Golf GTD and coachman pastiche

[IamFlash]

Cheers.

Guessing this is the same as gross weight then? I could get a 2.0. Just working on worse case.

Already got the van. Max weight is 1430

 

[otherclive]

Am I allowed to ask in here about this

Audi Q5. Has a Mass in use of 1910 from the V5. Can I tow with this and not exceed 3.5?

Sorry I spotted loads of replies after the Prof. Thanks for that.

I know my mate uses his 1 series to tow a 4 birth with no issues. I know it’s not advised but shows if I need to I can use the golf.

There is no such thing as Mass in Use. Do you mean Gross Vehicle Weight, Maximum Authorised Mass or Mass in Service? You could try looking at the Caravan and Motorhome Club website which has lots of information sheets to view and which would help you understand the meanings of some of the terms used. Because if you don’t understand them I fear that you may end up driving an unsafe and/or illegal outfit.
With regard to the 3500 kg it had absolutely nothing to do with what you are carrying in the car and caravan. Both can be totally empty but if the combined sum of their maximum plated weights exceeds 3500 kg and your licence has that restriction you would be illegal.

 

[otherclive]

I'd off thought so . Its giving you 159o kg and you should get a decent van for that but don't forget you have to load it also and not be over the 35oo kg .

Good luck

But the OP hasn’t quoted kerbweight of the Q5. Or makers braked towing weight, which given VAG normally have decent towing weights shouldn’t be a problem. But it would be nice to see:
Car kerb weight
.
CarMAM or GVW
Caravan MTPLM
Caravan MIRO
Then people could make sensible answers rather than piecemeal responses to a changing scene.

 

[IamFlash]

I rang the dealership he said mass in service I think, I’ll have to call again.
He seemed to know what he was talking about as pulled horse boxes himself.

 

[IamFlash]

Rang again

There are two numbers one is mass in service at 1940

Other is max permissible mass at 2440.

 

[otherclive]

I rang the dealership he said mass in service I think, I’ll have to call again.
He seemed to know what he was talking about as pulled horse boxes himself.

I know that it seems complicated but you really do have to sort out what the weight of the Q5 is. Audi took 90kg out of the current Q5 compared to the previous model Kerb weights/MIS range from 1645kg to 2000kg. Gross vehicle weights range from 2275-2585kg. Which if you are licence limited the 3500kg restriction means that even the lightest Audi Q5 would only allow you to tow a caravan with MTPLM of 1225kg. And don't forget the 3500kg limit is the car and caravan maximum plated weights and is applicable even if the car and caravan are totally unloaded.

 

[Craigyoung]

.....And don't forget the 3500kg limit is the car and caravan maximum plated weights and is applicable even if the car and caravan are totally unloaded.....

I did say that !

 

[IamFlash]

Q5s as the dealership said the max is 2440

It’s annoying the sales person quoted 1940 which is fine. He said it’s not the max but what’s loaded into the car but I think that’s bull.

 

[Dustydog]

Mass in Service is an antiquated nothing phrase which some years ago was defined as:-

Mass in Service includes 75kg for the driver which kerbweight does not do. Kerbweight is no longer a term that has any relevance in the vehicle industry, but it is still referred to by the general public and caravan clubs, etc.

Please please can we can get back to Prof basics? Something this old dog understands. :kiss: We moan about weight discussions and being pedantic but the miss phrases and statements in this thread have confused me never mind the new catavanner who innocently asked a very sensible question. Do we go to The University of Bath :evil:

 

[otherclive]

.....And don't forget the 3500kg limit is the car and caravan maximum plated weights and is applicable even if the car and caravan are totally unloaded.....

I did say that !

I think that actually you said something along the lines of loading it too and not being over 3500kgs. If the OP has the licence restriction loading is irrelevant as it’s the plated weights that may not exceed 3500 kg.

 

[ProfJohnL]

Hello IamFlash,

Of course you can ask questions, Its an important way of obtaining information, and we will happily offer the benefit of our experience and knowledge.

What is very difficult is to provide sensible answers when the information we have been given is either incomplete or inconsistent.

The issue of vehicle weights, weight limits and licence entitlements is rather involved not to mention Industry advice. As you discovered it has caused a lot of debate about whats lawful whats right and whats sensible.

Sadly non of us have access to all the details of all cars and caravans, so you to do need to do some leg work to find out the facts about the cars and caravans your interested in.
Cars:-
Make
model
Year
trim level
Maximum permissible weight (MAM GVW)
Kerbweight or Mass in Service
Towed weight limit
Gross Train Weight.

Caravans
Make
Modle
Year
Trim Level
Maximum Permitted weight (MTPLM, MAM)
Mass in Service (Unladen weight)

 

[ProfJohnL]

Mass in Service is an antiquated nothing phrase which some years ago was defined as:-

Mass in Service includes 75kg for the driver which kerbweight does not do. Kerbweight is no longer a term that has any relevance in the vehicle industry, but it is still referred to by the general public and caravan clubs, etc.

Please please can we can get back to Prof basics? Something this old dog understands.

Mass in Service is not an antiquated figure it is currently used on the V5c (Line G)

I agree it would be nice to be able keep things simple but the information form the OP has not allowed that to happen.

 

[Hutch]

I think that people quoting the kerb weight of a car may be a bit vague when we are thinking about towing ratios,

. Ie, a car with quoted weight of say 1500 kgs which would have , a driver and a 90% full tank of fuel, so take it that your away with the caravan, with a near empty, tank of fuel, so maybe minus 50 kg, but with wife and kids and awning, 200kg. , so you are upto 1650 kg.
Lets keep this new to towing weights real.

