Help with checklist for trip to France...

[stephena]

Bought our first caravan in 2010 and its all gone so well we have booked a fortnight in the outskirts of Paris for next year (taking the kids to Disneyland) got a really good deal with Norfolk line and am really looking forward to it...

What do i need to consider before making the trip? I have started the list with the obvious ones:

Passport
Tickets
Plenty of Gas in the bottle
Check the van over tyre pressures etc
GB sticker (came with the van)

I recall as a child we had to stick some stickers over our headlights for travelling through France, is this still the case? Anything obvious i have missed?

 

[ValA.]

Car documents and driving licences
Caravan documents - CRIS registration, etc.
High viz vests, one for each person in the car (not law, but sense - the driver has to have one) - and they should all be in reach if anyone has to get out of the car.
Warning triangles - three is the recommended number for caravans - one behind the caravan, one in front, and one still in the car should have you to leave the van at the roadside, in which case you need another for the car itself should that breakdown elsewhere!
First aid kit.
Spare set of light bulbs
Headlight stickers as you mention
Make a copy of all important documents - scan them, and then send them to yourself in an email, so that in an emergency you can access them all easily.
Breakdown insurance which covers car and caravan.
EHIC (replacement for E111 health insurance card) - make sure you get them from the approved Government website, which costs NOTHING - ie don't use one of the broker websites which will charge you.
Good map book - Michelin Atlas is good - helps you find those 'out of the way, but must see' places.
And those are just off the top of my head.

 

[NickinFrance]

Just to clarify Val's comment, while sensible, neither a First Aid kit or spare bulbs are compulsory in France.
I posted this before but the current advise if you break down on a motorway is:
ASFA, the professional association of autoroute operators, has issued a six point breakdown procedure.

1. i. Switch on your emergency warning lights and park carefully on the hard shoulder. Keep as far as possible to the right, out of the traffic lane, while leaving sufficient room to open the front passenger door.
2. ii. Put on your safety vest before leaving the vehicle.
3. iii. Leave the vehicle via the right-hand passenger door. Make sure all passengers leave from the right-hand side.
4. iv. Get all passengers to safety, behind the safety barrier. Go to the nearest emergency phone, walking behind the safety barrier. If you are unable to ring from the orange coloured emergency phone, then dial 112 from your mobile.
5. v. Alert the emergency services. Pressing the button on the emergency phone puts you through directly to the motorway surveillance team which will identify your location and call out the emergency services immediately. This call is free.
6. vi. Go back to your vehicle and wait for the emergency services. All vehicle occupants should remain together behind the safety barrier.

Interestingly, their advice is specifically not to use the mandatory red warning triangle to avert other roads users, because it necessitates walking on the hard shoulder to do so.
This is despite the legal requirement for drivers to display such a triangle 30 metres to the rear of the vehicle in the event of breakdown.
In order to support their case the association has drawn on a clause in the law which gives drivers some grace not to use it where it would otherwise be dangerous to do so : 'L'obligation de mise en place du triangle ne s'applique pas lorsque cette action constitue une mise en danger manifeste de la vie du conducteur.'
Despite the legal muddle, the French Minister of Transport has stated that the advice from ASFA ‘makes good sense’.

 

[RayS]

A bit of basic French would do no harm and possibly ease the odd situation. If you don't have any from school, Google 'earworms' for a method of getting the basics without books - I've used it for Spanish and found it very suitable for those too old to lean from books - you just listen.

If offered to pay in sterling or euros in supermarkets - pay in euros - your card company will usually be cheaaper than the store on exchange rates.

Fill up in superrmarkets. If towing go through the 24/24 pump lane which takes cards only - routes using the payment kiosk are not generally suitable if towing.

If you can avoid toll routes from Calais / Eurotunnel to Paris - very expensive and the main roads are nearly as good. However, for first time may be worth paying to get you 'tuned in'.

Look at www.viamichelin.com and put your route in (start and finish all that's necessary) Go to options and put in car and caravan. Get and print the route. it will show you exactly the road signs you will see on the way - very comforting when you know what to expect next.
Take it easy - it's not a contest but a holiday.

Enjoy

 

[otherclive]

I put the notes below together for a friend some 3 years ago but a quick read shows most things still relevant. Hope it helps:

Moderator note: Something in the text you insert after this point is causing problems with the post and the remaining text does not appear. Perhaps you could try again.

 

[ValA.]

I tried replying to this earlier, but it wouldn't allow me - perhaps something to do with the above.
I wanted to add that you should make sure you have a spare caravan wheel with you! We've had a puncture in one of the caravan tyres in France, and the sort of reinforced tyres on our van are very hard to get hold of there!

