This hit the headlines this morning. More of a heavy Tax burden for us Pensioners and those on low wages🤬 I may have to consider all year round caravanning🤪🤪
European Carbon Credits Incoming
- Thread starter Dustydog
- Start date
No link provided. Is this what you are referring to. It’s been around for some while but is being accelerated. The article doesn’t explain how it will affect UK, but we’ve been part of the approach so there will be an impact. Until the impact on pensioners and the low paid is spelt out it’s only supposition as it doesn’t take effect until 2027.
www.reuters.com
EU strikes deal to boost carbon market, Europe's biggest climate policy
Under the deal agreed by negotiators from EU countries and the European Parliament, the carbon market will be reformed to cut emissions by 62% from 2005 levels by 2030.
While in theory it seems a good idea, I would think that it may create unemployment as more factories shift to Far East countries where CO2 regulations are not as strict.
I would just point out that this is an EU proposal, and the UK is not part of the EU any more.
At present the revised U.K. Emissions Trading Scheme is more stringent than the EU ETS. Clearly could put us at a continued disadvantage particularly for carbon intensive industries. But we’ve always been in the" vanguard" in this area.
The UK's emissions trading scheme from 2021
The Department for Business, Energy and Industrial Strategy has confirmed that a new UK emissions trading scheme will run from the start of 2021 until 2030.
www.pinsentmasons.com
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Yet more of the Net Zero cult then?
When will our politicians (of all persuasions) wake up to fact that we are crippling ourselves on this altar of nonsense?
I am totally in favour of reducing our carbon output, but only as far is reasonable and affordable rather than committing ourselves to impoverishment when the truly major polluters (China in particular) are doing virtualy nothing?
This is not meant as any form of political comment as ALL parties seem to be in thrall of a small minority of very vocal "interests"
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When will our politicians (of all persuasions) wake up to fact that we are crippling ourselves on this altar of nonsense?
I am totally in favour of reducing our carbon output, but only as far is reasonable and affordable rather than committing ourselves to impoverishment when the truly major polluters (China in particular) are doing virtualy nothing?
This is not meant as any form of political comment as ALL parties seem to be in thrall of a small minority of very vocal "interests"
.
From posts in previous threads I think that you would be quite surprised at what China is actually doing. Yes they are still emitting CO2 at high levels but their investment in electric transport, solar, wind and nuclear is extraordinarily high, and the rate of increase in CO2 is beginning to reduce, although the pandemic has put a glitch in the curve. Their stated aim is for C02 to reduce by 2030, and net zero by 2060. Up to now they have met their stated aims. You don't say what is "reasonable and affordable" I guess it can mean all things to all people. The opportunities for business and employment in developing, manufacturing and servicing "green" systems are very significant and will undoubtedly provided employment opportunities. I do not take the short term view as I really do think that climate change has to be confronted, not for me as it will not materially affect us, but for our children, grandchildren and the future generations throughout the world.
china
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There was no link. It was on breakfast tv before I’d read a paper😵💫No link provided. Is this what you are referring to. It’s been around for some while but is being accelerated. The article doesn’t explain how it will affect UK, but we’ve been part of the approach so there will be an impact. Until the impact on pensioners and the low paid is spelt out it’s only supposition as it doesn’t take effect until 2027.
EU strikes deal to boost carbon market, Europe's biggest climate policy
Under the deal agreed by negotiators from EU countries and the European Parliament, the carbon market will be reformed to cut emissions by 62% from 2005 levels by 2030.
Ah, by saying it hit the headlines I assumed it was from a paper or similar source. Your post wasn’t to your usual informative and researched standard 🤣
Hopefully the hare calms down soon. 🐇
It was so new I wondered if it was reality. Seems it is😢😢😢😢
Carbon offsetting is just a con to enable polluters to say they are green when it is not true.
China ? India ? I suspect in spite of Clive’s good post these guys are way off from the UK and will be for years.
A quick question. Are the new fast chargers single or 3 phase ?
Fast charging for EV's is as far as i know always DC, so there is no reference to supply phases, But in practice in the UK for any charger of greater than 7.5kW the chargers are designed to use 3 phase mains supplies, but of course the power is converted to DC before its fed to the car.
There will be some public charger where they use large storage batteries to power the chargers, and the batteries will be DC output.
Thanks. Centrica have nearly replaced their entire fleet with EVs . My son covers North Yorkshire. He needs to be sure the car can charge asap. Centrica are installing the charger , a new supply from the road but as yet not sure which phase . I believe single phase is 100 amps so presumably that would be enough power even at DC output?
