One small victory

[CliveV]

Excellent Posting David!

Humour really does work!!

I had a chuckle at your "reverse" bit - But totally cracked up at the responce you got.

LOL!!!

 

[Jayne Simpson]

If 4x4's are so rubbish makes you wonder why so many police forces accross the country use them in so many applications

 

[CliveV]

A lot of the brown smelly stuff has been written about how awful a 4x4 is on the road to drive.

Just noticed that the Discovery 3 has picked up the What Car "Car of the Year" and also a Group Test Winner in Nov 05 What Car states - "Great on-road as well as off-road. Superb"

It also achieved "Off-Roader of the Year" - AutoExpress; "Large 4x4 of the Year" - Car & Driving

of course.

What a superb vehicle - designed and built in the UK as well!

Makes you proud to be British!

 

[Pelyma1]

Clive it makes me proud to own one!!! Not imported across the world, but made in Britain. It tows my caravan beautifully, it handles well, I get 30mpg from it, I offroad for fun in it (usually private land but sometimes greenlanes) I use it for my fieldsport hobbiesand it is awesome. Seats 7 adults in comfort, carries huge loads and it gives me a huge grin.

Now my mate has an E class merc 320 diesel, he loves his too, but if a group of us go out we go in mine because we can all get in it - one car vs 2. His car is much faster than mine though, but I never feel the need to speed like him. With saying that it does go well if you want to, but like they say speed kills! It would be interesting to find out if the biiigggg square front of mine being driven at my average speeds is more dangerous than his slopy front at his average speed. I tell you what though it scared the s@*+t out of a Lambo Murchilago owner who came hacking round a country bend the other day on my side of the road the other day, his white face contrasted nicly with his black car.

At the end of the day I don't give a toss what others think I own what I reckon is the best car in the world and four people I know have bought one on the back of driving mine, so I've spread a bit of happiness too!

 

[RichardH]

out of interest I went to look at the euro ncap test site and discovered (no surprise really) that most cars score only one or two stars in pedestrian friendlyness. Fiat punto, ford fiesta kia picanto mini cooper plus many others only get one star the same as the disco gets, dont know why people bang on about the pedestrian test rating anyway, your flesh, a car is steel its going to win

 

[Lol1]

Interesting you should say that Paul. When we had two cars in the household one a normal car and one a 4x4, whenever I was out and about in the "normal car" I felt the need for speed. The handling was secure and I found myself trying to go round roundabouts quicker and quicker, darting in and out of traffic. Some fun was had admittedly, but I was always feeling I could go quicker, speed cameras became a nuisance. Getting into the 4x4 however was like throwing a switch, I was more than happy to just potter around, enjoying the view, feeling safe. I'm willing to bet I'm not the only one that's like that, really we should ban ordinary cars and make everyone drive 4x4. Ok that's taking it a little far, but consider this, 4x4 sales are still on the up, meaning more 4x4's per head, in 2004 road deaths fell by 8% and serious injuries are down by the same amount. Coincidence, perhaps, but it shows the anti's don't have a sound argument.

 

[sparkes]

LOL

I have to agree. In My MG with 190bhp v6 I do find myself pushing it a bit, but when we got the 4x4 I slowed right down. At first I thought it was because its a diesel, but hell can they go if you do push them.

What I also noticed is that after driving the 4x4 more, I have slowed down in the MG and on my bike, no idea why but I have.

When I use the Disco for work, I find that I am more than Happy to sit in the inside lane, but in the MG I almost never move out of the outside lane. I arrive more relaxed and far less stressed out.

 

[CliveV]

Lol - How interesting that you say that - I found exactly the same. My previous cars were Audi's in the main and I DID drive them fast. We also had a Citroen BX estate - marvelous car - so practical, but I found I did not drive fast in the BX - just pottered about as you say.

The same is true of the RR as well - I do not think I ever speed in it - not because it can't! - with a 3.5L V8 there is not much it can't do.

I certainly believe the type of car can influence ones driving style.

