situation.
Live with it or bite the bullet and travel to dealer.

Tell them you want your diesel and other expenses or they will be in the small claims court.

 

[Craigyoung]

It could've been wwindopedro , you could've been driving a long way and having to pay for the window . And Hutch , when replaced the first time ,they also said the panes would be thicker and a slightley bigger gap - so it wouldnt happen again . . . And it has ! So how many times is this going to happen ?!?!? :huh:

 

[Hutch]

Craig, have you checked on a newer model of your van to see if they have modified the front window. Maybe I was lucky and Coachman didnt have any of my years window and only had the newer type.The van was only 9 months old, and about 4000 miles. At least you should have another years Warranty on the new window.
Hutch.

 

[Craigyoung]

Hi hutch , ( or should I say Sir were-rabbitt ) sorry for the the late reply but the answer to your question is no I have not looked at the Next Model from my Orion as they don't make them anymore & I've not really looked into the windows of the next model up from mine which I think is the Baileys vibe or jazz but hopefully this window should be ok - at least for another year or so if the other 2 are anything to go by ! haha

Craig.

 

[Douglas_374404558]

Pedro I had the similar problem with a Bailey Pegasus GT65 Rimini 3 yrs old front curved window inner/outer pains touching , contacted my dealer ,who contacted Bailey ,who contacted the manufacturer of the window .they replaced the window after me sending some pictures to them ,this sounds harsh, but its not there fault that you stay
1 mile or 101 miles from your dealer .I am 55 miles from my dealer ,what I did was arrange to get them to call you when the new window is in ,arrive at dealer at agreed time and wait for it to be fitted on the same day (only takes about 2. hrs ) then drive home again only two journeys not four, make sure they test it for water leaks when new one fitted ,as mine had a small leak after fitting due to the window being slightly out of line due to the seal around the window getting trapped .Good luck The dealer only supplies the caravan he does not manufacture it .so he should contact the maker on your behalf .