For a while now the British Gas vans have been charging at our local Lidl. Somewhat ironic to see gas and electric blazoned on the sides. Good on em though. 👍
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Unless your sons property has, and he pays for a 3 phase supply which is very unlikely for a normal domestic property, he will only be provided with a single phase 230V supply. As far as I know the largest single phase domestic EV charger will be a type two (AC charger not DC) and will be limited to no more than 7.4kW or less depending on your electrical supply capability and or your spend.
If he needed a more powerful charger, he would either need to invest in getting a 3phase 415vac supply ( which is only normally reserved for industrial or farming properties) and a 22kW charger, but I suspect the financial costs of installing and the higher supplier tariffs will make that option unviable.
If he does need to have extra charging , he'll have to use a public charger whilst he's out and about. More recent EV's have higher charging rate capabilities and with just 15 to 20 min toilet break you can add 100 worth miles or more of energy.
He'll have to learn to plan his journeys to accommodate the cars capability. I should add after a while the strategy will become second nature, and except in really difficult locations there really shouldn't be a problem. After all most people have got used to planning their car journeys to include the need to obtain fuel, EV's are just different, and there are more and more charge points being installed so its only going to get easier.
Much easier to plan fuel/charging with a high range capability so it's not really valid to compare refuelling an IC car - it'll need to get much better than a 15-20 minute break every 100 miles, about 90 minutes at motorway speeds - much less if towing
I think that the posts made by Tobes, towing with a Polestar,earlier in the summer would challenge your figures.
I was just quoting ProfJohnL's figures - as I recall Tobes was able to get 100 miles towing between recharges - even that's stopping every 1 hour 45 mins at towing motorway speeds which for me isn't workable on a long haul.
EVs will become mainstream towing vehicles in time, I have no doubt of that - but at my age I don't expect to ever have an EV tow car - on the other hand I do expect to have an EV for local journeys within the foreseeable future.
As I read it Prof Johns 100 miles (or more) was not relating to a towing range. Strangely enough my ICE tow cars had reduced range when towing too, so it's not an EV characteristic.
Of course all cars have reduced range when towing, regardless of power source - but more noticeable when the solo range is already restricted.
Home charging is almost exclusively AC. A standard single phase charge point can deliver up to 7.2kW. A standard 3 phase charge point up to 22kW.
These are know as “fast” chargers. Most new EVs charge at either 7.2kW (single phase) or 11kW (3phase). It’s is entirely possible to have three phase in a domestic property, and some new properties are installed with three phase (mainly for air source heating).
DC charging is know as Rapid, and delivers between 25kW and 350kW.
I don’t think high range fuel planning is easier, it’s just different. On the occasions I do drive beyond my available range, I clearly need to think about charging. But it’s so infrequent, it’s completely outweighed by the “even less planning” needed for all of the rest of my driving when charging from home.
I don't think you have grasped the point I was making, Firstly this was about Dusty's son's case. There was no mention of towing so I presumed the journey's would be solo.
Most recent EV's seem to have a real world range in the order of about 200 miles or more, and if you were anticipating doing a longer journey the following day it would imprudent not to do an overnight charge at home first.
Realistically most drivers usually do less than 50 miles per day . in which case an EV makes more sense, but if you are continually undertaking 300 mile days, then perhaps EV is not the way to go at present, but given home overnight recharging and the wider availability of public chargers, 300plus miles with and EV rated for 200 miles is still possible.
The comparison I was making was not about the actual distances you might be able to drive, but more about the fact that all cars at some point need to be refueled, and as a consequence whether its EV or DIno juice you have to plan your usage of the vehicle around its range and the availability of the fuel you use. It's the same process, but it may have very different practical requirements depending on the vehicle.
But also consider even with an IC engine, when towing compared to driving sol, you expect your fuel usage to be greater, and as a consequence you plan your journey differently to take into account refuelling, so it is the same process.
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I agree your points and would add that when towing with a petrol car its range and refuelling were active considerations. For example my Sorento, XC70 and Superb diesels could all make Penrith without causing any range anxiety. Yet my two petrol Foresters (XE and XT) and Saab 9000 could not complete that journey without a refuel. With the petrol cars a solo mpg of 32-36 mpg would reduce to the low 20s or sometimes lower on a long motorway journey. So top ups were necessary, but on motorways that wasn’t a problem, whereas on A roads it did have to be thought about and sometime with everything crossed that the fuel station was accessible and not closed. I look forward to one day owning an EV as the main car.
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