Isn't technology wonderful

[Sam Vimes]

Two items of news yesterday caught my attention.

Item 1

The Voyager 1 and 2 Space Probes are still going - although with reduced capability - 47 years on from launch. Over the years a number of incedents have occurred which has meant the probes have had to be re-tasked. Of course this requires communications to be working at a distance of over 15 billion miles from earth and increasing. A number of times communications has become garbled or lost but developments here on Earth have managed to re-stablish communication with the probes and allowed engineers to send instructions to re-task them. Keep in mind the distance and the fact that it takes over 23 hours for Voyager 1 to get the instructions and the same for Earth to receive data. Data rates I think started out at 115Kbps but have dropped as the distance increases.

Hats off to the engineers on that one and the probes are expected to last until their 50th anniversary.

Item 2

Smart Meters - something I've been skeptical about for years. Apparently there are about 62% of homes with smart meters of which about 10% are in dumb mode. The reason being they can't communicate a few miles back to the servers. The problem is now highlighted as being worst in the north of England and in Scotland.

The Voyager Probe Project cost just under $1B in the late 1970's (about £60B in 2024 terms) - obivously there are on going costs in maintaining the project -

The Smart Meter Project cost are estimated to be about £15B so far but the difference in capabilities is far less than the Voyager Project.

FWIW: I can't have a Smart Meter installed but I've just managed to get one installed at our Community Hall just 3 miles away. Guess what - it only works in dumb mode.

 

[Hutch]

Sounds very similar to my 45 plus years of marriage, I am often told that I don't listen to what is being communicated to me, or if I do act on that communication, it is not correctly done. I don't reply to the communication that I received due to getting crossed information.
As some one else mentioned some time ago, did you know there is a wrong way to put a milk bottle in the fridge.
It is not just AI,( I hate that term, it is Technology) that gets it wrong.

 

[borderbilly]

I don't get all this space exploration, is it so that we can destroy other countries from the comfort of our own? Or inhabit other planets and destroy them? Money would be better spent on sorting out our own problems.

 

[Richtee180]

I don't get all this space exploration, is it so that we can destroy other countries from the comfort of our own? Or inhabit other planets and destroy them? Money would be better spent on sorting out our own problems.

The irony, without space exploration and satellites would that phone in your hand exist?

 

[toad a caravan]

With regard to the voyagers,,I can't recall which one, was serviced by Captain James T Kirk and the crew of the Enterprise.I remember it being on TV

 

[borderbilly]

The irony, without space exploration and satellites would that phone in your hand exist?

I can live without my phone.

 

[Dustydog]

 

[Mr Plodd]

I have had a Smart meter from very early on, so it's a SMETS 1.
It has worked perfectly from day one with 3 different energy suppliers and has had several remote software updates, so the tech does work.

I have a time of use tariff, solar panels and battery storage, it registers what I export to the grid and I get that payment credited to my electicity account!
So I am a great believer in them BUT I do accept some people do have "issues" with theirs.

 

[JTQ]

I have had a Smart meter from very early on, so it's a SMETS 1.
It has worked perfectly from day one

Now are you really confident it has "worked perfectly", and quite how would that be known?

 

[Hutch]

I have had a Smart meter for my gas and Electricity, I have no reason NOT to believe their readings, but what has saved me money is "The Paranoid meter" the visual remote display, seeing how much different items cost to run makes us turn things off.
But when the kids come home, and leave lights on, or use the oven at midnight to cook chicken wings, instead of the air frier, it really shows.

 

[Dustydog]

Better than TV 😜😜

 

[Gafferbill]

Now are you really confident it has "worked perfectly", and quite how would that be known?

......smart meters can be read normally just the same as a non smart meter.
The smart aspect is the fact that if working properly, they can be read remotely.

 

[Mr Plodd]

Now are you really confident it has "worked perfectly", and quite how would that be known?

It correctly applies my time of use tariffs, and details the amount of energy I export and when its exported. Both of which I can check using a the Octopus app on my tablet/phone, The export amount I can check on another app (Givenergy my battery supplier) which details the export via my battery's control system. They always agree with each other, So yes, I am very confident it is working correctly.

