Warning: your towbar could invalidate your car insurance

[Buckman]

I recall on a past post way back BMW may be a candidate 🤔

Equally I well recall 99% of people who bought a new car and requested a tow bar didn’t get what they thought .The Dealer called in a local towbar fitted who did the job. The Dealer then added his 35%.

The AA / Covea proposal form I recently filled in on line, as I said, was very specific about modifications even listing them .The recent FOS decision mentioned earlier will also have influenced most insurers in the information gathering at proposal time.

Listing them is covering both their and your position for the future.
Why play semantics and possibly prejudice your own claim?

Surely far better to err on the side of caution and disclose everything?

Agree that it is better to err on side of caution, but you may be surprised at the number of modern cars that require the towbar to be fitted at the factory due to the electronics in the car. Apparently many fitting companies do not have access to the technology required to fit the electrics for the towbar.

 

[Beachball]

Just to say when i had my previous car the Volkswagen Tiguan we had a Westfalia Detachable towbar & 13 pin socket i did advise my car insurance .
But no longer towing .

 

[Dustydog]

Agree that it is better to err on side of caution, but you may be surprised at the number of modern cars that require the towbar to be fitted at the factory due to the electronics in the car. Apparently many fitting companies do not have access to the technology required to fit the electrics for the towbar.

That is certainly true of Tesla and some BMW but I didn’t think it was too widespread . Maybe it’s worsened and the poor Tow Bar fitters are losing their jobs😉

 

[Buckman]

That is certainly true of Tesla and some BMW but I didn’t think it was too widespread . Maybe it’s worsened and the poor Tow Bar fitters are losing their jobs😉

I think VW are another where it is factory fitted to certain new vehicles? When connecting the trailer, the car becomes aware of the trailer and shuts down reversing sensors, adapts suspension etc.

 

[Buckman]

I am with Tesco and I checked all my policy documents and nowhere is there a field for modifications. More than likely as habit I included it when doing the application Online through one of the comparison sites, but now no proof that I did include the towbar. In addition, I had side steps added which I did forget to mention, but apparently they do not count if fitted to help someone with a disability?

I cannot check as Tesco insurance have been taken over by Barclay. If you log onto the Tesco car insurance and go to contact all you get is a message that it has been taken over by Barclay. Now I am unsure?

 

[otherclive]

I am with Tesco and I checked all my policy documents and nowhere is there a field for modifications. More than likely as habit I included it when doing the application Online through one of the comparison sites, but now no proof that I did include the towbar. In addition, I had side steps added which I did forget to mention, but apparently they do not count if fitted to help someone with a disability?

I cannot check as Tesco insurance have been taken over by Barclay. If you log onto the Tesco car insurance and go to contact all you get is a message that it has been taken over by Barclay. Now I am unsure?

Best to contact Barclay if you are unsure about your policy.

 

[Buckman]

Best to contact Barclay if you are unsure about your policy.

We have never been given contact details for Barclay car insurance. Contact details for banking and credit cards if you go to Barclay website. TBH I didn't even knew that Barclay did car insurance!

With it being transferred to Barclay has created a concern for me. Not very happy about it and doubt I could change car insurance due to it being taken over and which has been in place since mid August.

A bit of a quandary for me.

 

[JTQ]

I have declared I "tow" a caravan and trailer, assuming two thing will be inherently obvious, it has a tow hook, and the specific vehicle I purchased is factory prepared for towing.
In my case a Disco 4 there is no towbar, just a tow hook inserted in a receiver that is an integral part of the vehicle.
I do, for other reasons never drive solo with the hook in the receiver, its in the factor integrated stowage.
When I had my headlights and front grill stolen NFU never mentioned anything about towing.

 

[otherclive]

We have never been given contact details for Barclay car insurance. Contact details for banking and credit cards if you go to Barclay website. TBH I didn't even knew that Barclay did car insurance!

With it being transferred to Barclay has created a concern for me. Not very happy about it and doubt I could change car insurance due to it being taken over and which has been in place since mid August.

A bit of a quandary for me.

Are you sure that the insurance has moved as Tesco Bank moved to Barclays but their insurances remained with Tesco.

Tesco Bank and Barclays Partnership

Find out more about our banking business transfer to Barclays Bank UK PLC.

www.tescobank.com

 

[Dustydog]

We have never been given contact details for Barclay car insurance. Contact details for banking and credit cards if you go to Barclay website. TBH I didn't even knew that Barclay did car insurance!

