Retirement

[Wendy-Norfolk]

Quote gio,

Every situation is diferent,and i don't think i would put up with looking after grandchildren[when i have them]just so the parents can keep up with the jones

Unfortunately gio, it's a difficult world for the young people nowadays, they HAVE to work to satisfy mortgage companies, and with the rise in utilities, every little helps!

I am willing to help out with my grand daughter, under my terms, as I would rather do that than seeing my son or his partner laying about at home, drawing benefits,rather than doing an honest days work... and believe me, they would probably be better off on the dole!!!

I don't know what age group you fall into, but when we had a young family, 70s/80s it wasn't as difficult, I didn't have to work, my husband was the bread winner, and we had a mortgage to pay, we managed!!

Not so easy today IMHO!!

 

[JasonR_374341560]

Our daughter was born in 1980 and we both had to work, we had two, three and four jobs on the go at times and had our son as well.

My friends sectretary pays over

 

[Pat_374304630]

Good for you colin.

If you're up Northampton way ( we are 8 miles from Daventry,remember that place )Give us a shout and we will meet for a drink.

 

[Wendy-Norfolk]

Jason R

I agree with some of the points you have made as regard to grandchildren, neither my parents or inlaws helped with any sort of child care, I didn't expect it, but I was lucky enough to be at home with my children until they went to school!

I often ask my children, what sort of memories they keep of their grandparents, sadly they never really come up with anything, because their grandparents were so wrapped up in their own lives, they didn't have time for them! Sadly, both my mother and MIL are on their own, do my children really care....NO!! Do they visit either of them.....NO!! and I don't blame them!

You reap what you sow! :O)

 

[Lord Braykewynde]

Just to pick up on a point that Wendy made, it's not only mortgages today. All youngsters have to have the latest mod cons and they aren't prepared to wait like my generation. We made do until we could afford it.

They must have the largest flat screen TV, whether its LCD or plasma. The latest music system or games console. Latest mobiles or IPods. Laptops and desktop computers. Games for us were the cost of Ludo or Monopoly.

Then theres transport, that means a car each because they are both working. I never sold a car when I had a young family, after me they went for scrap because they were full of rust.

Because both are working they either tend to eat out or send for a food delivery, jeeeezzzzz no time for cooking.

Today is a material society and young families feel that they must have these latest gizmo's, either to keep up with or better the Jones's and they don't want them today or tomorrow, they want them yesterday.

Contrary to what Wendy says todays youngsters haven't got it all bad. We didn't have creche facilities, maternity leave for one parent, let alone two, as they have today.

My wife worked for a company called DENCO as a typist and in 1969 she was pregnant with our first child. She and a colleague, who was also pregnant, were sacked because of it. The MD didnt think it looked right for clients to see pregnant ladies while visiting the offices. There was no redundancy for them then, no union protection because they were in their right to sack them. The only hue and cry was the headlines in the local rag and a mention in the Jimmy Young column of the Daily Sketch.

I'm not saying thats right to sack people for being pregnant but the point is we all struggled. Even if my inlaws wanted to help us in those days it meant catching two buses because probably 50% of families never had a car and even less had a telephone.

Thankfully I'm glad it's not an issue for us because our daughter doesn't expect it, I'm not to sure about our youngest son though when he starts a family.

 

[Wendy-Norfolk]

Lord B,

I didn't say that youngsters had a bad time, all I said was, it's difficult! You try getting on the property ladder on one salary!!

I will agree, there is a lot of materialism in todays young, but, I am looking at things from my and my families' experiences, you can't tar everyone with the same brush!!

