4x4 thread

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Mar 24, 2006
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I'm not posting this out of a dislike of 4x4s, we have had a few including a discovery which we liked but don't feel that just because you are towing with a 4x4 heavier than most cars they are invincible. Take it easy out there folks!

The following is from another forum:-

"About an hour from our destination on the first day, we were heading down one of the motorways. I passed a GB Discovery towing a large caravan and eventually passed a coach. There was a stiff headwind and passing the coach was a bit un-nerving. However, as we struggled up the hills the coach eventually caught and passed us again. I told my wife, I was just going to sit behind it as the buffeting was not fun to drive through, even in a large A class. For quite a few miles I just sat at a reasonable distance behind the coach.

Next thing the Discovery comes past us, and then starts to pass the coach. As the caravan caught the first blast of turbulence, it started to snake. In an instant it was out of control, with the caravan shaking the Discovery like it was a rag doll. The whole unit slammed into the central barrier and then into the coach. My family were screaming for me to stop, which I did just as the Landy jackknifed in front of us and into the side barrier. The occupants were trapped by the barrier on one side and the caravan on the other. I was just praying that the whole lot would not flip. I ran to the Discovery and broke the window and got the lady and her kids out. By that time a few other people had stoped to help and we bundled the family into a MPV and tried to calm them down."
 
May 10, 2007
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Navman. I agree drive what you want, we do. But we've towed with Disco's and MPV that performed very well for our needs.

No doubt many 4 x 4's have better off road performance than our Audi, but off road capability is a minimal need for many and we never "off road" with our caravan ;) I do't count site grass;).

Re your question, I paid 250 Euros "mates rates" for my service two weeks ago but I doubt UK price would be anywhere near.

Ria
 
Aug 30, 2007
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Whilst I hope to goodness that no one is quite as stupid as shown on this old now, but still very funny video clip - I do believe it ably demonstrates the drawbacks of having an inadequate tow car!

Whilst I appreciate that the car is totally inadequate (the driver as well in my view!)it is VERY funny - but only because no-one was hurt.

http://www.kewego.co.uk/video/iLyROoaftJc8.html
The road conditions were not bad - just wet (the camera lens has to be wiped at one point)

Now replay the scene in your mind with a Landcruiser/Trooper/Pajero/Discovery/Forester towing.

Do you really think any of these would have a problem?

No doubt other vehicles would do better than what is on the video. No doubt about that at all!! Because I am not saying that you have to have a 4x4 to tow.

I am saying that to do so increases the safety margin for everyone considerably.

As for the example of a Discovery Jacknifing above - whilst I am sure such things happen - the cause seems to be the "nut behind the wheel" - stupidity is stupidity after all.

Just like trying to tow with a Renault 5!
 
May 10, 2007
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Towing in France and Italy apart from Brits towing caravans I'm sure far fewer of our European cousins own 4 X 4's but tow large caravans further than many Brits. Plenty of Merc, BMW and Audi estates and saloons from Germany and other countries and more than an equal share of Renaults, Peugeots , Nissans and others.

Also remebering that many are front wheel drive as well as the rear wheel drive cars that get to the same sites as us with our 4 X 4.

For most space and weight should be the main consideration when towing. A lot of 4 x 4's wiil mainly use 2 wheel drive and some probabaly never use 4 wheel drive when towing.

Buy what you want.

Ria
 
Jul 3, 2006
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As earlier posts have stated you should drive what you want to drive but I disagree with the statements that 4x4s are heavier therefore safer, more stable towcars, many 4x4s do fit this description but there are some 4x4 that have truly terrible stability even without a trailer, novices and the unaware are buying these vehicles thinking they are invincible then wonder why their outfit ends up scattered across the road. Some fans will swear blind that these cars are stable but its rather like some people beleive Saddam Hussein was a kind gentle man.

In the towing stability stakes, the only 4x4 I have ever towed with was out performed by a 1989 Golf GTI weighing less than half the 4x4.
 
Mar 14, 2005
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Quote:Frank

18 Aug 2007 09:49 AM Me again Lutz,

One final point I have never seen a Super Storm or any of the big Elddis/Swift vans pulled with anything other than a 4x4. I would be really interested in peoples opinions on the alternatives. For opinion please read fact, have they actually done or do it.

We pull our twin-axle Elddis Avante 630 with our saloon car. When we decided to buy it, the dealer said it made a change to meet someone who didn't feel that they needed to have a 4X4 to pull it, as in the past most caravans were pulled with cars. It's only been the fashion in the past 10 years or so to have these type of tow vehicles.

We tow with my 1996 Ford Scorpio Ultima, 2.9Litre. It tows the van with ease, has power to spare, and will easily hold the national speed limit of 60mph on motorways when conditions allow.

These bigger cars are cheap to buy, easy and inexpensive to maintain, and for internal luxury you won't find better value. With air-con, electric seats, cruise control, power sunroof, and all the rest, it's really comfortable driving.

I think it's everybodys personal choice what they drive or tow with, and we did have a Mitsubishi Shogun for a while, but we went back to a car, and have never felt the need to have such a vehicle just for the 20 or so trips a year we make with the caravan. I certainly wouldn't want one for daily commuting again.
 
May 12, 2006
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Hi Keith,

I have just read a write up on the " scorpio " sounds good if you like running around in an old banger (smile).

What's Fords current offering in this range ???

Frank
 
Aug 30, 2007
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To be fair the Scorpio was singled out to be one of the very best budget towcars by one of the mags a while back.