With it being transferred to Barclay has created a concern for me. Not very happy about it and doubt I could change car insurance due to it being taken over and which has been in place since mid August.

A bit of a quandary for me.

Barclays Bank purchased the entire Tesco Bank business , few months ago. £600 million. As Clive said no change to the insurance arm which remains with Tesco.

Tesco are the intermediary not the Insurer. I believe the following is still current:

Tesco Bank car insurance is arranged by Tesco Personal Finance plc, which acts as an insurance intermediary on behalf of a number of insurers:

• Covea Insurance plc: Underwrites most of the policy, except for Section M, which is underwritten by Ageas Insurance Limited
• AM Europe for Legal Expenses

The list of modifications I saw was on the AA / Covea on line proposal form.
All phone numbers remain in place.
It shouldn’t hinder you contacting “Tesco” as you would have done previously.

As we have all said it will be wise , if you are unsure, to tell them about your extras.

 

[Buckman]

After trying a couple of numbers where you have to listen to various options and then to find out that the number will not take you to the correct department I got through.

On the "correct" number it was repeated several times that I could go Online and do the changes and if phoning the admin cost is £25. Problem is that at present you cannot do the changes Online.

On speaking to the rep weirdly they could not see where modifications where added? Eventually he said he would just add a note and no charge. No issue with side steps.

 

[Dustydog]

After trying a couple of numbers where you have to listen to various options and then to find out that the number will not take you to the correct department I got through.

On the "correct" number it was repeated several times that I could go Online and do the changes and if phoning the admin cost is £25. Problem is that at present you cannot do the changes Online.

On speaking to the rep weirdly they could not see where modifications where added? Eventually he said he would just add a note and no charge. No issue with side steps.

Sorted!

 

[Buckman]

The list of modifications I saw was on the AA / Covea on line proposal form.
All Tesco Bank staff have been transferred to Barclays Bank. All phone numbers remain
It shouldn’t hinder you contacting “Tesco” as you would have done previously

However there is no contact numbers for Tesco insurance on the car insurance website which is different to the Tesco bank website.

In addition when originally doing the application as I had a Tesco credit card, it defaulted me to the credit card which I have have not used for several months. I had to use another email address to do the car insurance.

Anyway sorted now and hope I do not have to make any other changes.

 

[Buckman]

That is certainly true of Tesla and some BMW but I didn’t think it was too widespread . Maybe it’s worsened and the poor Tow Bar fitters are losing their jobs😉

From another forum. "I originally ordered a Tiguan 2.0 D, but due to coding and ongoing software issues with the towbar, it had to be a factory order with a factory-fit towbar."

 

[Dustydog]

From another forum. "I originally ordered a Tiguan 2.0 D, but due to coding and ongoing software issues with the towbar, it had to be a factory order with a factory-fit towbar."

I had some one off stories but didn’t pay much attention, school boy thing😉
This is a script from the VW Touareg forum. Very worrying indeed!!

“I’m on a caravan forum and this has happened to a 2024MY Toureg owner too. VW and other brands are not even letting the dealerships code tow bars to the vehicle’s electrics. This will only be done at the factory for a car ordered with the factory fit tow bar. It‘s all to do with the prevention of hackers “hackjacking” a vehicle ECU for criminal purposes. This is the future right now by the looks of things. Looks like you can get the tow bar fitted by a dealer or 3rd party and you’ll get lights and 12v but not the Trailer Assist or possibly won’t get the rear sensors switched off or any of the other features you would get with a factory fit.”

Can you imagine the number of future used 2024 VW that won’t be able to have tow bars fitted?

I wonder if we have missed something ?
If it is true my plan to buy a nearly new Touareg in 2029 for towing thereafter won’t work😢😢

 

[Buckman]

Can you imagine the number of future used 2024 VW that won’t be able to have tow bars fitted?

I wonder if we have missed something ?
If it is true my plan to buy a nearly new Touareg in 2029 for towing thereafter won’t work😢😢

Probably true that the technology or software is not supplied to towbar fitters. Keeping it in house adds to profits especially if it goes wrong at some in the future point.