 

[Lol1]

Lol - How interesting that you say that - I found exactly the same. My previous cars were Audi's in the main and I DID drive them fast. We also had a Citroen BX estate - marvelous car - so practical, but I found I did not drive fast in the BX - just pottered about as you say.

The same is true of the RR as well - I do not think I ever speed in it - not because it can't! - with a 3.5L V8 there is not much it can't do.

I certainly believe the type of car can influence ones driving style.

Clive, I had a BX too, like you, I found it practical with a surprisingly nice gear change. In fact I got the BX when I part exchanged my old (T reg) RR for it. The wife wouldn't drive the Range Rover and the fuel it drank made me think there was a hole in the tank, but that was of the early carburettor models.

 

[Stephen_5077753]

A Defender may be the safest classic to drive but like all 4x4's they're lethal to pedestrians.

Again we have people branding all 4x4's as bad. Go and get your facts right first.

Have a look at the EuroNcap site and see how many stars some of the smaller SUV's have compared with smaller cars.

X-trail-2 stars for pedestrian safety.

Smart car also 2 stars

Mini 1 star

Micra 2 stars

Corsa 1 star

Polo 2 star

Audi A3 1 star

BMW 3 series, 1 star

So, you wanna get hit by an x-trail at 20mph or a Mini at 20mph?

Ok, bigger 4x4's have 1 star (other than the Volvo) but so does a lot of superminis/saloons. So how can you say they are worse when NCAP prove that they arnt?

Steve

 

[CliveV]

Lol - How interesting that you say that - I found exactly the same. My previous cars were Audi's in the main and I DID drive them fast. We also had a Citroen BX estate - marvelous car - so practical, but I found I did not drive fast in the BX - just pottered about as you say.

The same is true of the RR as well - I do not think I ever speed in it - not because it can't! - with a 3.5L V8 there is not much it can't do.

I certainly believe the type of car can influence ones driving style.

Hi Lol - My old RR is one of the last Carb versions. But I have uprated the ignition, fitted SD1 cylinder heads (from the SD1 big Rover Saloon) as they have bigger exhaust ports and EFi exhaust manifolds.

All that improves power, torque, and mpg. Makes you wonder why the hell they didn't do it in the first place! I get about 17 mpg on LPG at 39p per litre - cheap and clean motoring for such a vehicle.

The BX was an estate which was like a van in the back! Far better load space than any other car I have owned. Trouble was all the plastic on the dash fell apart! and the electrics were awful.

It was trying to tow a horse box over a wet field with this BX that converted me to 4x4 when all I was doing was sliding and skidding and a guy in a Trooper just came up and pulled both the BX AND the loaded horse trailer off the field without even breaking the turf.

Turned out he was the Farmers son from where we were at the Gymkana and his flat statement that "if you want to tow - get a 4x4" - was the best advice ever!

Still miss the BX tho' - three trips to Argeles on the Med near the Spanish French Border - that car just ate the miles through France - Never had anything like it as a long distance cruiser.

Useless towtruck in the wet tho'

 

[Guest]

I like the comments posted regarding 'proud to own a British Landrover'. Did I miss something or is not Landrover owned by BMW. Also if memory serves me well Nissan, Honda and Peugeot's are also 'made in Britain'. I really liked the newspaper article a while back, that stated Honda were exporting cars back to Japan as the quality of those made in the UK was better. So we as a nation can obviously do something right. Pity we cannot say the same of Rover which is virtually dead and buried. Yet it is evidently only 1/2 mile up the road from Peugeot.

However, I also noted in a recent edition of 'Whatcar' that Landrover was bottom of the reliability surveys for the 2nd year running.

So what does it all mean? I haven't a clue but I am sure someone does.

Regards

David

 

[colin(bridgend)]

Hi David - you are right in most of your posting - the only part you have wrong is that Landrover is owned by Ford not BMW. Mind you in my opinion BMW is only an upmarket Ford. There are far better value for money cars on the market than BMW.

 

[Pete4]

It doesn't matter what car you have, the national speed limit os 60mph and 70mph on motorways.

Hogging the fast lane is also illegal.

