Gas regulations
- Thread starter Buckman
- Start date
Not sure what the regs state tbh, but I do recall once being asked what i wanted 4m of hose for and then being refused it. This about 5 years ago and from a main dealer.
Its a good question.
Its a good question.
There are different regs for domestic and lpg. I don’t think (but could easily be wrong). That the restriction is from the regs. But recommendations concerning safety and trip hazards.
This is a quote from an accessory shop.
IMPORTANT: Flexible gas hose length should be kept to a minimum for your own safety. A maximum of 3 metres can be sold in a continuous length. If using the hose with a Cadac BBQ, their manual states that you must not use a length greater than 1.5m.
Two points.
I have seen people on site unable to get (what I think) is a safe distance from their awning due to the 1.5 metre limit imposed by Cadac!
John
This is a quote from an accessory shop.
IMPORTANT: Flexible gas hose length should be kept to a minimum for your own safety. A maximum of 3 metres can be sold in a continuous length. If using the hose with a Cadac BBQ, their manual states that you must not use a length greater than 1.5m.
Two points.
- “For your own safety”. If they make such a quote they should explain in what respect.
- It demonstrates two different opinions on length. Sugesting there is no regularity fixed length.
I have seen people on site unable to get (what I think) is a safe distance from their awning due to the 1.5 metre limit imposed by Cadac!
John
It explains why i was refused 4m. To clarify, i wanted 2m for the caravan connection and 2m for my regulator to use at home.
May serves to tempt some people to just connect the two smaller lengths. Not a good idea though.
As far as I know there are no regulations that limit the length of hose. However Cadac do say 1.5m is the max. Most dealers restrict the length because they don’t want to be sued for the trip hazard, pulling over of a red hot BBQ, plus their I surfers have probably done a risk assessment. The joke is you can buy any length you like on eBay. Pressure drop,is a red herring. Sensibility is the order of the day. However too short a pipe may result in your BBQ being too close to the gas point on the caravan which may cause fire or heat damage.
We do have an expert. I am sure our Prof will explain in detail all aspects to keep,us safe.👍👍
We do have an expert. I am sure our Prof will explain in detail all aspects to keep,us safe.👍👍
Damian
Moderator
The gas regulations do not apply to touring caravans, or their bits and pieces that are used , such as a Cadac or similar appliance. (Why that is , is still a mystery to me!)
Whilst the "recommendation" is for hoses to be no more than 1.5mtrs, it is NOT legally enforceable or mandatory.
The problems only occur with longer lengths in that the pressure at the appliance may not be sufficient for it to operate as well las it should. Presumably Cadac have determined that 1.5m is ideal.
The other "problem" is that a longer length means there may be more chance of it being a trip hazard or subject to damage by other means.
Outlets stating that a particular length is not allowed are only doing that for their own reasons, nothing to do with regulations.( I was going to use a much more earthly reason but would have to ban myself !!!)
If you so wished , you can buy a reel of 100mtrs , which is how I buy for the business and customers can have any length they wish.
Just shop around there are plenty of outlets that supply lengths to the customer requirement.
Dealers and accessory shops are the last place to get hose, go to your nearest plumbing merchant that sells gas equipment, or via the web.
Whilst the "recommendation" is for hoses to be no more than 1.5mtrs, it is NOT legally enforceable or mandatory.
The problems only occur with longer lengths in that the pressure at the appliance may not be sufficient for it to operate as well las it should. Presumably Cadac have determined that 1.5m is ideal.
The other "problem" is that a longer length means there may be more chance of it being a trip hazard or subject to damage by other means.
Outlets stating that a particular length is not allowed are only doing that for their own reasons, nothing to do with regulations.( I was going to use a much more earthly reason but would have to ban myself !!!)
If you so wished , you can buy a reel of 100mtrs , which is how I buy for the business and customers can have any length they wish.
Just shop around there are plenty of outlets that supply lengths to the customer requirement.
Dealers and accessory shops are the last place to get hose, go to your nearest plumbing merchant that sells gas equipment, or via the web.
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When we have used BBQ’s from the vans gas take off in the past (we are Teppanyaki users now), we were wise enough to route the pipe as safely as possible and have the BBQ a safe distance away. I don’t like the way that we get treated by others, sellers and industry. I find it to be patronising.
Surely it should be sufficient to advise on the safe routing of tubing so as to avoid trips and pulling the BBQ over.
I am not anti safety, just pro common sense,
John
Surely it should be sufficient to advise on the safe routing of tubing so as to avoid trips and pulling the BBQ over.
I am not anti safety, just pro common sense,
John
The other thing to consider is your awning. Most bbq points are within the awning space leaving 1.5m to place your gas bbq very close to the awning side. Apart from any fire risk there is the real risk of fat splashes up the size of an awning. Who would want that when some awnings can cost a couple of grand.
Damian
Moderator
Sadly, "common sense" seems to be lacking in a certain gene pool of the population !!!
