Permanent Caravanning.

[Scotland_fan]

Well I thought that too Surfer. The only thing is the insurance companies always ask where the caravan is stored and in the event of theft, surely the inusrance company will contact the land owner and they would say that it has been lived in permanantly.....or am I bringing too much into this?

 

[Surfer]

Well I thought that too Surfer. The only thing is the insurance companies always ask where the caravan is stored and in the event of theft, surely the inusrance company will contact the land owner and they would say that it has been lived in permanantly.....or am I bringing too much into this?

Under Data protection they cannot ask the landowner for that sort of info however they can question the theft of the caravan off a seasonal site. If you living in it and there are others on the site, chances of theft are vey low.

 

[Steve L]

While we lived in our tourer for over 3 years, we used my mother-in-law's address for everything including insurance on the van and car, and even to claim housing benefit for the site fees. The latter we did after the first year and only because I was injured by a hit and run driver. The hardest obsticle I found was the local post office when taxing the car. They quibbled the address on the current insurance and the log book address were different. I had to drive 30 miles to a DVLA office to tax the car using all the same documents and they couldn't believe the post office had been so negative. Renewing insurance and car tax online is the simplest way. (we used mum in laws address for insurance stating that we parked on the road).
Even after now spending a year back on civi street, we still reflect on our fulltime caravanning with positive thoughts.

People often look at folks who defy traditionalisum as being dodgers. My view is the townies are too dependant on the safety of bricks and mortar. Once you've tasted the freedom from utilities and household bills you'll findout just how much a house can be the chain round your neck.

 

[Parksy]

While we lived in our tourer for over 3 years, we used my mother-in-law's address for everything including insurance on the van and car, and even to claim housing benefit for the site fees. The latter we did after the first year and only because I was injured by a hit and run driver. The hardest obsticle I found was the local post office when taxing the car. They quibbled the address on the current insurance and the log book address were different. I had to drive 30 miles to a DVLA office to tax the car using all the same documents and they couldn't believe the post office had been so negative. Renewing insurance and car tax online is the simplest way. (we used mum in laws address for insurance stating that we parked on the road).
Even after now spending a year back on civi street, we still reflect on our fulltime caravanning with positive thoughts.

People often look at folks who defy traditionalisum as being dodgers. My view is the townies are too dependant on the safety of bricks and mortar. Once you've tasted the freedom from utilities and household bills you'll findout just how much a house can be the chain round your neck.

A high risk strategy Steve, because by claiming that your vehicle was normally kept outside your mother in laws address on the road you failed to disclose material facts which could potentially leave you open to prosecution for fraud.
Insurance companies use the material facts to decide whether they can offer you a policy and to determine the premuim that they will charge.
Failure to disclose material facts could result in a policy being voided which would be bad news if you were involved in an accident and had to claim, or worse still another road user made a claim against your policy.
Does the freedom that you mentioned include freedom from responsibility to insure your car properly? Defying tradition is one thing but lying to insurers or failing to disclose material facts is dodging your obligations to the townies and everybody else who correctly insure their vehicles, and you could end up with a criminal conviction for fraud.

 

[Surfer]

Our vehicles were registered at my Dad's address and the insurance was for his address however they had it in writing that car was parked elsewhere. This does not show on the insurance certificate.

 

[Steve L]

I can see your point Parksey.

However, when you live outside the "bubble of bricks and mortar" you do have to be a little creative in maintaining what is percieved as normal living. Our car was much safer parked next to our caravan than it ever is parked on the highway. But you just try and convince any insurance company of that. As soon as you declare that you don't have a fixed abode, our insurance premium triples and that is assuming an insurance company will take you on. Unless you are daft enough to sign up to having a tracker fitted to reduce your insurance premium, the insurer has no idea where your car is parked.

Surfer is right, you don't see any reference to any special terms of car parking on your insurance certificate, but it does appear in the magazine of terms and conditions, as is a statement covering your car while away from the registered address. I was fortunate enough to not have to claim on my insurance while at our caravan, but I did have a windscreen replaced on the roadside. Not many people would know this but you now have to declare windscreen claims for quotation purposes.

As I've said before on this topic, when you are not conforming with "society", you have to "think outside the box" to maintain as normal a life as possible.

