kerb weight confusion

[Lutz]

Muzzy, you can not just deduct the actual total weight of the car from the gross train weight to arrive at the weight that you may tow. If you did, you may exceed the ultimate towload limit, as specified by the car manufacturer. In most case this towload is the gross train weight minus the gross vehicle weight.

 

[colin-yorkshire]

hi all.

john L, I dont like the 85% recomedation any more than you do it is actually quite farsical when it is quoted as some form of golden rule for safe towing it is not has never has been, god if I were to follow it with my car the best I could tow would be a camping trailer,but that is not the point Muzzy has asked for advice as a newbie who has never towed a van before and quoted the car figures, that suggest to me that he has at least thought about the best options and given himself the widest scope to find a van that the car will tow with relative ease, furthermore a van around the 1200kg mark encompases probably most of the average to lightweight vans available, what I hate most is the newbie who post asking for advice having already been out and bought the biggest van they could find. no newbie should be attempting to tow a 6+mtr van at 100% when they actually don't have a clue what to expect once it is hung on the back.

Lutz, while what you say is technicly correct the margins that Muzzy has quoted will no way fall foul of any weight constraints even if the van is loaded to the absolute max and the car is left empty. as we all know the only real way to know is load it all up as if going away and then have it weighed as a unit and then seperatly, by checking the actual weights against the theroretical weights will reveal all.

using thoretical models is fine providing ALL the figures are to hand and actually make sense,they don't allways do that because of the anomalies that exist with conflicting data some car manufacturers change the way trailer weights are calculated this is what I did in an earlier post quoting the figures on my cars VIN plate I said after quoting the figures that he max trailer weight was 1100kg which is correct however it was soon pointed out that the figures actually meant the max weight should be only 900kg why the difference: well it a renault for a start, there are many others where the actual trailer max is different than one would expect by just looking at the figures.

colin

 

[Lutz]

What I was trying to say is that if the caravan is loaded up to its maximum permissible weight, but the car itself isn't, he may not be exceeding the gross train weight, but he could very well be exceeding the maximum permissible towload, which is just as bad.

 

[ProfJohnL]

hi all.

john L, I dont like the 85% recomedation any more than you do it is actually quite farsical when it is quoted as some form of golden rule for safe towing it is not has never has been, god if I were to follow it with my car the best I could tow would be a camping trailer,but that is not the point Muzzy has asked for advice as a newbie who has never towed a van before and quoted the car figures, that suggest to me that he has at least thought about the best options and given himself the widest scope to find a van that the car will tow with relative ease, furthermore a van around the 1200kg mark encompases probably most of the average to lightweight vans available, what I hate most is the newbie who post asking for advice having already been out and bought the biggest van they could find. no newbie should be attempting to tow a 6+mtr van at 100% when they actually don't have a clue what to expect once it is hung on the back.

Lutz, while what you say is technicly correct the margins that Muzzy has quoted will no way fall foul of any weight constraints even if the van is loaded to the absolute max and the car is left empty. as we all know the only real way to know is load it all up as if going away and then have it weighed as a unit and then seperatly, by checking the actual weights against the theroretical weights will reveal all.

using thoretical models is fine providing ALL the figures are to hand and actually make sense,they don't allways do that because of the anomalies that exist with conflicting data some car manufacturers change the way trailer weights are calculated this is what I did in an earlier post quoting the figures on my cars VIN plate I said after quoting the figures that he max trailer weight was 1100kg which is correct however it was soon pointed out that the figures actually meant the max weight should be only 900kg why the difference: well it a renault for a start, there are many others where the actual trailer max is different than one would expect by just looking at the figures.

colin

Hello Colin,

There are a number of contributors to this forum who post that they always trim their outfits to 85% and would not dream of towing at any thing else. They have gone on to encourage everyone to follow the same 'rule', using statements like 'If you exceed 85% you may be prosecuted' or 'I know I'll be stable because I've trimmed to 85% rule'.

It has been used so much that it has entered towing folk-law, and it has been imbued with a almost magical qualities of fixing towing woes. Yet there is no substantive evidence that 85% is right, and the dogma continues.

I find it quite amazing that a few contributors who claim to religiously load to 85%, which has no legal standing, and yet they also openly report they happily exceed speed limits.

I prefer to use facts as a basis for a discussion or advice.