 

[Gafferbill]

…….one important point to be aware of, not mentioned so far, is that your caravan EHU (mains electric connection cable) may not connect with the supply bollards on the site you are going to.
I would imagine that a site near Paris would have the blue Euro connectors in which case you will not have a problem.
However since a Continental connector is relatively cheap to purchase in the UK….
I would take one with me.
http://www.towsure.com/product/349-Continental_Mains_Converter_Lead

Then there is the more complicated problem of reverse polarity of the mains supply on some continental sites.
You need a degree of electrical knowledge to understand this and how to overcome the possible problems
Below is a link to a Caravan club help sheet that explains the problem and describes one method by which it can be overcome.

http://www.caravanclub.co.uk/media/19098/Reversed%20Polarity%20complete.pdf

 

[otherclive]

Other clive

 

[NickinFrance]

…….one important point to be aware of, not mentioned so far, is that your caravan EHU (mains electric connection cable) may not connect with the supply bollards on the site you are going to.
I would imagine that a site near Paris would have the blue Euro connectors in which case you will not have a problem.

I wouldn't lay money on that

Then there is the more complicated problem of reverse polarity of the mains supply on some continental sites.You need a degree of electrical knowledge to understand this and how to overcome the possible problems

Below is a link to a Caravan club help sheet that explains the problem and describes one method by which it can be overcome.http://www.caravanclub.co.uk/media/19098/Reversed%20Polarity%20complete.pdf

Can some please explain exactly what the problem is with 'Reversed Polarity' ?
My Sterling caravan has a double pole Earth Trip Device, all the circuit breakers are double pole & none of the sockets were switched.

 

[otherclive]

I have given up trying to post my input as it is Saved, features on the Forum topic list then disappears. Anyway don't accept that sites with modern CE connectors will not have reverse polarity as we came across one in mid France. As we were only stopping one night we just used the kettle and the disconnected it from the plug when not required, the rest was on 12v battery.

Cheers

Other Clive

 

[Gafferbill]

otherclive
…… the solution is to make up your own adapter lead to resemble your normal caravan EHU cable but only 100cms in length.
This length is so that the join can be placed off the ground under the caravan in the dry.
In either the socket end or the plug end you reverse the blue and brown wire connections.

If you take this adapter cable, a 2 pin continental adapter and your normal EHU cable you will be covered for any scenario of supply bollard or reverse polarity.

 

[Woody3]

Just to expand on the comments re reversed polarity, take a plug-in tester with you. Not only may you need the reverser cable described above if the Schuko (2-pin) outlet wiring is 'reversed' (you can only put the plug in one way round on French sockets) but even though the BS4343 blue connectors are supposed to be polarity concious - i.e. there is a marked L and a marked N pin - it does not follow that the French electrician that wired it took any notice. Unlike our ring main wiring most European wiring is radial so every outlet has its own breaker and in many cases dual pole, so it matters not which way round the supply is connected. Low current (6A) flat Schuko plugs will fit either way round in the socket so by the same argument on most European electrical goods the switch operates on both live and neutral. whereas many UK-market appliances switch only the live as there is certainty as to which is the live wire.
There is no guarantee that there is any earth connection either - which you plug tester will reveal!

 

[NickinFrance]

even though the BS4343 blue connectors are supposed to be polarity concious - i.e. there is a marked L and a marked N pin - it does not follow that the French electrician that wired it took any notice.

BS = BRITISH Standard, so why would a French Electrician take any notice

The French EN 60309 plugs I've seen don't have a L or N marking.

most European wiring is radial so every outlet has its own breaker and in many cases dual pole

Not quite, up to 8 sockets can be connected to each spur & ALL breakers are dual pole (same as my caravan).

whereas many UK-market appliances switch only the live as there is certainty as to which is the live wire.

Is that still the case ?

There is no guarantee that there is any earth connection either - which you plug tester will reveal!

That's another difference between UK & French wiring, In France each property has it's own earth.

Can I repeat my question 'What exactly is the danger of reversed polarity ?'

 

[DeliDave_]

we are going to eurodisney in March but not with caravan,it has its own postcode,77777 and according to viamichelin costs just over 20Euros in tolls with car but saves 2hours which with young children in the car is well worth it.The journey time solo is just under 3hours with a van 3hrs 15mins(optimistically)
Perhaps Nick in France could advise what diesel is costing at the moment there?

 

[NickinFrance]

1.25 - 1.29€ at supermarkets

 

[ValA.]

Hi DeliDave - not posted by Nick in France, but you can find out the current price of fuel in France here. It's a French Government website, and should be updated regularly. You can search by map, by town, by fuel, or by route - use Google translate if you have any problems with the French version. Hope this helps. Diesel in the Pas de Calais area varies at the moment from 1.23 to 1.45 - both prices updated yesterday.

 

[ValA.]