I realy enjoyed our fulltiming and even despite having to put up with a couple of wardens (Jim & Linda) who did their best to be as descriminatory as possible towards us. All it got them however was the "tin tack" as the park owner where we had our 10 month seasonal pitch, was actually following this permanent caravanning topic. I found that out after writing to him about their antics on the site which had managed to dwindle 40 seasonal caravanners down to just 3 and us. The replacement wardens were totally the opposite and a very nice couple who have lived in caravans for many years and understood exactly just how to treat their customers.

 

[Parksy]

I can see your point Parksey.

However, when you live outside the "bubble of bricks and mortar" you do have to be a little creative in maintaining what is percieved as normal living. Our car was much safer parked next to our caravan than it ever is parked on the highway.........

I've no doubt that your car was much safer parked next to your caravan Steve but my point wasn't really about the risk of your car being stolen or broken in to.
If you had been involved in a traffic accident when you were driving, in which either yourself or some other road user had been seriously injured or even killed would your insurer have paid for any damages claims after they had found out that you had in effect lied on your insurance application form?
The insurance company had provded cover for your car and the cost of that cover had been based on the facts that you provided when you applied for the policy, as had the terms and conditions of the insurance policy.
If you had been involved in a serious road accident the police would have definitely been involved, and they would have discovered that you were not living at the address that you had claimed to live at on the insurance application.
The police would have informed the insurance company and there is a very good chance that they would have immediately voided the policy because it had been fraudulently obtained.
Just imagine the consequences if another road user had been seriously injured as a result of the accident and they had to claim from your insurance policy. You would not have been insured so their claim could not be paid by your insurers.
Most of us who do live inside the 'bubble of bricks and mortar' usually try to tell the absolute truth when supplying material facts to insurance companies, not only because we are worried about our cars being stolen but because we honour our obligations to other road users and think about how our actions could affect others.
Unfortunately the cost of our premiums continues to rise, because we are forced to pay for the creative thinkers who maintain what they perceive as normal living at our expense.

 

[Surfer]

I can see your point Parksey.
However, when you live outside the "bubble of bricks and mortar" you do have to be a little creative in maintaining what is percieved as normal living. Our car was much safer parked next to our caravan than it ever is parked on the highway.........

I've no doubt that your car was much safer parked next to your caravan Steve but my point wasn't really about the risk of your car being stolen or broken in to.
If you had been involved in a traffic accident when you were driving, in which either yourself or some other road user had been seriously injured or even killed would your insurer have paid for any damages claims after they had found out that you had in effect lied on your insurance application form?
The insurance company had provded cover for your car and the cost of that cover had been based on the facts that you provided when you applied for the policy, as had the terms and conditions of the insurance policy.
If you had been involved in a serious road accident the police would have definitely been involved, and they would have discovered that you were not living at the address that you had claimed to live at on the insurance application.
The police would have informed the insurance company and there is a very good chance that they would have immediately voided the policy because it had been fraudulently obtained.
Just imagine the consequences if another road user had been seriously injured as a result of the accident and they had to claim from your insurance policy. You would not have been insured so their claim could not be paid by your insurers.
Most of us who do live inside the 'bubble of bricks and mortar' usually try to tell the absolute truth when supplying material facts to insurance companies, not only because we are worried about our cars being stolen but because we honour our obligations to other road users and think about how our actions could affect others.
Unfortunately the cost of our premiums continues to rise, because we are forced to pay for the creative thinkers who maintain what they perceive as normal living at our expense.

Your policy would not be voided on an address issue. Not sure why you woudl think this would happen? Your car can be registered in another name and at another address and there is no issue and that is even stated on the V5. V5 is not proof of ownership.
As for your last remark, why would your premium rise because a car was kept elsewhere? Do you notify the insurance company every time you are off in the caravan as the car is not being kept at home?
The mind boggles and I am surprised that a normally rational person like yourself has come to this conclusion?

 

[colin-yorkshire1]

Your policy would not be voided on an address issue. Not sure why you woudl think this would happen? Your car can be registered in another name and at another address and there is no issue and that is even stated on the V5. V5 is not proof of ownership.
As for your last remark, why would your premium rise because a car was kept elsewhere? Do you notify the insurance company every time you are off in the caravan as the car is not being kept at home?
The mind boggles and I am surprised that a normally rational person like yourself has come to this conclusion?

funny that Surfer I was thinking along the same lines myself, I can't for the life of me see the difference between the senario put forward by Steve and using your van over the summer on a seasonal pitch, in both cases you are technicaly on holiday all be it for a longer period. the assumption put forward by Parksy is reasonable if the question "where is the vehicle normally kept" assumes that it means a perminant residence, non of my insurance policies are worded as such, however one could add if required (during the summer it's on the Medows camp site at such an address) same as night workers would add their works address to the question where is the vehicle kept overnight,
my son works for an oil company doing 2weeks on, 2weeks off, so in fact 6 months of the year his car is parked at the heliport in Aberdeen but theres never been a problem with insurance.