Back when we had our Bailey Senator the gas barbecue point was on the offside so we had to obtain a longer length of pipe to be able to use the Cadac on the nearside, near the awning and door, our dealer allowed me to buy whatever length I needed, didn't question the length or what I wanted it for,never had a problem with the Cadac either.
I asked the question because someone on another forum stated it was illegal and when I disputed this was told I was incorrect. We have a Cadac safari with 3m hose and do not ant it close to the awning. However most times it is gathering dust in the garage.
In many things people have great difficulty distinguishing between regulations and recommendations.
So much so that the HSE have had a section of their web site dedicated to the myths for 20 plus years.
John
Damian
Moderator
Once the hose starts transporting the gas through it, it starts to deteriorate. Storage in a garage is not the ideal place to keep it.
It should be inspected thoroughly before use and any cracking of the hose or other damage it should be disposed of and replaced .
I need to check but I recall all my flexible gas pipes are date stamped along the length. Replacement before expiry date is good practice?
Damian
Moderator
The date on the hose is the date it was made, not an expiry date.
The expiry date runs from the first time gas is let through the hose, which could be almost any time up to a couple of years from manufacture.
How it is stored is the crucial thing.
The expiry date runs from the first time gas is let through the hose, which could be almost any time up to a couple of years from manufacture.
How it is stored is the crucial thing.
Makes you wonder what the point of a made date is for. I appreciate your start point but imagine policing checking etc is nigh impossible??
Interestingly the Consumer Guidance Sheet 05 prepared by Liquid Gas UK details "tube" for sub 200 mbar in its section 3, to BS EN 16436-1 Class 1, states this tube has to be marked with the "expiry date". Note that is the black tube, not the quite familiar orange stuff.
Further, as a more general point under section 4.1 there are statements re life span.
Initially, it suggests a service life of 10 years, but for hoses with an expiry date 5 years.
I read this therefore, that classes of hose with a only a manufacturing date, have a 10 year life, Class 1 for 200mbar with also an expiry date [marked EXP DATE] a life up to that, but it is only 5 years from manufacture.
Knowing how critical the method used and exposure to UV and Ozone during storage are, I can only assume these life spans must take into account the poorest of practices, for super safety.
Further, as a more general point under section 4.1 there are statements re life span.
Initially, it suggests a service life of 10 years, but for hoses with an expiry date 5 years.
I read this therefore, that classes of hose with a only a manufacturing date, have a 10 year life, Class 1 for 200mbar with also an expiry date [marked EXP DATE] a life up to that, but it is only 5 years from manufacture.
Knowing how critical the method used and exposure to UV and Ozone during storage are, I can only assume these life spans must take into account the poorest of practices, for super safety.
Damian
Moderator
Its all very well quoting various guidance sheets etc but they are just that, guidance. There are no hard and fast rules or regulations.
In the actual real world it is a bit different and much more leaning towards the safety of the user.
The old black hose is low pressure and made of an inferior quality product which goes very brittle after around 1 year, and as a service engineer I always replace those hoses with the high pressure orange hose as it is far superior, more flexible and does not go brittle after a short period of time.
Again , to be sure of the safety of the owner, the orange hose is replaced at a max of 5 years, but sooner if the hose is damaged in some way.
The high pressure pigtails are changed at 5 years despite them having a longer "notional" life.
I always put a sticker in the gas locker with date changed and next due replacement, but I know that not many workshops do that, why I do not know.
In the actual real world it is a bit different and much more leaning towards the safety of the user.
The old black hose is low pressure and made of an inferior quality product which goes very brittle after around 1 year, and as a service engineer I always replace those hoses with the high pressure orange hose as it is far superior, more flexible and does not go brittle after a short period of time.
Again , to be sure of the safety of the owner, the orange hose is replaced at a max of 5 years, but sooner if the hose is damaged in some way.
The high pressure pigtails are changed at 5 years despite them having a longer "notional" life.
I always put a sticker in the gas locker with date changed and next due replacement, but I know that not many workshops do that, why I do not know.
We initially stuck to cadac advice. I thought it was more to do with pressure than any safety issue re gas as a pipe intact and in good condition won't cause leaks etc. But of course you are then limited by the Hose as to being a safe distance from caravan and awning,seemed daft to me so ours is now longer. Nothing in any cadac books mentions law simply advice,
Basically what I was saying is that we do not use it as do not like cooking on gas. Probably will sell it in the next couple of weeks even though we have only used it 2 or 3 times in the past 5 years.
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Okay, but I doubt anyone reading this thread had assumed that a document form an industry body titled "Consumer Guidance Sheet 05" was or pretends to be anything more that "guidance"?
I can't envisage any reason why an industry body might choose to be complacent and credit an unsafe longer life span for critical items like hoses and tubing, they publish into the public domain.
But clearly adding margins on margins increases safety.
A slight diversion but does anyone change the caravan 30 mb regulator on a time basis or carry a spare. I notice a large difference in prices from £15, to Truma at around £53 and Gaslow at £70+. I appreciate there’s a difference in quality but what a spread in price. Can life be that different?
When we bought gas hose for the CADAC the dealer said one metre for direct connection to the bottle and two if run from the caravan side.
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