Please bear this in mind for the safety of others.

 

[Pete4]

Interesting you should say that Paul. When we had two cars in the household one a normal car and one a 4x4, whenever I was out and about in the "normal car" I felt the need for speed. The handling was secure and I found myself trying to go round roundabouts quicker and quicker, darting in and out of traffic. Some fun was had admittedly, but I was always feeling I could go quicker, speed cameras became a nuisance. Getting into the 4x4 however was like throwing a switch, I was more than happy to just potter around, enjoying the view, feeling safe. I'm willing to bet I'm not the only one that's like that, really we should ban ordinary cars and make everyone drive 4x4. Ok that's taking it a little far, but consider this, 4x4 sales are still on the up, meaning more 4x4's per head, in 2004 road deaths fell by 8% and serious injuries are down by the same amount. Coincidence, perhaps, but it shows the anti's don't have a sound argument.

I would love to take you up on that bet! Ban safe cars and force everyone to drive dangerous, environment damaging, fashion statements. I bet there is not one person who would agree with you.

Even the pros

 

[VIP2006]

Well if a debate on what individuals drive is to ensue then I have just changed to a 4x4 and I think it is absolutely great.

The weight allows me to tow almost any caravan and with a great margin regarding weight etc. with now having a higher driving position I can see much farther ahead and that must be a plus when considering potential hazards and stopping distances etc.

On site I now can stop worrying about getting stuck in heavy weather etc.etc.etc.I have listened to the lobbyists for banning 4x4's regarding safety and environmental issues. and in my opinion I would therefore support a proposal that all caravans should be towed by a 4x4 and that the tax should be abolished whilst towing and we should be allowed to use "red" diesel as I consider that 4x4's must be a safer option than ordinary cars.

I have towed since the early 70's and wished that they had been around then . IMHO

 

[littleangel]

Well if a debate on what individuals drive is to ensue then I have just changed to a 4x4 and I think it is absolutely great.

The weight allows me to tow almost any caravan and with a great margin regarding weight etc. with now having a higher driving position I can see much farther ahead and that must be a plus when considering potential hazards and stopping distances etc.

On site I now can stop worrying about getting stuck in heavy weather etc.etc.etc.I have listened to the lobbyists for banning 4x4's regarding safety and environmental issues. and in my opinion I would therefore support a proposal that all caravans should be towed by a 4x4 and that the tax should be abolished whilst towing and we should be allowed to use "red" diesel as I consider that 4x4's must be a safer option than ordinary cars.

I have towed since the early 70's and wished that they had been around then . IMHO

How do you see ahead with a great big artic infront of you????

 

[CliveV]

Just read the CC mag - Good write up on the new Discovery.

Dangerous - ? - certainly not by CC's judgement

Environmentaly damaging - ? - no more than anything with any kind of internal combustion engine

Fashion statement - ? - quite possibly but again no more so than a mini - BMW - Porche etc etc.

Awsomly able towing vehicle - ? - MOST CERTAINLY!!

One heck a huge victory for a UK built car. Long may it continue to fly the flag accross the world.

For those who just will not see this - is it not time to give it a rest? After all those that surely must really KNOW rather than wanting to inflict a personal opinion have now voted a 4x4 as tow car of the year and now thrown heaps of praise in the Discovery.

 

[ProfJohnL]

It doesn't matter what car you have, the national speed limit os 60mph and 70mph on motorways.

Hogging the fast lane is also illegal.

Please bear this in mind for the safety of others.

Dear Stinky,

No such thing as the fast lane, it's known as the offside or overtaking lane.

 

[MONKEY1]

Well if a debate on what individuals drive is to ensue then I have just changed to a 4x4 and I think it is absolutely great.

The weight allows me to tow almost any caravan and with a great margin regarding weight etc. with now having a higher driving position I can see much farther ahead and that must be a plus when considering potential hazards and stopping distances etc.