 

[Parksy]

Your policy would not be voided on an address issue. Not sure why you woudl think this would happen? Your car can be registered in another name and at another address and there is no issue and that is even stated on the V5. V5 is not proof of ownership.
As for your last remark, why would your premium rise because a car was kept elsewhere? Do you notify the insurance company every time you are off in the caravan as the car is not being kept at home?
The mind boggles and I am surprised that a normally rational person like yourself has come to this conclusion?

I'd agree that if an insurer asked if a vehicle was normally kept on your drive at home and it happened to be parked in the street or you were on holiday elsewhere and was stolen, the insurance policy would be unlikely to be voided.
This is not the case with Steve though.
One of the questions that I've always been asked is: 'Where is the vehicle normally kept overnight?'
The address given is one of the factors used to asses the degree of risk and therefore the price of the premium, which is based on the degree of risk.
If false details are provided the insurer is being deceived and would not be able to correctly assess the degree of risk associated with the vehicle and it's driver(s)
We don't know whether or not an insurer would regard a driver who lived a semi- itinerant life in a touring caravan would be a greater or lesser risk for them to insure but it's unlikely to be exactly the same as the risk for a driver who lived permanently in a house because the lifestyle is quite different.
If the risk was the same then why would Steve not inform the insurer of the true correct facts, that he lived in a touring caravan rather than at the address which he had provided to the insurer?

 

[stuey]

hi all
obviously im new to this site and chose it as there seem to be a number of fellow residential caravanners here.
ive now lived in my caravan as sole residence for over 6 yrs since divorcing in 2007, starting off in the 24yr old family luner delta 19ft my friend took me onto land on his garden nursery by the sea in the northeast for 10 months, hooked up to the mains for electric and barrelled water and waste, my son visiting every weekend helped as i was a broken man after a long marriage. for the nxt 2 and a half yrs i lived in the bottom field of a horse farm on the north yorkshire coast with beautiful views in a friendly village community, given enough land to rent and make a nice garden with a shed to store all my crapp...again hooked up to mains but with a permanent hose for water and a soakaway for grey water waste... in feb 2009 i bought a fantastic 26 ft x 8 ft tabbert with picture windows, initially a 'dry van' but being an engineer and a joiner by trade i installed every mod con you can imagine inc a twin tub washing machine. in oct 2009 i closed my heating business of 20 yrs due to divorce costs and 100 miles commuting every day to my business and march 2010 embarked on the biggest adventure of my life driving 340 miles from my home town to work on the new forest campsites as a site assistant finishing my last season 3 months ago and returning to the northeast as my mums health has deteriated over the last 2 yrs....now staying at a working mens club site with 4 other permanent residents and taken up work in the nearby town.
after reading most of your comments (ill sit down to read them all over the nxt week) some issues are issues as discussed, others have been easily solved lol
legal residency is an issue...but not while working for a campsite,
car insurence wasnt an issue, they were informed that i travel about and simply wanted a permanent address for the policy which i gave as my mums, along with car licence and log book, the police were happy with this arrangment last time i spoke to them (not for any offences lol)
doctors are always happy to take you on as a 'temporary resident' and tend to encourage you to register with them after 6 months so that they can take on your records
dentists...mmmm thats another story they are not keen on taking anyone that isnt willing to pay private, this may be the norm ??
caravan insurence while your living in it .... major issues with that one ending in, un-insured caravan, total minefield so allarms , wheel locks, neighbourhood watch has been the way so far...not a great solution i know.
finances and cost of living a distinct advantage also signing on for a short period only posed a problem in that they demanded an address regardless of wether i lived there ?... also according to dole office i was homeless as caravans arnt accepted as accommodation but govt says its a house liable for council tax !! another burning issue i have been looking into when i found the answers within this thread.....i should only get about 10 yrs !
emotionally....ive never felt better in my lovely little home, though its very easy to detach from society im a bit of a recluse ?? but use fb and the odd forum for my social networking to keep in touch with friends and family using and internet dongle and mobile fone, tvs on freeview satellite and digital through the omnistat ariel...
hope not to be shot down in flames for living what wasnt intentionally a slightly risky lifestyle, but i sure dont want to ever live in a house again......thanks for reading sorry it was soo long .