 

[Jo-AnneFairway5402010]

jason r, im lost for words. i hope your children dont read this forum i cant belive you regret having children. so when the grandchildren come along you wont be interested at all in them and wont look after them?. But its okay for you to dump the dogs at your daughter then when you go holidaying it up?.

if she has kids and wanted a night out its a big NO NO.

im sure she didnt ask to be born and when she went to uni i understand that you supported her and struggled so why didnt you tell her no way and get a job?.

jason i am shocked but you wont be the first im sure most of this toppic will shock me.

i hope theres no hard feeling but my mouth is still open from the shock.

jo-anne

 

[Jo-AnneFairway5402010]

colin,i can see your points of view to a degree. everyday and the dogs is a bit much.

to whoever my mum and dad have our two boys on a tuesday 4pm till 7pm they have tea and usually do something like go the park or whatever. if we need to go somewhere on a weekend or after school they will always have them. they would rather have them than us pay a babysitter. things now days aint like they used to be are they?.

my mum and dad love the boys to bits. they are so protective of them and i think its because of lucas being 14 weeks prem, weighing 14oz and being in intensive care for 11 weeks and then in hospital till he was 5 months old home on oxygen and could have died over and over again. reece was diagnosed with the wrong epilepsy and given the wrong drug and high volumes of drugs for 3 years he now has learning difficulties and he had mobility problems he also could have died. they both have some special needs and have both had operations and lucas still has chronic lung disease. we are so lucky to have them and they are so special.

i love my mum and dad to have the boys and they love going and they love having them. i do think grandparents should spend some quality time with there grand children but then i think some people expect to much of there mum and dad.

theres too much and theres no enough.

craigs mum and dad have had lucas 3 times now hes almost 6 and it hurts myself and craig that they dont bother a little more.

from a grandaughter point of view my nan and grandad didnt bother really with us and i wish they had.

well i got a bit off my chest im sure i will upset some of you but you can take it your hard grandparents, lol.

sorry i could resist

no hard feelings

jo-anne

 

[Moonstone1]

Quote:

It's interesting reading from the opposite end of the family spectrum, you guys having retired with grandchildrenm and we have one (who is almost 2) and another on the way.

I work full time, SWMBO works 3 days a week, son is at nursery for those 3 days. We live near my parents, in laws live 2 hours drive away. Neither are expected to look after him as WE chose to have kids, not them. We manage financially (but are not loaded), but we are not the material types with new cars or fancy TVs or stereos (our van is 10 years old & without a TV !).

A bit more interest would be nice from my parents, but I by no means expect them to become permananet carers. I didn't turn out so bad, but I don't agree with some of how they brought me and my sister up, so we will be responsible for care, not them.

oooooooooooooooooooo

Couldn't agree more. We chose to have children, our view is that our parents have already brought up children, and their retirement is time for themselves. When we had ours, we managed on the one salary, and it was a struggle. After the 2nd was born, I got a Christmas job at Argos for 12 weeks, working evenings and weekends, which I did for 4 years every year. When the youngest went to school, I got a morning job, which fitted around school and fortunately I was off in the school holidays. When this wasn't the case, I used an after school/kids club type placed. We aren't the type of people after the newest tv, car, holiday etc, and we save up for everything we need - don't even have a credit card! But that was the way we were brought up. I hope that I have instilled this into both my boys who are now 13 and 15. Just before Christmas, things were getting a bit tighter, so I changed my job to full-time, which now suits us. But in all this time, I have never expected the grandparents to care for our children.

I must say though, my children think that we are odd as all their friends spend lots of time with their grandparents whilst the parents go out either working or for leisure. I have a couple of friends who retired last year and the contract is so different - 1 is tied to the grandchildren and 1 isn't - but is living it up, by bowling, gardening, swimming, etc etc. I know which one I would choose.

Sorry to get on my high horse - but I really get annoyed about this subject (obviously not for some circumstances). There is a choice - SAY NO!

 

[giovanni_5060838]

Wendy i do not disagree with you, as you say you are prepared to help out but on your own terms. good

And as i said, i am prepared to help out,even with large finance,if need be, but not for the extras of life.ie new everything.

LB. surely the parents must take some of the blame if the young of today want everything right now?

Is it not a parents duty to teach them not only right from wrong but the pitfulls of life in general.

I see so many parents of today using the excuss that they went without,whatever and it will be different for their children!