 

[Tobes]

It correctly applies my time of use tariffs, and details the amount of energy I export and when its exported. Both of which I can check using a the Octopus app on my tablet/phone, The export amount I can check on another app (Givenergy my battery supplier) which details the export via my battery's control system. They always agree with each other, So yes, I am very confident it is working correctly.

Another advocate here with smart meter, solar panels, GivEnergy batteries, solar diverter for hot water, 2 EV chargers and a whole host of attached power controls and sensors.

There are so many ways of collecting and displaying data on power usage, any anomalies in the smart meter would become quickly obvious.

 

[RogerL]

We have a smart meter for the electric, a pre-requisite fo getting a good fixed deal a few years back - it's made no difference to our energy consumption as I've been reading the meters manually every month for decades and sending that information to the supplier, still do! To be fair, we did get refunds for "free" electricity this summer when there was excess wind generation but it only amounted to 10p.

Ironically, they won't fit a gas smart meter as we have a non-standard meter box.

 

[GUMPY]

My smart meter reads correctly, how do I know?
I can check exactly what is going on from the readings on the solar generation system. Also have instantaneous readings on the phone from both the solar and the smart meter.
I do still read the meter monthly and submit it as it prompts the supplier to generate a bill which sometimes they forget to do.

For those north of a line from the Humber to the Mersey whose meters are on long wave radio I hear that Octopus have broken the protocol and have fitted a 2g meter to at least one home that couldn't get signal.

 

[RogerL]

My smart meter reads correctly, how do I know?
I can check exactly what is going on from the readings on the solar generation system. Also have instantaneous readings on the phone from both the solar and the smart meter.
I do still read the meter monthly and submit it as it prompts the supplier to generate a bill which sometimes they forget to do.

For those north of a line from the Humber to the Mersey whose meters are on long wave radio I hear that Octopus have broken the protocol and have fitted a 2g meter to at least one home that couldn't get signal.

According to a recent report, it's the northern installation of smart meters that are the most troublesome - as the long wave transmissions aren't as reliable as expected. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cq52382zd1no

 

[Sam Vimes]

The situation in the North is that the communications system uses the 400MHz band which supposedly has better coverage - distance- than the current 2G and 3G networks used in the South. While this is technically true there are many blind spots because of the geography getting in the way. Hills and Glens.

I'm with Octopus but they insist I can't have a Smart Meter. The only reason I'd like one is the possible access to better tarriffs which require a Smart Meter. Although reports suggest that on average the savings of just the Smart Meter alone amount to about £5 per month per household.

Wearing my Cynic/Skeptic reversible hat I can't help thinking that the roll out of Smart Meters was ill conceived and more another political vanity project - although the motive might be good. Too many infrastructure projects run into problems - HS2 anyone.

2G is going off air by 2033 - supposedly. The cost to replace the smart meters on 2g or 3g is projected to cost £13.9B

Then of course the license to manage the roll out of Smart Meter communications platform has been given to Capita for another couple of years who's capabilites have been questioned.

Is there some security reason why Smart Meters couldn't hook up to the Internet since most homes have broadband these days?

 

[Buckman]

The situation in the North is that the communications system uses the 400MHz band which supposedly has better coverage - distance- than the current 2G and 3G networks used in the South. While this is technically true there are many blind spots because of the geography getting in the way. Hills and Glens.

I'm with Octopus but they insist I can't have a Smart Meter. The only reason I'd like one is the possible access to better tarriffs which require a Smart Meter. Although reports suggest that on average the savings of just the Smart Meter alone amount to about £5 per month per household.

Wearing my Cynic/Skeptic reversible hat I can't help thinking that the roll out of Smart Meters was ill conceived and more another political vanity project - although the motive might be good. Too many infrastructure projects run into problems - HS2 anyone.

2G is going off air by 2033 - supposedly. The cost to replace the smart meters on 2g or 3g is projected to cost £13.9B

Then of course the license to manage the roll out of Smart Meter communications platform has been given to Capita for another couple of years who's capabilites have been questioned.