 

[stuey]

wow its takin me ages to sift through all the posts on this thread and feeling less lonely in my situation as i read more and more people living this lifestyle with success....not sure if its been covered yet on the water front and jack frost ? i over came this by installing a 90 litre in-board water tank under the bed, i also installed the 2kw electric conversion to the truma gas warm air heater and leave that on permanently through the winter keeping everything warm and frost free..apart from the waste master which has frozen a couple of times but also making sure my aquaroll is empty after filling and the pump taken indoors after use

 

[JonnyG]

hi parksy...
"The police would have informed the insurance company and there is a very good chance that they would have immediately voided the policy because it had been fraudulently obtained."
Are you assuming that this is what happens? you know the police go out of the way to get in touch with an insurance firm with regards a wrong address on the insurance policy? I very much doubt that.....

 

[Parksy]

hi parksy...
"The police would have informed the insurance company and there is a very good chance that they would have immediately voided the policy because it had been fraudulently obtained."
Are you assuming that this is what happens? you know the police go out of the way to get in touch with an insurance firm with regards a wrong address on the insurance policy? I very much doubt that.....

It would depend on how serious an incident took place wouldn't it? If there was a fatality I'm pretty sure that the police would thoroughly investigate every apspect including whether or not all parties were insured. They would surely notice if a discrepancy came to light with the policy holder living in a location which was different to that on the policy and the insurers would look at the police report.
Are you suggesting that motor insurance cover should be left to chance? If it was me I'd make sure that everything regarding my car insurance was strictly above board and legit.

hi all
obviously im new to this site and chose it as there seem to be a number of fellow residential caravanners here.
ive
now lived in my caravan as sole residence for over 6 yrs since
divorcing in 2007, starting off in the 24yr old family luner delta 19ft
my friend took me onto land on his garden nursery by the sea in the
northeast for 10 months, hooked up to the mains for electric and
barrelled water and waste, my son visiting every weekend helped as i was
a broken man after a long marriage...........

Hello Stuey and welcome to the Practical Caravan forum.
It's great that you are getting your life back, I divorced after 16 years and stayed in an old 4 berth tourer hooked up to the mains in my friends large back garden for almost a year. I used the caravan mainly for sleeping in and was allocated a council flat when my friends sold their house and I'm now in our own house with the lady who I wished that I'd met years ago

As you have seen there are forum members who live on sites full time who have added many good nuggets of information to this thread, and forum members are a friendly bunch so please feel free to take part in any of the discussions, gossip and jokes on here.

 

[Surfer]

Just to add it is not an offence to have the address on the V5 different to where you live as long as you are contactable. All motabilituy and lease vehicles have the name of motability or the lease company and not your name and address. RK means person responsible for vehicle and not the name of the owner of the vehicle.
The same applies to insurance. Every insurance application asks where the car is kept during the day and where it is kept at night. If you complete it correctly, there is no issue with the police or any one else.

 

[Parksy]

That is precisely my point Surfer, Steve wrote that he'd given the address as a relatives house rather than where he was living which meant that the details were not correct.

 

[stuey]

thank you for the welcome parksy
im glad you found your sanctuary in love and the place to be in your life....im still searching for both and feel im free to choose and move closer to mine living this way....obstacles n all

 

[stuey]

hello again
its taken me 4 hours but i now know the full contents of this very long and very informative thread
i dont want to get tangled up in political/legal issues too much as it dampens the spirit of full timing a little but....is relavent!
certainly with reference to giving full information regarding any insurence wether that be motor or caravan....the fact that any false or avoidance of information may invalidate your claim or anyones claim against you should there be an accident or theft, could be your loss and waste of premiums and/or worse...custodial consequences relating to fraud !
the question about how to insure your touring van for residential use has been asked a few times and the simple answer is, i havnt found one yet but within this thread a suggestion about static residential insurence is a path worth persuing as they may ? consider a touring van being used for this ?? my van is a tabbert made by hobby and there was only one ins co that would deal with them last time i tried 3 yrs back....same thing tho they put the fone down as soon as i mentioned i lived in it !!!