This new technology is also pushing out the Indes as they cannot repair certain functions on the vehicle as we found out recently as after a sensor was fitted, the system needed to be re-programmed which could only be done by a dealership!

 

[JTQ]

Probably true that the technology or software is not supplied to towbar fitters. Keeping it in house adds to profits especially if it goes wrong at some in the future point.

It could be a of lot less "evil" intent and simply to keep within mandatory dictates and fend of the hurt of any legal claims, that might spin out of non compliance of a host of international regs, or third from party post build intervention?
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In the push to ever more efficient & greener vehicles, it surprises me the number of domestic car market vehicles that are still built with integrity reserves to not only cope with say five people and the carried luggage, but additionally tow trailers that can double the mass lugged about, controlled and stopped.

I just think it is way over designing, and we are sure to see domestic cars designed "just" to be that, not also a tractor. You don't end up with the most efficient solution, or cost effective solution by adding in additional capability, let alone expect it to cope with doubling the mass .

I therefore see there has to be a move to produce factory option vehicles, based on the standard product but where they are modified to tow trailers. This, rather than expect those not factory specified to tow, in later life being converted to tractors, the more so by third parties.

The huge pressures from China on Western domestic car manufactures can IMO only speed up designing vehicles to be just adequate. I suspect that in the future less and less domestic market cars will have the integrity in the bulk of the componentry, to ever be offered as tow cars, even as an option.

 

[RogerL]

I had some one off stories but didn’t pay much attention, school boy thing😉
This is a script from the VW Touareg forum. Very worrying indeed!!

“I’m on a caravan forum and this has happened to a 2024MY Toureg owner too. VW and other brands are not even letting the dealerships code tow bars to the vehicle’s electrics. This will only be done at the factory for a car ordered with the factory fit tow bar. It‘s all to do with the prevention of hackers “hackjacking” a vehicle ECU for criminal purposes. This is the future right now by the looks of things. Looks like you can get the tow bar fitted by a dealer or 3rd party and you’ll get lights and 12v but not the Trailer Assist or possibly won’t get the rear sensors switched off or any of the other features you would get with a factory fit.”

Can you imagine the number of future used 2024 VW that won’t be able to have tow bars fitted?

I wonder if we have missed something ?
If it is true my plan to buy a nearly new Touareg in 2029 for towing thereafter won’t work😢😢

Some nearly new Touaregs do get a factory-fit towbar - there is, or was, a 2024 Touareg hybrid on Autotrader with one fitted - even if the ads don't specify towbar it's worth a visit in person as many car salesmen don't realise it's got one as it's so well hidden - sometimes the photos show the switch in the boot area.

 

[otherclive]

It could be a of lot less "evil" intent and simply to keep within mandatory dictates and fend of the hurt of any legal claims, that might spin out of non compliance of a host of international regs, or third from party post build intervention?
-------------------------------------------------------------

In the push to ever more efficient & greener vehicles, it surprises me the number of domestic car market vehicles that are still built with integrity reserves to not only cope with say five people and the carried luggage, but additionally tow trailers that can double the mass lugged about, controlled and stopped.

I just think it is way over designing, and we are sure to see domestic cars designed "just" to be that, not also a tractor. You don't end up with the most efficient solution, or cost effective solution by adding in additional capability, let alone expect it to cope with doubling the mass .

I therefore see there has to be a move to produce factory option vehicles, based on the standard product but where they are modified to tow trailers. This, rather than expect those not factory specified to tow, in later life being converted to tractors, the more so by third parties.

The huge pressures from China on Western domestic car manufactures can IMO only speed up designing vehicles to be just adequate. I suspect that in the future less and less domestic market cars will have the integrity in the bulk of the componentry, to ever be offered as tow cars, even as an option.

A similar thing arose from around 2010 onwards as car emission legislation started to ramp up. Successive models of cars showed significant weight reductions. Even mid range cars like Golf, Astra and Focus were loosing 200 kg between models. To counter this caravan makers reduced MTPLM. We were looking at a 2 berth Coachman around 2014 but decided against it as the payload was only 125kg. Other makers weren’t a lot different. It occurred to me that the car makers were primarily geared to selling vehicles to meet emissions standards and safety and a minority interest such as caravanning wasn’t high on their priority list.

