choosing a van

[Lonesome-Whizkid]

I've just spent most of the evening enjoying an online search for my first van, wow, there really are lots out there to choose from! I've come across the LUNAR LEXON SE (2010) model, I like it. Does anyone have any idea if this may be a good choice of van, Is Lunar a good make?

Thanks in advance for any time you take to post a reply.

 

[Parksy]

As I mentioned on the payload thread, it all depends on what you are looking for, how many berths etc.
My advice would be to decide on what layout you need, and after checking online to see what's available within your budget go to dealers forecourts where there will be a selection of caravans for you to look around to see if you like any that fit the bill.

 

[Raywood]

The Lunar Lexon is a range of well specified caravans. Whether any one is right for you depends on your needs and budget and towcar. You need to look round a few caravans and decide on the basis of how you would use it what layout is best for you. If there are two of you do you want a fixed bed or are you happy to make up a bed each night to give you more space during the day? If you take children with you, you need to find a layout to cater for them. The tow car might limit your choice, it is recommended that the loaded caravan weighs no more than 85% of the cars kerb weight subject to the manufacturers max towed weight but this can be exceeded to some extent but never go over 100%.
Lunar are one of the five major British caravan manufacturers and to be frankly I doubt there is a lot between them when it comes to quality, Lunars main selling point is they are generally a bit lighter than the competition. I have just bought one and we are happy so far.

 

[ProfJohnL]

................ but never go over 100%....................

Hello Ray,
The way you have posted this snippet makes it sound as though doom and destruction will ensure if you tow at or over 100%. 'Never' is too stronger word for what is only and industry recommendation.

Provided your licence, and the tow vehicles specification allows it, there is nothing legally to prevent exceeding 100% ratio. BUT as I always point out its is best to keep trailer weights a small as possible, and of course its good towing is also down to, proper maintenance, load distribution, and drivers habits amongst other things.

 

[Raywood]

Hi Prof, I would not say doom and destruction but cannot say that it is wise and you might even find problems with your insurance if you exceed 100%. The heavier the trailer the more chance there is of the tail waging the dog. Coming from an accident investigation background I do tend to err on the safe side and certainly for beginners I would stick to the advice that around 85% ratio is probably wise but agree that other factors can intervene.
I did tow around 90% with our last caravan and had no problems but I have been towing nearly 30 years. Our new caravan takes this down to 86% but it has a larger side profile which might affect towing in wind so I will have to see when conditions are trying.

Hello Ray,
The way you have posted this snippet makes it sound as though doom and destruction will ensure if you tow at or over 100%. 'Never' is too stronger word for what is only and industry recommendation.

Provided your licence, and the tow vehicles specification allows it, there is nothing legally to prevent exceeding 100% ratio. BUT as I always point out its is best to keep trailer weights a small as possible, and of course its good towing is also down to, proper maintenance, load distribution, and drivers habits amongst other things.[/quote]

 

[ProfJohnL]

Hello Ray,

Towing at or above 100% is not recommended, but provided the car manufacture specifications allows for 100+% then the vehicle is perfectly legal.

An insurer can impose limits on policy holders, provide any such limitations are detailed in the policy terms and conditions when the policy is enacted.

An insurer will have provisions in their policy terms and conditions that allow them to make changes to the cover or limitations during the lifetime of the policy. What they can't do is to make any changes that are to be retrospectively applied.

So if no special limits are applied when the policy is contracted then the policyholder is insured to use the insured vehicle to its fullest legal extent which includes towing.

 

[Lonesome-Whizkid]

Hi ProfJohn,

Does it help to reduce your annual insurance premium if you take a course on towing a trailer/caravan?, Is that taken into account when you go for insurance?
And also joining the caravan and camping club? Does that get taken into account also? So far on the matter of insurance all i know is that your NCD+4 years is taken into account?

 

[Parksy]

When you tow a caravan you are automatically covered by your car insurance provided that you inform your insurers that you have a towbar fitted.
Caravan insurance is advisable but not a legal requirement, and the caravan insurance premium will be reduced for club membership and evidence of completing a recognised towing course.

 

[ProfJohnL]

Hi ProfJohn,

Does it help to reduce your annual insurance premium if you take a course on towing a trailer/caravan?, Is that taken into account when you go for insurance?
And also joining the caravan and camping club? Does that get taken into account also? So far on the matter of insurance all i know is that your NCD+4 years is taken into account?

You would have to guidance on these point from your insurer, some might take them into account others wont.

 

[Lonesome-Whizkid]

I've come from not knowing anything about caravanning to starting to get familar with all the legalities, and it all started upon purchasing my first edition of PCv Magazine for april 2014, still some things that im unclear about, but im sure ill get there, if i have matched my towing car choice with caravan choice and entered it into www.towcar.info to get a free report on its performance and its throwing a figure back at me for 87% would any experienced caravanner tell me that ive got a fairly safe outfit? don't get me wrong, I'm real nervous about towing for the first time especially on motorways so i wont be wishing to try my hand at overtaking anyone, I'll just be doing 40 to 45mph and 30 to 35mph on B roads, So i'll be a responsible driver for sure. Guess ill put some practice in though before the big first outing to a desirable caravan park. I can get the ratio matching to drop to 83% with a change in choice of tow car. My choice for purchase will be the Kia Sportage 4wd diesel 2.0L crdi xe 2006 model matched with the Lunar Lexon 640 RS 2008 model T/A. and its an 87% match but im open to any other recommendations before i dive in.

