New Tyres

[Buckman]

When OH's car went through its MOT last week there was an advisory regarding the rear nearside tyre being low tread. I knew about but as the car had only done about 1600 miles in the past year I was not too bothered.
However with no more lockdown and winter coming I decided to have it changed. The offside tyre was an almost brand new Evergreen tyre made in China. I tried to source same tyre to have matching tyres on same axle. No chance as tyre could not be sourced.
Although spare had more than enough tread I opted to put the Evergreen tyre as a spare and two new tyres on front axle and front tyres on rear axle. Of course this doubled the expense and more tyres to be recycled.
Second time this has happened with us as on our previous caravan we had a blow out on site in France and could not source the same brand tyre. I am sure there is legislation in France regarding same brand and tread tyres on same axle.
Next set of tyres on caravan will definitely be one of the better known brands available in UK and Continent.

 

[otherclive]

When OH's car went through its MOT last week there was an advisory regarding the rear nearside tyre being low tread. I knew about but as the car had only done about 1600 miles in the past year I was not too bothered.
However with no more lockdown and winter coming I decided to have it changed. The offside tyre was an almost brand new Evergreen tyre made in China. I tried to source same tyre to have matching tyres on same axle. No chance as tyre could not be sourced.
Although spare had more than enough tread I opted to put the Evergreen tyre as a spare and two new tyres on front axle and front tyres on rear axle. Of course this doubled the expense and more tyres to be recycled.
Second time this has happened with us as on our previous caravan we had a blow out on site in France and could not source the same brand tyre. I am sure there is legislation in France regarding same brand and tread tyres on same axle.
Next set of tyres on caravan will definitely be one of the better known brands available in UK and Continent.

The normal recommendation is fir new tyres on the back and the rears moved forwards. Particularly in wet braking conditions This is considered to give better and more stable braking as the vehicle transfers its weight forwards.
The French are a bit different in their interpretation of the tyre regulations and I have read where motorists have been forced in the event of a non reparable puncture to fit two brand new tyres. But I was told that as long as the replacement tyre is the same construction, load and speed rating two tyres aren’t required. But of course if you are a captive customer you are faced with a Catch 22 situation. Subarus are quite sensitive to tread depth to 0.2mm difference between front and rears and the same laterally. How on Earth any one in the trade can measure to that difference of a millimetre wasn’t stated in the OM. So a non repairable puncture can mean four new tyres. The plus is that you then have three one careful owner part worn tyres for future use. But you need to carry one to make sure it can be used when required. ☹

 

[Buckman]

The normal recommendation is fir new tyres on the back and the rears moved forwards. Particularly in wet braking conditions This is considered to give better and more stable braking as the vehicle transfers its weight forwards.
The French are a bit different in their interpretation of the tyre regulations and I have read where motorists have been forced in the event of a non reparable puncture to fit two brand new tyres. But I was told that as long as the replacement tyre is the same construction, load and speed rating two tyres aren’t required. But of course if you are a captive customer you are faced with a Catch 22 situation. Subarus are quite sensitive to tread depth to 0.2mm difference between front and rears and the same laterally. How on Earth any one in the trade can measure to that difference of a millimetre wasn’t stated in the OM. So a non repairable puncture can mean four new tyres. The plus is that you then have three one careful owner part worn tyres for future use. But you need to carry one to make sure it can be used when required. ☹

TBH I thought it was always new tyres on front. However the front tyres were fitted last year so less than 1500 miles since fitment.
In France we fitted the spare onto the caravan and the new tyre as a spare. Strangely in France they do not do budget tyres only Michelin tyres at a premium price. Excuse the sarcasm. Must have been the only caravan with a Michelin spare tyre!

 

[otherclive]

Just had my MOT, passed but with an advisorie. Tyres are at 4mm. Near to limits.
Ok they are all season tyres Nokian Weatherproofs, but really, near limits !!!

Anyway I will possibly change them depending on mileage and wear, but I imaging I will get another winter out of them.

What tyres would you put on your cars, if you were to,change them , I am thinking of going back to the Hankook 117. I found them ok.
My tug is the Santa Fe..

This link might give a few ideas. There are several other comprehensive tyre reviews often by German companies, like Autobild etc. Auto express has links to reviews. However a tyre that does well on a Golf May not achieve the same ranking on an SUV. So looking at a few comparitive test reviews tends to show a theme developing. But after a while you get the typical internet syndrome of “ too much information”

https://www.tyrereviews.com/Article/2020-Tyre-Reviews-All-Season-Tyre-Test.htm

 

[otherclive]

TBH I thought it was always new tyres on front. However the front tyres were fitted last year so less than 1500 miles since fitment.
In France we fitted the spare onto the caravan and the new tyre as a spare. Strangely in France they do not do budget tyres only Michelin tyres at a premium price. Excuse the sarcasm. Must have been the only caravan with a Michelin spare tyre!

What greater pleasure could there be to a French garage than forcing a stranded Brit to buy two Michelin’s. He would have been talking about it in the bar long into the night.

 

[Dustydog]

From here on probably have to be embossed. “UKCA” which might prevent purchase of tyres from European outlets such as Tyreleader, or Pneus Online. Which would restrict our choice and reduce competition on price. I bought my BFG MT from Tyreleader and the shipped from Holland in 36 hours from order. The Motor Vehicle Tyre Regulations going back to 1994 refer primarily to the governing standards being ECE but allow for equivalent BSI to be used.