 

[Lutz]

If you really think about it, having your vehicle done with a paint protection system is in effect modifying it. Adding washer water using a different type of fluid to the one used by the manufacturer is in effect modifying the vehicle. Fitting new tyres that are a different brand to the vehicle is modifying it. The list is endless!

Technically, a modification can only be something that changes the specification of the vehicle to differ from what the manufacturer originally had type approved. Paint protection systems, washer water are not type approved so they don't count as modifications, but it is quite possible that the manufacturer restricted tyre equipment to an approved brand. Certainly a change in tyre size is a modification unless it is covered in the type approval documentation.

 

[ProfJohnL]

Technically, a modification can only be something that changes the specification of the vehicle to differ from what the manufacturer originally had type approved. Paint protection systems, washer water are not type approved so they don't count as modifications, but it is quite possible that the manufacturer restricted tyre equipment to an approved brand. Certainly a change in tyre size is a modification unless it is covered in the type approval documentation.

That may be true to meet regulatory requirements, but insurers in the UK seem to have other agendas they follow with regards to ways to limit their liability if they can.

 

[GaryB]

I'm surprised there isn't some sort of clause (positively or negatively) about fitting temporary accessories such as a roof box/roof bars. Like others on here I would never have given it any thought to "declare" a tow bar as a modification several years ago, I always assumed back then that a "modification" was uprating the suspension/brakes/fitting a body kit! However since sorting the insurance online over the last few years I've always declared it as there's usually "tow bar" listed in one of the drop-down boxes.

 

[Mr Plodd]

For as long as I can remember a towbar has always been viewed as a modification by insurers.
A good few years ago a friend had a Mazda MX5 that had its alloy wheels stolen. The insurance company refused to pay out because the cars original specification had steel wheels and he hadn't notified them of the modification from original spec. Alloys were a factory fit option (that almost everyone went for) but the original spec was steel. Pal persued it all the way and I think went to court in the end, and lost!
As I understand it anything that is not fitted as standard, even if its on the factory fit options list (and involves additional cost from list price) is viewed by insurance companies as a modification and must be declared.
Part of the reason I think is to prevent someone adding something (like a towbar) to a theft claim when there want one on the car in tge first place. Yes there are dishonest people in this world!
I have always declared a tow bar but have never been charged an additional premium, a bit like business cover, always declared and I think once I was charged an extra £5.
If in ANY doubt, declare it, insurance companies are NOT your friend and will wriggle if at all possible.

 

[Lutz]

For as long as I can remember a towbar has always been viewed as a modification by insurers.
A good few years ago a friend had a Mazda MX5 that had its alloy wheels stolen. The insurance company refused to pay out because the cars original specification had steel wheels and he hadn't notified them of the modification from original spec. Alloys were a factory fit option (that almost everyone went for) but the original spec was steel. Pal persued it all the way and I think went to court in the end, and lost!
As I understand it anything that is not fitted as standard, even if its on the factory fit options list (and involves additional cost from list price) is viewed by insurance companies as a modification and must be declared.
Part of the reason I think is to prevent someone adding something (like a towbar) to a theft claim when there want one on the car in tge first place. Yes there are dishonest people in this world!
I have always declared a tow bar but have never been charged an additional premium, a bit like business cover, always declared and I think once I was charged an extra £5.
If in ANY doubt, declare it, insurance companies are NOT your friend and will wriggle if at all possible.

But how is standard fitment defined if factory fitted options are classed as modifications? Some factory fitted options may be mandatory for certain markets, so the customer would never be aware that they aren't standard fitment as far as the manufacturer is concerned. I guess it all depends on how the invoice is written. The one for my car shows a number of items as factory fitted options at no extra cost. Would these be treated as modifications?
Quite often, an upmarket "deluxe" model is nothing more than a base model with a whole host of mandatory factory fitted options.

 

[Jcloughie]

I used to have a Peugeot 4007. It was a top of the range so came with 19 inch wheels and low profile tyres.

It was a poor tow car, and I did a lot to try to improve it. I changed the wheels to 16 inch standard profile, as fitted to the standard car, and fitted MAD rear springs. I called my insurers and got the 3rd degree. They assumed I had made modifications in order to boost performance. Eventually I insisted on speaking to the underwriter. Only then could we have a meaningful discussion. The wheels were allowed at no cost. And my mods did improve the ride and towing ability completely . (But did not look as nice).

Common sense eventually prevailed.

John