These debates on reverse polarity always cause 'polarisation' of views. We camped and caravanned in France for the first twenty-five years without knowing, or worrying, or doing anything, about reverse polarity, only finding out about it from forums like this one. We still do nothing about it! We hook-up and switch on. My take on it is that modern caravans are protected, the manufacturers (Swift and Bailey) have said so, and that if it was ANY problem at all then French campsite owners (and the owners of any other establishments where we might plug into a French electric plug) would need to warn you on each electrical outlet! The Health and Safety Bureaucrats at the Eu would make sure of that. They don't!!!
Our take on the issue is DON'T MESS WITH ELECTRICITY - and that includes not wiring up our own electrical 'reverse wired' hook-up connector! After all, if you can't legally buy one that should tell you something!

 

[DeliDave_]

Thanks both,I have saved your website Val A,looks very useful

 

[otherclive]

Yes I know that now, but at the time I thought that having the other type of leads with normal and reverse polarity connectiosn woulld suffice. Wouldn't it be nice if the EU mandated just one type of connector then we would not have to have so many 'come in handys'.

 

[otherclive]

Yes I know that now, but at the time I thought that having the other type of leads with normal and reverse polarity connectiosn woulld suffice. Wouldn't it be nice if the EU mandated just one type of connector then we would not have to have so many 'come in handys'.

 

[otherclive]

Just another thought. In my posts above that would not save I mentioned that you could get a polarity changer I think Riversway Leisure sold them, arond £30-40, so an electrician could wire one in and then no further problems with French reverse polarity. Not doing anything as stated by Val A is not really an option if you are on site. There is no problem rewiring a connector it's no different to wiring a normal one but in reverse, so just mmake sure its marked and use the polarity tester as well as this will also check earths too.

 

[Gafferbill]

I am now sorry to have raised the issue of reverse polarity in this post started by a new caravaner seeking advice on their first trip to France.
They must now be thoroughly confused!

I was careful in my original reply to the Op just to make them aware of problems they may encounter when connecting to a French mains supply.
On reverse polarity I directed the OP by way of a clickable link, to a help leaflet issued by the Caravan Club written by that clubs experts.

The following is the advice issued by the Camping and Caravan Club :-

"The blue plug and socket that we use in the UK is the European standard, but many sites in parts of continental Europe still use a two pin connection, with either contacts at the side or a central third pin on the supply side for the earth connection. A continental two pin adapter lead can be bought from camping stores to connect from your existing lead to the old style connections.
Do take a mains tester though, to check the mains polarity. If the tester shows reversed polarity, which is often the case in Europe, for safety sake you should not use the supply unless you have the means to change the supply back to normal polarity. This can be achieved with another adapter lead that needs to be made up by an electrician or other competent person. Alternatively, there are units that can be wired into your motorhome or caravan’s electrical circuit that will safely deal with the reverse polarity problem"
　
Other posters have now followed with their non expert take on the subject and they are correct that it is their personal decision to ignore the warnings given by bodies such as the Caravan Club and Caravan and Camping Club.

Whilst it is true that modern caravans contain electrical mechanical devices to minimise the risks involved it is also known that these devices are not 100% reliable.

 

[NickinFrance]

I hope my posting haven't come across as inviting others to ignore the warning, that wasn't my intention.
My question is 'is the advice issued by the caravan clubs still valid & exactly what are the dangers ?'.
I can see the dangers from when caravans were fused with 'wired' fuses which would only clear one side of the supply but as Double Pole breakers have been compulsory for over 10 years I don't see the danger,
I can see that the caravan clubs don't want to muddy the waters by asking people to check what type of protection their caravan has but to say for safety sake you should not use the supply unless you have the means to change the supply back to normal polarity with no explanation is also asking for problems.

The reason I am asking is that I have changed all the mains sockets in my caravan to French 2 female/1 male connector type of sockets & the vast majority of the plugs I use are reversible 2 pin type, so would like to know if I am in any danger.

 

[Gafferbill]

Nick …… I asked the Technical Support Department at Swift Caravans by way of email, if Reverse polarity of the mains supply to one of their modern caravans was still an issue.
Below is the reply………..
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Hi Bill,

Thanks for the e-mail.

All our newer caravans (since about 2008) have contained a reverse
polarity indication light.

While this indicator does not solve the issue of reversed polarity
(which does still happen in some mainland European sites), it will help
the user to be aware that an issue exists.

I hope this helps.
XXX
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

My interpretation of this reply is that reverse polarity still maters and it is up to the caravan user to take appropriate action.

 

[NickinFrance]

My interpretation of this reply is that reverse polarity still maters and it is up to the caravan user to take appropriate action.

Thanks Bill but that doesn't answer my question about what actually is the problem/danger.
I did ask the question, tagged on to another thread, in the Swift forum but no one answered.
I think I'll ask the explicit question there & see if I get a reply.