 

[ProfJohnL]

..................if i have matched my towing car choice with caravan choice and entered it into www.towcar.info to get a free report on its performance and its throwing a figure back at me for 87% would any experienced caravanner tell me that ive got a fairly safe outfit? .....

Hello Whiz,

I'm sorry if this post seems very negative, but your question is asking for the impossible.

I think I have already answered to you about the reliability of matching web sites and services, but just in case you haven't seen it, None of them can be relied on 100%. That all contain errors and omissions in their data sets, so the outcomes cannot be taken as gospel.

And also no contributor on this or any other forum can categorically tell you your outfit is safe. the safety of an out fit is fundamentally down to how it is driven, but its also affected by how its loaded and the maintenance of the vehicle and , not just down to weight ratios.

Some of the easiest outfits to drive can come a cropper if the driver is not careful.
The best you can get from a site or a forum is whether an out fit is a good match, not whether its a safe match.

 

[Parksy]

I've come from not knowing anything about caravanning to starting to get familar with all the legalities, and it all started upon purchasing my first edition of PCv Magazine for april 2014, still some things that im unclear about, but im sure ill get there, if i have matched my towing car choice with caravan choice and entered it into www.towcar.info to get a free report on its performance and its throwing a figure back at me for 87% would any experienced caravanner tell me that ive got a fairly safe outfit? don't get me wrong, I'm real nervous about towing for the first time especially on motorways so i wont be wishing to try my hand at overtaking anyone, I'll just be doing 40 to 45mph and 30 to 35mph on B roads, So i'll be a responsible driver for sure. Guess ill put some practice in though before the big first outing to a desirable caravan park. I can get the ratio matching to drop to 83% with a change in choice of tow car. My choice for purchase will be the Kia Sportage 4wd diesel 2.0L crdi xe 2006 model matched with the Lunar Lexon 640 RS 2008 model T/A. and its an 87% match but im open to any other recommendations before i dive in.

Prof John is correct, the information from towing match websites could be unreliable so it's best to use the manufacturers published figures for towing vehicle and caravan to calculate the weight ratio.
At least you have the good sense to find out as much as you can before taking the plunge, so well done!
This may have been mentioned elsewhere, but the 85% figure is one recommended by authoritative sources (caravan clubs and organisations) as providing a good likelihood of stability for a correctly loaded caravan with good tyres which is well maintained and driven with due care and attention. The figure is not set in stone though so don't worry too much about a few kgs over or under.
If you are really nervous about the prospect of towing both the Caravan Club and the Camping and Caravanning Club offer towing courses which will definitely help you to overcome any nerves, other wise do you know anyone locally who owns a caravan and who could supervise your hitching up and would sit beside you while you get some towing practice locally?
On motorways, if you do overtake slower traffic remember that you are not allowed in the outside lane and the national speed limit for towing vehicles is 60mph (although even at 60mph you will still see idiots whizzing past you towing trailers and caravans!)
Always try to time your motorway overtaking maneuver on level or uphill stretches of fairly straight carriageway, you could come unstuck if you overtake large vehicles travelling downhill not least because of the wind turbulence.
When you get your car and caravan it's best to go to a local site not too far from home at first so that you can get used to the caravan and it's towing characteristics.
I'm sure that you'll be fine and we're always here to answer questions if you're stuck.

 

[WoodlandsCamper]

......If you are really nervous about the prospect of towing both the Caravan Club and the Camping and Caravanning Club offer towing courses which will definitely help you to overcome any nerves, .....

By coincidence, I am taking the higher level Caravan Club towing course this Friday at the Racing Circuit in Prembrey.

It's not on the syllabus, but I wonder if we get a race with caravans at the end of the day? :evil:

 

[Parksy]

......If you are really nervous about the prospect of towing both the Caravan Club and the Camping and Caravanning Club offer towing courses which will definitely help you to overcome any nerves, .....

By coincidence, I am taking the higher level Caravan Club towing course this Friday at the Racing Circuit in Prembrey.

It's not on the syllabus, but I wonder if we get a race with caravans at the end of the day? :evil:

The Woosies will no doubt get some score boards similar to those used for Strictly Come Dancing and will line up to watch you reverse your caravan onto your pitch now we know that you are taking the advanced course.
Maybe a 'Ten from Len' or just a Sev-en!!!