And they are very inexpensive and easy to service. However, spare parts for the old "wide mouth frog" can be a problem and will be more so in the future.

Best bit is that you get a lot of car for your money -
 
Jul 3, 2006
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When you want to tow 1900kg, a large 4wd is about the only choice, not from a stability point of view but from a power and traction point, although the Sharan was given a 2000kg tow limit from VW and it would be every bit as stable as most heavier 4x4s on the motorway, an awkward junction, a hill start on gravel or wet grass would see it's undoing, thats why we like Lunar caravans that have all the space of competitors but a lot less weight so we don't need 4wd
 
May 10, 2007
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I got home late from Oxford today due the tail backs on the A34.

A fairly new looking Ranger Rover smashed to bits with a mangled commercial box trailer about the size of an average 5 birth caravan.

I didn't witness the accident but have a pretty fair idea as to part of the cause due to the place the accident happened.

Ria
 
Aug 20, 2006
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Hi All

We had a 98 Scorpio 2.9 24v Ultima and towed a 99 Crusader Sirocco and loved it (wish I knew how to scan photo).Whilst it towed well WE now have a Grand Cherokee 2.7 crd and must say it tows our 07 Super Sirocco much better with great ease and much more relaxed towing but the Scorpio was a much underated car and as a solo car has been my favorite!
 
Jul 11, 2007
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my god after reading this thread i have just realised how snobbish some people are on here - you are all bigging up your audis mercs and 25k+ 4x4's and as soon as someone mentions a ford scorpio - its a banger even if you did write smile after it. my god i struggle to meet my mortgage some months and drive round in a 2.5td lwb pajero which cost less than 2k and it pulls my caravan which cost less than 1.5k (inc awning) so 3.5k in total you guys will spend that probably on a service on your cars. but i bet i get much more enjoyement on seeing my kids faces running around the field and playing tennis with a bloody foam ball and then having a bbq as a family.

who cares what car you tow with - as long as it gets you there in one piece and you enjoy yourself.

i my short time caravanning i have noticed two types of people :-

1) those who go to enjoy them selves come rain or shine

&

2) those who go and the first thing they do is make sure they have a 'better car and van' than everyone else in the field.

get a grip.

lee
 
May 12, 2006
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Lee,

I have just read a write up on the " scorpio " sounds good if you like running around in an old banger (smile).

Joke Lee I also wrote I had just read up on the Scorpio and it does get a good write up.

Cars and Caravans are like Houses people tend to buy the best they can afford. That's the fact of it. Some people have new cars because they can't take the risk of it breaking down or failure of an MOT etc.

After a long and hard working life, a little luxury is not to much to ask !!!!!

Don't be envious, it looks like your happy with your lot, so let it be.

Frank
 
May 12, 2006
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Lee

" my short time caravanning i have noticed two types of people :-

1) those who go to enjoy them selves come rain or shine

&

2) those who go and the first thing they do is make sure they have a 'better car and van' than everyone else in the field"

Perception Lee

The two go hand in hand !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Frank
 
Aug 30, 2007
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I think all activities suffer from those that have the "Mine is better than yours" mentality.

Just look at those who feel the need to either praise their car or slag another off.

Strangely we do not actually see it with caravans though.

I do not think I have seen anyone say something like:-

"The brake pads on my Avondale lasted starship mileage so my 'van is better than yours"

Neither do we see those with single axle berate others with twin axles "because you do not need them"

Isn't it all a bit silly? Is it not rather juvenile "willy waving"?
 
May 10, 2007
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In Bordeaux we were recently pithed next to a family with a very old early Espace and largish german caravan and an English couple with what I thing was an old CI (?) single glazed but well cared for on some smart looking alloy wheels with a modern al-ko stabiliser tow hitch. Tow car was top of the range brand new Range Rover, the owners told my mum that they had lost count of how many miles it had done after they got past 100000 or so.

Plenty of variety from budget cars towing budget caravans and new expensive looking ones and expensive new cars and budget new cars towing all ages and sizes of caravan to.

Providing we all get to our sites in safety and the comfort that suits us, does it really matter what our tow car and caravan is.

We've pitched next to some lovely people over many years and most are quite pleased with their choice and that's all that counts.
 
Jul 11, 2007
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frank: the two go hand in hand :-

i think not - you are going on the assumption that everyone goes and compares tow cars and vans where as i go to ensure my family enjoys themselves and i couldnt care less if i was pitched next to Baron Von Klumpf the 2nd - aire to the throne of outer bavaria or the gypsy that lives in the centre of Cheddar, somerset.
 
May 12, 2006
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Good for you Lee , so why bother to make your post !!

You just go and enjoy yourself, don't worry about other people because sure as hell we don't.

Frank
 
Jul 11, 2007
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im making my post to highlight certain areas of caravaning that are so materialistic that it almost seams that the actual practice of caravaning is 2nd in the list and its just another way of people with alot of money to 'flex muscles' so to speak.

if i had the money i would buy a nice big van and a merc anyway and it would be a bigger van than yours!!!!! ;0)
 
Jul 11, 2007
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im making my post to highlight certain areas of caravaning that are so materialistic that it almost seams that the actual practice of caravaning is 2nd in the list and its just another way of people with alot of money to 'flex muscles' so to speak.

if i had the money i would buy a nice big van and a merc anyway and it would be a bigger van than yours!!!!! ;0)
 

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