And at 45 i do not feel i am an old fuddy duddy, but my parents did there best without going anywhere near over the top.

I tried to do the same with my lads eddie would have been 21 last sept, and laurence is 17 in march, both had/have part time jobs, to learn the value of earning their own money.as we never went overboard.

Eddie worked for barclays bank and los has stayed on at school.

Like i said early we would help anyway we could,because you never know whats around the corner..

 

[Jo-AnneFairway5402010]

Lord B,

I didn't say that youngsters had a bad time, all I said was, it's difficult! You try getting on the property ladder on one salary!!

I will agree, there is a lot of materialism in todays young, but, I am looking at things from my and my families' experiences, you can't tar everyone with the same brush!!

wendy well said mate x

 

[Lord Braykewynde]

"LB. surely the parents must take some of the blame if the young of today want everything right now"?

I think it's unfair to blame the parents if their grown up children want all the latest gizmo's straight away. Like you say, you can instill in them the priorities of life and just hope they follow them. It's just that these things are in their face all the time through advertising etc. It would also be hard when their kids are asking for these games etc because their friends have them.

We have helped our kids financially when they've had the need and we've had the money, and so has my MIL, but it's not to buy these unneccessary luxuries. I do get annoyed though because they insist on paying it back and get offended if we don't take it. We can't even tell them about our will, where it's kept etc. because they don't want to talk about such things.

 

[giovanni_5060838]

Well LB, it seems like they have good values,and whilst i disagree with the"you cannot blame the parents" as i believe they have a great input into how their children turn out,and i know there are exceptions to this, in the same vein you can complement parents on doing a good job too.

Which may apply to you.

 

[Jo-AnneFairway5402010]

Jason R

I agree with some of the points you have made as regard to grandchildren, neither my parents or inlaws helped with any sort of child care, I didn't expect it, but I was lucky enough to be at home with my children until they went to school!

I often ask my children, what sort of memories they keep of their grandparents, sadly they never really come up with anything, because their grandparents were so wrapped up in their own lives, they didn't have time for them! Sadly, both my mother and MIL are on their own, do my children really care....NO!! Do they visit either of them.....NO!! and I don't blame them!

You reap what you sow! :O)

wendy again i agree

jo x

 

[Jo-AnneFairway5402010]

I have not given all the facts regarding my daughter's situation and the grandchildren. Without going into detail my daughter's ex-partner (not ex-husband) tried to kill her and our grand son last July. he is now serving time in prison. My daughter is not to bad at the moment but the grandson (11 years old) is still having flashbacks and whilst sometimes is great other times he is very frightened. We feel we owe him some form of stability in his young life and that is why we are there for both the children. Sorry for not disclosing the extenuating circumstances.

colin you sound just like my dad, bless you mate you sound a top grandad.

jo-anne x

 

[JasonR_374341560]

jo-anne.

In recent times I told both my children that I would never have had them if I had known what we would have gone through. My daughter has no interest in children and can't stand them and nor does my son.

Daughter loves the dogs, so it is no chore for her and when she comes to us I don't charge her or my son for food.

My wife and I also willingly coughed up for there her house and his apartment. All we ever expected in return is a little respect and considration.

We've also taken my great nephews caravanning as they were interested and we love them to bits, but that is not demanded or expected of us by their parents who are about to become caravanners.

 

[Jo-AnneFairway5402010]

jason at the beginning of this longgggggggggg disgussion you came across so different. now you have told us more i do understand a bit more. my sister never wanted kids and she stuck to it so maybe it might be the same for your kids.

its nice that you have helped them financially. my mum and dad you give us his last penny but i dont think craigs would.

jo-anne

 

[Chaps]

We've always tried really hard not to put on Rob's parents where childcare is concerned especially as Claire's parents both passed away young and sadly didn't get to meet our kids. Claire has only ever worked part time since becoming a mum but she changed her job when our twins started school so that she could work term time as well. Rob's mum is now retired and has helped more with our little one who's now 4 than she did with our 12 year old twins. She has a wonderful relationship with him as a result but when Claire went back to work, she purposely used a childminder for the majority of childcare so that mum felt she could go away whenever she wanted to and the childminder would step into the breach - actually parents are on a Caribbean Cruise at this very moment! She only picks him up from nursery one day a week now anyway and then has him for about 20 minutes before Claire's home.