Similarly I bought a replacement pattern headlamp unit from Germany but if they have to be specific to UKCA, Continental suppliers may no stock such parts. My grandson works for a defence company and he tells me they are having problems sourcing equipment which is CE marked as the US suppliers really don’t want to submit for all the necessary work just to have it marked UKCA when nothing has changed. And they have been told that if UKCA diverge from CE then the supplier may not continue to supply the U.K. market. This is for a radar system. So an honourable compromise has been reached. His company will pay for and manage the work required to obtain UKCA approval. That’s a negative hit to the defence budget and the taxpayer.

Wasted on me Clive. Not sure what this has to do with tyres and where they are made😥

 

[ProfJohnL]

I'm not sure the French could prosecute that legislation on a visitor to France.

There is legislation about mixing tyre construction, e.g. radials with crossply, and it might stretch to mixing winter and summer tyres.

The reason why it's recommended to fit the best tyres to the rear is to reduce the possibility of a vehicle oversteering, which is considered by most authorities on the matter to be potentially more serious/dangerous than understeer.

 

[Beachball]

Just got paperwork up when car passed MOT Tyres at front 5mm Rear Tyres 6mm and spare brand new the garage said they were ok ,

 

[Buckman]

The reason why it's recommended to fit the best tyres to the rear is to reduce the possibility of a vehicle oversteering, which is considered by most authorities on the matter to be potentially more serious/dangerous than understeer.

I am not sure if I understand the reasoning as to why it would cause oversteer with new tyres? If it is correct it probably does not really apply in our case as the car in question the front tyres had done very low mileage and the car is mainly used around town and has not seen a motorway for a couple of years. I was mainly thinking about it being driven in wet weather around the town and on rural country roads which can be very bumpy.

 

[RogerL]

I am not sure if I understand the reasoning as to why it would cause oversteer with new tyres? If it is correct it probably does not really apply in our case as the car in question the front tyres had done very low mileage and the car is mainly used around town and has not seen a motorway for a couple of years. I was mainly thinking about it being driven in wet weather around the town and on rural country roads which can be very bumpy.

Understeer/oversteer is caused by driver losing control, not new tyres, which can occur to anyone eg swerving to avoid an accident - but most drivers can't handle oversteer as they don't have the reactions and experience of a F1 driver but most drivers can cope with understeer. Advanced drivers and police class 1 drivers still use cars with the best tyres on the rear despite their training.

In your case, the fact that the front tyres are very low mileage makes the argument somewhat pedantic but the principle of best tyres on the rear still holds.

 

[otherclive]

I am not sure if I understand the reasoning as to why it would cause oversteer with new tyres? If it is correct it probably does not really apply in our case as the car in question the front tyres had done very low mileage and the car is mainly used around town and has not seen a motorway for a couple of years. I was mainly thinking about it being driven in wet weather around the town and on rural country roads which can be very bumpy.

Your right that in your particular circumstances the tread depth between the existing rear tyres and new fronts is so similar it’s not an issue. But the principal is similar to why you do not just fit two winter tyres to the driving wheels as it could lead to an unbalance under certain driving conditions. There are numerous videos on YouTube that shows this. I went on a police driving course where one element was on a skid pan. But the skid pan vehicles were on cradles that could be adjusted to represent oversteer or under steer but at quite low speeds no greater than 15-20 mph. So if the car got out of control there wasn’t any risk to the vehicle or people.

Our daughter is waiting for a new Corolla hybrid and her existing front tyres on her Focus are near the wear bars. She normally changes at 3 mm. So I’ve told her to buy two budget tyres and fit them to the rear and move the rears to the front. So I’m ordering her two Black circles no name budgets and it will be interesting to see what arrives. Either way budgets with good tread depth on the back will allow good Dunlops onto the front. But hopefully the new car arrives soon.

 

[Buckman]

I went on a police driving course where one element was on a skid pan. But the skid pan vehicles were on cradles that could be adjusted to represent oversteer or under steer but at quite low speeds no greater than 15-20 mph. So if the car got out of control there wasn’t any risk to the vehicle or people.

Thanks. Part of my police training was on skid pan using and old Vauxhall Velox. I must admit it was great fun, but served its purpose. As we hardly ever saw rain I was never able to put that training into practice for many years.
Back in the sixties most cars were rear wheel drive with the exception of BMC vehicles so that is probably why my thinking revolves around new tyres to the front?

 

[Dustydog]

I was always taught to put the new tyres on the rear axle irrespective of FWD or AWD. Some people swap their tyres from front to rear etc . I don’t do it as I see no real benefit these days, other than more donkey work. That aside the modern tyres , some Assymetrical work better when left on the same axle . Swapping them may upset the “set” of the tyre.Maybe I’m wrong.

 

[ProfJohnL]

I am not sure if I understand the reasoning as to why it would cause oversteer with new tyres? If it is correct it probably does not really apply in our case as the car in question the front tyres had done very low mileage and the car is mainly used around town and has not seen a motorway for a couple of years. I was mainly thinking about it being driven in wet weather around the town and on rural country roads which can be very bumpy.

I'm sorry I should have added:

My reference to over and under steer relates to when a skid has started.

If it helps - over or under steer will only occur when negotiating a bend, and the reference to under or over signifies the vehicle has not reacted to the steering input as normal.

Understeer is when applying steering angle, the vehicle does not turn in as much as expected. This is the front wheels losing grip.

And oversteer is when applying steering angle, the vehicle turns in more than expected. This is the rear wheels losing grip.

Few drivers are experienced with handling under or oversteer situations , so instinct tends to switch on when it does arise. The natural instinct is to add more lock to the steering, and for mild understeer that might correct the situation, but more steering lock in a uncontrolled oversteer situation is about the worst thing you can do.

It goes without saying that drivers should drive in accordance with the conditions and avoid situations where loss of control might arise in teh first place.