back to the happier topics of the practicalities of full timing
someone mentioned internet again and it was covered..just to add that i bought, orange, vodafone, 02 and tmobile dongles then each time i move, plug each one in to see which has the best signal, then put a month on it theres always one that works lol
site fees were the other issues....some seem to pay an awful lot ??? £40 a week inc elec as a long term or seasonal is about the norm so far for me...£30 inc in the forest but that was discounted for being out of season staff for CCC
now just entering into my 7th year of fulltiming i would recommend it to anyone as alternate living and for financial benefits

hope all the users on this thread still come back to it from time to time....i do get lonely on my own lol

 

[Parksy]

There is a lot of good information in the thread Stuey.
Please don't pay too much heed to the political / legal stuff which has been written because in common with lots of internet forums none of it makes a great deal of difference in the real world and some of it is just for arguments sake on a wet dark evening for some of the contributors.
The cheapest seasonal pitch that I've ever come across is near to Pershore by the River Avon and it has just risen to £600 from March 1st until the last day of October, it was £120 when I had a seasonal pitch there a few years ago. Prices can vary so much but I'd imagine that it's possible to obtain a pitch f.o.c. plus wages if you work on the site.

 

[stuey]

hi agian
yes its a great thread for sure ive enjoyed reading it and feel less insecure about an issue thats been worrying me for a while thats been covered, my pitch with working in the forest for 6 months of the summer was indeed free and a really good wage on top...more than im earning here in civvy street !! but the hours took its toll last season so im taking a year out along with the fact my mums ill as mentioned earlier but im glad to say so far....ive done it with no regrets i just need to find a better place than where i am at the moment...tho i dont get any hassle for living and working from here at the mo...so it has its advantages.

 

[Surfer]

There is a lot of good information in the thread Stuey.
Please don't pay too much heed to the political / legal stuff which has been written because in common with lots of internet forums none of it makes a great deal of difference in the real world and some of it is just for arguments sake on a wet dark evening for some of the contributors.
The cheapest seasonal pitch that I've ever come across is near to Pershore by the River Avon and it has just risen to £600 from March 1st until the last day of October, it was £120 when I had a seasonal pitch there a few years ago. Prices can vary so much but I'd imagine that it's possible to obtain a pitch f.o.c. plus wages if you work on the site.

Isn't that the site that keeps being flooded?

 

[Parksy]

The site only ever flooded once Surfer, although once was enough as far as we were concerned.

If the warden at the time had bothered to phone a few of us when he had the flood warning we could have taken most if not all of the caravans off the site, he had 12 hours notice and all of our phone numbers.
The site is now under new ownership and the previous warden was sacked and had to leave the site when the facts came to light.
I think that the new owners built some sort of flood defence wall or bank along the riverside but it's still relatively inexpensive for a seasonal pitch and my best mate and his parents will be there again on 1st March.

 

[Surfer]

We have now found a nice seasonal site in the Malverns not far from Ledbury for the 30 weeks which is £300 and then £10 per night. Happy days!

 

[stuey]

lol....the site im on now has also flooded a few times inc 2 days after i arrived in late sept, hence i fitted a flood alarm for when im asleep and the site owner has my number to fone when im at work ..not bad at all surfer £10 per week for the season !!! tho the £10 per night afterwards is a bit steep ....

 

[Steve L]

Hi Stuey.
I know what you mean about civy street.
We went back to living there Dec 2011, after nearly 4 years of fulltiming.
I would go back to the caravan if I were in better health. I have found a spinal surgeon in Gloucester who will do one operation on my back to try to get feeling back to my legs. At the mo I walk by looking at my feet, to co-ordinate them. Also this year I'm having operations for carpul tunnel on both hands. So I'll be laid up most of the summer. But hopefully my wife will tow the van to Builth wells and Tywyn for a few days of R & R. I am sure that while we lived in our van, I recovered much better from operations.
I always revisit the forum to see if both newbies and oldhands are still doing ok with fulltiming and to see if there is anything I can do to helpout.
We had a couple park their motor home outside our home last weekend. The were fulltiming in it. I offered them a power hook up for the night from my home, which they were very greatfull for. Mind you, someone dobbed me into the housing warden and she told me off. But hey ho water of a ducks back and all that. She is definately a NIMBY and if she had to live without her house and mod cons, she wouldn't have a clue how to be self sufficiant.