It's really hard in today's 'must have' society to get the balance right - we'd have a much higher standard of living if Claire worked full time but we don't want our kids passed from pillar to post in the school holidays and letting themselves into the house after school. We have friends in this situation who are always quick to tell you about their next foreign holiday but their kids don't get to invite friends home for tea or around to play in the school holidays. Claire's always been there for all 3 of our kids and we can quite honestly say that had we not been able to afford for her to work only part time, we wouldn't have had kids. That said, we would have been quite happy for Claire to work full time and Rob to be part time but it made more financial sense to do it the traditional way around.

 

[mickk]

When my parents both retired they bought a Swift caravan & the week after easter they hitched up & went to a site in mid Wales & stayed till the kids went back to school in September, as we had children it was were we went for weekends in our van & on our main holiday to see them, as they had both worked hard to bring a family of 4 up, so they fully deserved their retirement & not being expected to look after our kids (you have them so look after them your selves) but its nice for the kids to see them when we go to the site they stopped on.

Mick k.

 

[colin(bridgend)]

There has been many different views on this topic depending on one's age. The old saying where we had it harder in our childhood is often true as money and goods were far harder to obtain as a result of the second world war. I remember rationing of food, etc. and yes my parents tried to give my brothers, sister and myself the very best they could manage. My mother would play put and take with my father's wages every Friday. Our hoidays were either two weeks with an aunt in Cardiff or with our Gran in Neath. Looking back I think that we all four children had a brilliant childhood and I would not swap it for today's child.

The family/financial troubles started in this country when they took both partners wages into consideration for a mortgage. It should have been just the one wage be it the husband or wife depending who was the larger wage earner. The cost of housing rocketed and went even higher when they offered more than 100% valuation figure as a mortgage. Now they are reverting to a max. of 100% valuation which could put many home owners in queer street as the price of property will drop as a result.

Sir Alan Sugar was on TV yesterday evening and I agree with his views regarding the employment of female staff. Female staff in a professional role are as capable as male staff in most instances. However females are the ones who give birth to the child and there is the bond between mother and child whether it be in the human world or animal world. In nature it is generally the male who provides for the family whilst the female is caring for the young. For this reason it is to be considered by an employer when taking on female staff as to the possibility of a family future and the employer having to fund towards maternity leave etc. I do not agree with this new fangle idea of paternity leave. It is also generally the caring nature of a mother to tend to the young when they are sick. A village nursery close by is open from 6:00am to 9:00pm seven days a week and taking in babies from 6 weeks old for the parents to return to work. They now both have to work because, as Lord B. states they must have every thing new yesterday. A friend of the daughter has recently moved house and she has given all her old furniture, bed linen, towels, crockery, etc. away as she wants all new in her new house - easy come easy go and put it all on the plastic card. No appreciation of value at all.

 

[Rioja]

It's not our grand children that are the problem, it's having the time to do other things too.

Suddenly our previously large and rather unkempt garden has become my wife's passion. ( We have just erected a green house for her too !), she also now has the time for her twice (mid)-weekly keep fit sessions. We also like to keep in touch with friends who only have the weekends off for Friday Saturday night get togethers.

Time has also been spent caring for my elderly mother who has had health problems of late but still has the independance of her home.

When I worked, a lot of time was spent away from home staying in my caravan. Wife worked with me, so the caravan was our home from home for 100 plus nights a year. We love it.

In the last 28 months we have spent about 3 months (5 outings) in it, which is reasonable by some standards but not really getting full use.

We did manage a 4 week first trip abroad last year which was a long held ambition but we are in no rush to go back, enjoyable though it was.

There are some excellent travel package deals available which I think are better value and less efort than towing a caravan to the south of France ( Been to India twice, Gambia once each holiday cheaper than the caravan one.)