Is there some security reason why Smart Meters couldn't hook up to the Internet since most homes have broadband these days?

Smart meters were introduced as a cost saving measure for the utilities to increase their profits and not thing more. No more meter readers as hundreds out of work. No need to get the meter operator out to change the tariff so another saving. More redundancies!

 

[JTQ]

Wearing my Cynic/Skeptic reversible hat I can't help thinking that the roll out of Smart Meters was ill conceived and more another political vanity project

My view, but I did not think the moderators would allow me to post treading that path!

They can't possibly save energy use as they are only a communications link from a meter; it has to be the user changing their usage that would save energy.

They obviously have to be funded, so whichever route is taken to fund that, it is us that ends up paying, so effectively our energy costs more.

All said, they are a convenience, one less task to routinely find the right time to undertake, and to hopefully avoid a periodic need to stay home for the occasional official check we are sending correct readings.

 

[GUMPY]

Smart meters were introduced as a cost saving measure for the utilities to increase their profits and not thing more. No more meter readers as hundreds out of work. No need to get the meter operator out to change the tariff so another saving. More redundancies!

I don't ever remember having to have the tariff changed on my non smart meter and I was a tariff junkie, swapping whenever it was advantageous. All the old meters were was a readout of kWh used so the actual tariff was irrelevant as the cost was calculated from the number of kWh. Occasionally there would be a need to swap the time clock if you had economy seven.
My smart meter along with my TOU tariff and solar has completely changed the way we use electricity in this house it has become a game to see just how far down I can get the bill. The best so far was last August £1.31 plus the standing charge which was more than covered by the £48.15 I got from exporting.

 

[otherclive]

Smart meters were introduced as a cost saving measure for the utilities to increase their profits and not thing more. No more meter readers as hundreds out of work. No need to get the meter operator out to change the tariff so another saving. More redundancies!

That’s okay as there are still 40000 truck drivers short, NHS and care home staff shortages plus construction etc. I don’t know where these hundreds of meter readers were based but in the four years before we had a smart meter we never had a meter reader attend the property.

 

[Buckman]

That’s okay as there are still 40000 truck drivers short, NHS and care home staff shortages plus construction etc. I don’t know where these hundreds of meter readers were based but in the four years before we had a smart meter we never had a meter reader attend the property.

Domestic meters were supposed to be read every 2 years and business meters once a year. Remember there only a couple of hundred or thousand of meter readers up against +30 million homes before you even think of businesses.

No every one wants to be a truck driver or work for the NHS or in care homes.

 

[otherclive]

I don't ever remember having to have the tariff changed on my non smart meter and I was a tariff junkie, swapping whenever it was advantageous. All the old meters were was a readout of kWh used so the actual tariff was irrelevant as the cost was calculated from the number of kWh. Occasionally there would be a need to swap the time clock if you had economy seven.
My smart meter along with my TOU tariff and solar has completely changed the way we use electricity in this house it has become a game to see just how far down I can get the bill. The best so far was last August £1.31 plus the standing charge which was more than covered by the £48.15 I got from exporting.

Even when not on the smart meter I could change tariff by using the BG website and the rates were changed to reflect the new tariff. I could do it mid way through a contract without penalty and BGs website just updated itself on to the new tariff on the day I changed the tariff contract. I sent my readings in each month. But obviously without a Smart meter I could not get the benefits of off peak usage, EV charging or energy rebates. This year we’ve had around £50 rebated by usage reductions when requested. Plus we had half price electric on many Sundays between specified hours. Not possible without the Smart meter.

 

[otherclive]

Domestic meters were supposed to be read every 2 years and business meters once a year. Remember there only a couple of hundred or thousand of meter readers up against +30 million homes before you even think of businesses.

No every one wants to be a truck driver or work for the NHS or in care homes.

I know what is supposed to happen wrt meter readings but in this house and our previous one it just didn’t happen.

My point wrt job vacancies is that there are lots of businesses looking for staff and since time immemorial as change takes place workers have to move into other areas.