 

[colin-yorkshire]

hi Lonesome-Whizkid.
like the Prof, I too apologise in advance in case this post seems negative it is not meant to be and only posed because of genuine reservations about the course, one as set for oneself.
while it is true that personal choice is at the heart of our hobby one should always be aware of the pit falls one can step into as mistakes in this hobby can be very expensive.
far too often new to the hobby members post asking for advice on matching weights and suitability of their choice of van for a particular car or a combo that seems on the face of it a little advanced for a newbie. I have often wondered how they got on but unfortunatly very few reply and lets know how they did, I suspect this is because things went badly,
after all one would not buy a ocean going yacht to start sailing in or buy a Farrari as a first car after passing ones test.
a very large outfit for a starter kit could be more than one could handle as a newbie there is so much legistlation and so much too learn about loading, towing, equipment ect, one has to do reams of research and be up to date with the technical and practical side of our very enjoyable hobby before parting with our hard earned cash.
I would suggest you think long and hard before going ahead the key here is compromise, caravanning is all about it from van layouts, towcars, even down to the sites we choose to stay on.
be very sure the choice you make is right for you, it may well be fine, but then it may not be, reading your posts you seem nervious at the prospects this could be a warning, to you.
I would also suggest you consider something more manageable as a first outfit as a compromise realising the dream when you have the experience and expertise to back it up.
as I said this is not meant to be negative but just an observation from a 40+ years caravanner who would love to own a 640 Lexon but realise the Meriva would not tow it!! :woohoo: and that my friend is compromise.

 

[audiorob]

Following the thread of posts I presume that you know the max weight your car can tow and an idea of the 85% of kerbweight. If you are new to the hobby consider a dealer purchase (not always more expensive - a Kent dealer is advertsing model and year for 11995) so that you get a warranty. You may get up to 3 years depending upon returning to the dealer for annual service - a good reson to buy reasonably locally. The van is often used as 2 berth with the bed made up and the lounge just for that. So many have seen adult only use and should be pretty pristine. Follow your eyes and nose - does it look clean and smell clean - ads often say no pets/smokers for good reason! Good luck

 

[Raywood]

I do have to take issue with the Prof on the idea of towing with a trailer heavier than the car. The towing limit of the car is based on the ability of it to manage a hill start moving that weight off and has nothing to do with it controlling it when problems arise. You can tow a heavier trailer if the manufacturer says so but in the interests of safety not at 60 mph on the motorway as the ability to control it if it starts to breakaway is going to be badly reduced.. If you exceed the weight of the tow car then be prepared to reduce your speed accordingly. I have met the people who have tried it and they now know why it is not a good idea.

 

[Parksy]

Before we get into an off topic discussion about towing at a 100%+ weight ratio the O.P. is fully cognisant with the 85% recommendation, he has stated that he will try to stick as closely as possible to it and he's new to caravanning.
Out of consideration for him, if there is a debate to be had with regard to towing at a 100%+ weight ratio please open a separate thread and discuss the issue to your hearts content without taking the thread of a fellow forum member off topic unnecessarily.

 

[Lonesome-Whizkid]

Thanks Parksy, I didnt know that. I thought you had to take out seperate insurance for towing a van. And thanks everybody else for your comments/posts. Most appreciated!

 

[Lonesome-Whizkid]

:blink: Question time! :huh: What does it mean when literature expresses the saying, FIFTH WHEEL Caravan? Is that another kind of caravan or are they referring to the spare wheel? :woohoo: Or is that something to do with the Jockey wheel?

 

[colin-yorkshire]

fifth wheel caravans are a separate entity they are not really a caravan in the normal sense of the word has they have no A frame to tow with, they are built with a stepped front (like a m/home without the cab) and are towed by a pickup truck with a connection similar to the HGV tractor unit, like this one. http://www.gumtree.com/p/cars-vans-motorbikes/fifth-wheel-caravan/1059485861

 

[ProfJohnL]

The "5th wheel" refers to a type of towing arrangement which is fitted to HGV's and is the horseshoe shaped plate you can see on tractor units for articulated lorries. In the USA and Canada, a slightly smaller version can be bolted to the load bed of their popular pick up trucks that many households have. A few of these have been imported into the UK, but they are much heavier than our traditional caravans and they have to be towed by commercial vehicles here in the UK, You definitely cannot fit one to your car.

Interestingly back in the 1960 or 70's one of the UK manufacturers did try producing a 5th wheel caravan for cars. They devised a roofrack mounted 5th wheel towing point. but it never caught on.

 

[Lonesome-Whizkid]

Yeah I know the ones you mean John, thanks for the link Colin. I kinda had an idea that it was those kind.

 

[Lonesome-Whizkid]

When you tow a caravan you are automatically covered by your car insurance provided that you inform your insurers that you have a towbar fitted.

Does that only apply for a fully comprehensive policy?

And the only other thing you would need is a policy for theft and damage and personal effects and possibly awning cover? Which I see advertisements in the magazine?

Do you need public liability insurance aswell? I know this is fairly cheap if so.

 

[WoodlandsCamper]

There is no legal requirement to have any caravan insurance, but any losses will be down to you to pay.