So retirement might not turn out the way you expected it to. As long as you are enjoying it is all that matters.

I keep on looking at my beloved van and thinking either use it more often or sell it.

I can't do the latter as I enjoy using it to much, must try and make time to use it then. So far, we only have plans to use it three times this year, if indeed we manage it. A meagre 5 weeks use. Ah well such is life.

 

[Dustydog]

Thanks to the fat cats spoiling everything I took early retirement end of 2006. Only young but with 38 years at the same firm I'd had enough.

How on earth I ever got anything done when I was working was a miracle. I still can't find enough time in the day.

My daughter is due a babe soon and I am really looking forward to taking him / her away in the van and doing the spoiling thing like every granparent does. It will not interfere with our own trips away.

At the other end of the spectrum I have taken my mum and dad touring Scotland five times in recent years. The old chap is 86 now and quite honestly it was easier looking afte rscreaming baies than him. But he is my dad so you just get on with it. Terri's mum and dad have a van and we spend many weeks a year touring with them. It's great although I must confess we usually end up doing most of his hitching and pitching. He is very good and I have at last stopped him playing ball games near our caravans. He's learnt to do this near other peoples vans now. Who said you can't teach an old dog new tricks.

Jo-anne

You go and enjoy every day you can in your Onyx even if Craig has to go to work.

Cheers

Alan

 

[Chrissylizzie]

Our children are now 30 and 27 and when we decided to bring children into the world we felt that they must be largely our responsibility from then on. We both had elderly parents and my father died when he was 59. The lesson I learned from this is that there is no guarantee of old age so life must be lived whenever funds will allow.

I was a stay at home mum as we had young children and elderly parents at the same time, but financially it was VERY hard. At no time, would I have expected my mum to have my children on a regular basis, as she did her bit bringing up me and my brother and sister. Her time was for her - saddly without the company of my father.

We now have an 18 month old granddaughter and my daughter has chosen to work two days a week as she can do so as my son-in-law is self employed so they juggle things between them. She also has the attitude that she would not want nor expect us to have to babysit on a regular basis, although we do so fairly often, and always would in necessary. Financially however, they are struggling, but still put their daughter first.

I feel strongly that if you make the decision to bring babies into the world they are your responsibility, and this probably will involve sacrifices, but this generally means that the children will grow up with better values in life.

If two parents have to work that is one thing, but many these days do so just so they can afford all the best holidays etc. etc. and without considering what might be best for the child.

Retirement should also be the time for parents to enjoy time together whilst they have each other and not be tied by their grandchildren, unless that is their choice, of course.

 

[Lord Braykewynde]

"I feel strongly that if you make the decision to bring babies into the world they are your responsibility, and this probably will involve sacrifices, but this generally means that the children will grow up with better values in life".

My sentiments exactly. And those sacrifices can entail having to make do with a 26" TV instead of a 42" plasma TV. Or having to wait awhile until one can afford Sky TV. Having to rough it with a second hand Playstation or a handmedown computer. Having to stay in and not spend so much money clubbing or eating out.

Driving around in an old banger until better times arrive. If having children, working around the partners working hours for the wife to get a job if the needs must.

I think those that do it this way gain more satisfaction out of life, a greater bonding together and self achievement.

"Retirement should also be the time for parents to enjoy time together whilst they have each other and not be tied by their grandchildren, unless that is their choice, of course".

Again true, this is how we see it and I certainly don't feel selfish. We also have friends who would spend 24/7 with their granchildren, that is their choice, but somehow I do think they are missing out but it's a good job we aren't all the same and as long as they are happy doing that that's all that matters.

 

[BrianStAlbans]

And those sacrifices can entail having to make do with a 26" TV instead of a 42" plasma TV. Or having to wait awhile until one can afford Sky TV. Having to rough it with a second hand Playstation or a handmedown computer. Having to stay in and not spend so much money clubbing or eating out.

Driving around in an old banger until better times arrive.

Story of my life. :O)