On site I now can stop worrying about getting stuck in heavy weather etc.etc.etc.I have listened to the lobbyists for banning 4x4's regarding safety and environmental issues. and in my opinion I would therefore support a proposal that all caravans should be towed by a 4x4 and that the tax should be abolished whilst towing and we should be allowed to use "red" diesel as I consider that 4x4's must be a safer option than ordinary cars.

I have towed since the early 70's and wished that they had been around then . IMHO

Shiraz,

Safer for whom, The pedestrian ? The fact that want to use Red diesel with 200% more sulphur in says how much you've researched this subject. I don't care what people drive it's their choice the thing I do car about it that I would rather be hit by a car at 30 mph than a 10 year old shogun which doesn't get a NCAP rating and because of the cost of an LR 3 it will take a long time for it to become affordable to the average caravan owner.

Regards Monkey Husb's

 

[VIP2006]

Shiraz,

Safer for whom, The pedestrian ? The fact that want to use Red diesel with 200% more sulphur in says how much you've researched this subject. I don't care what people drive it's their choice the thing I do car about it that I would rather be hit by a car at 30 mph than a 10 year old shogun which doesn't get a NCAP rating and because of the cost of an LR 3 it will take a long time for it to become affordable to the average caravan owner.

Regards Monkey Husb's

Little angel - visibility is much improved when comparing with a "normal car" which in many cases are not heavy enough to tow a caravan.

Monkey - I feel sure that you are comparing apples with oranges when talking about a new car and a 10 yr. old shogun and you have more or less admitted that if you could afford a new 4x4 you would buy one. I can afford to buy one and I repeat that the 4x4 I have is much safer car than most you see on the road. IMHO> I unlike you do not mind people driving what they fancy and I do appreciate that older cars of any type will not have the safety and environmental elements that todays cars have but if you are tarring all 4x4 vehicles with a broad brush then watch out for a different opinion from me. have a safe towing week and give a kindly wave to a 4x4 as you pass it.

 

[CliveV]

Well if a debate on what individuals drive is to ensue then I have just changed to a 4x4 and I think it is absolutely great.

The weight allows me to tow almost any caravan and with a great margin regarding weight etc. with now having a higher driving position I can see much farther ahead and that must be a plus when considering potential hazards and stopping distances etc.

On site I now can stop worrying about getting stuck in heavy weather etc.etc.etc.I have listened to the lobbyists for banning 4x4's regarding safety and environmental issues. and in my opinion I would therefore support a proposal that all caravans should be towed by a 4x4 and that the tax should be abolished whilst towing and we should be allowed to use "red" diesel as I consider that 4x4's must be a safer option than ordinary cars.

I have towed since the early 70's and wished that they had been around then . IMHO

And lets not forget all those poor Policemen sufferiing sea sickness from all that rolling arround in their Gen, Belgrano's

LOL !!!

I can see the early retirement claims flooding in !!!

 

[MONKEY1]

Shiraz,

I think you've misunderstood the observation; the majority of 4x4's on the road are older than 3 years, we only have to look Uncle Clive for proof of that.

The fastest growing area of 4x4 ownership isn't new car registrations, but that of imported second hand vehicles (Source DVLA). The majority of which as you've identified aren't meeting the current criteria's.

I can afford to own a new 4x4 but choose not to, like I choose not to take a lease car from my employer but take the allowance instead. My point is Cars like the LR3 etc with High up N Cap ratings are fine (for the last time I'm not anti 4x4) the observation is based on fact that average new car is sold to the UK motorist for under 12K so it will take a long time for the likes of a 27K LR 3 hit the pocket of average Joe.

Instead they buy cars which do damage to the environment (their choice) and damage to poor old pedestrian if they come into contact with them. Back in 1995 an awful lot of conventional cars were being sold designed with the pedestrian in mind sadly it wasn't the same with cars made for markets the other side of the world!!

A pedestrian sadly doesn't get hit by oranges or apples - but 2-3 tonne of Metal and Glass.

Regards Monkeys Husband

 

[Lol1]

Anyone getting hit with a sense of deja vu?

 

[MONKEY1]

Anyone getting hit with a sense of deja vu?

Is deja vu soft or hard and does it Hurt?