 

[IamFlash]

Just don’t reply.

 

[IamFlash]

So just to re affirm as I have said this they are just now over 4 pages.

I already own the caravan. As it’s the one I wanted and the wife fell in love with it. It max weight is 1430.

I am limited to towing 3500 kgs until I pass the extra test. Which isn’t happening this year.

I have a Golf GTD which has a legal limit of 1600kgs towing and falls under the 3500kgs. However it’s the same weight as the van.

I was hoping or wishing looking - that someone who was in a smilialr position may have a car to recommend that i can switch my car that’s not only a good daily driver, but can safely pull my van and comes in with a gross weight of 2000kgs.

I’ve learnt from you all about this gross weight thing who from everyone I have spoken to in the real world has never heard off. So for that thank you.

 

[Hutch]

Bigger Vectras or Mondeos, good luck mate. Don't leave the forum , just get hacked off for a while , smile and come back, .
Hutch.

 

[IamFlash]

Cheers Hutch. I’m going no where :side:

 

[otherclive]

I think that people quoting the kerb weight of a car may be a bit vague when we are thinking about towing ratios,

. Ie, a car with quoted weight of say 1500 kgs which would have , a driver and a 90% full tank of fuel, so take it that your away with the caravan, with a near empty, tank of fuel, so maybe minus 50 kg, but with wife and kids and awning, 200kg. , so you are upto 1650 kg.
Lets keep this new to towing weights real.

Agree with your comment but kerbweight gives a starting point for looking at how near or far you may be from the 85% guidance. All cars go above kerbweight when loaded but you have to set a datum for starting. Of course the 85% isn’t absolutely fixed as different cars respond better as tow cars than do others. But loading of car and caravan, driver awareness and experience etc all affect stability and safety when towing. For someone totally new with no prior experience and limited knowledge it’s a good starting point that errs in the right direction.

 

[Brasso530]

IamFlash,go out to your car,find chassis plate/sticker. Underneath the long numbers/letters they'll be about 4 or 5 lines of numbers.Its the top one you need,should say something about 2000kg,this is what your car, if put on a weightbridge can not exceed-legally.The line under that one I would of thought will be 1600kg more than first line,as that is what your max towed is.
Basically you need a car with the top line weight is less than 2050kg.As I understand it this is what your license allows legally.
Cheers.

 

[Handyandy1]

A Skoda Octavia VRS 2.0 TDi 184ps 4x4 dsg estate would give you about a 90% match and keep you within a B licence. 1572Kg min kerbweight ( adding a towbar adds about 30kg to this) and gross 2063kg current model. You would be in by 7kg. You could get closer to the ideal 85% by loading as much in the car as possible and loading the caravan as lightly as you can. Just need to watch 75 kg max nose weight.

 

[IamFlash]

Skoda looks good, going to price one and an a5.

 

[otherclive]

A Skoda Octavia VRS 2.0 TDi 184ps 4x4 dsg estate would give you about a 90% match and keep you within a B licence. 1572Kg min kerbweight ( adding a towbar adds about 30kg to this) and gross 2063kg current model. You would be in by 7kg. You could get closer to the ideal 85% by loading as much in the car as possible and loading the caravan as lightly as you can. Just need to watch 75 kg max nose weight.

Skoda Octavias have consistently done well in the Towcar of the Year awards whether 4wd or 2Wd.
Just a point adding weight to the car whether it be towbar or caravan kit doesn’t affect kerbweight. It becomes part of the cars payload and doesn’t change the basic ratio between kerbweight and MTPLM of the caravan. But your approach of keeping car heavy and caravan light is well recognised. It’s amazing how quickly the weight of caravan kit uses up the caravans available payload.

PS Edit. An Octavia Scout 4x4 might be a better Towcar has it has slightly raised suspension and doesnt have such very low profile tyres. Just a thought providing weights come in okay.

 

[Craigyoung]

I'd off thought so . Its giving you 159o kg and you should get a decent van for that but don't forget you have to load it also and not be over the 35oo kg .

Good luck

But the OP hasn’t quoted kerbweight of the Q5. Or makers braked towing weight, which given VAG normally have decent towing weights shouldn’t be a problem. But it would be nice to see:
Car kerb weight
.
CarMAM or GVW
Caravan MTPLM
Caravan MIRO
Then people could make sensible answers rather than piecemeal responses to a changing scene.

Sorry clive , got my numbers mixed up, should have been a lower weighted van to allow him to pack and not exceed his combined weight towing for his licence

Iamflash , take the test and it'll open up a lot more variety off cars and vans to you.

Good luck

 

[CustardAvenger]

...

Iamflash , take the test and it'll open up a lot more variety off cars and vans to you.

Good luck

I am lucky enough to have a post '97 licence inch: and I have done the test for the BE entitlement. I've shared these links before, but this should give you all the info on taking the Car and Trailer test or B+E. If you are serious about caravanning, it is worth while as it makes this discussion completely academic.

https://www.practicalcaravan.com/blog/43945-how-to-pass-your-be-test
https://www.gov.uk/car-trailer-driving-test
https://www.campingandcaravanningclub.co.uk/membership/benefits/courses/becourse/b-e-course-providers/

The weights and ratios can be confusing, but it is all in aid of keeping us legal and safe. last thing you want is a unstable outfit!

 

[Craigyoung]

I was the same as you only last year I was limited to 3500kg as I passed my test 3 days after they changed the ruling , it didn't seem nothing then but after learning everything in the last 5 year when starting to caravan I was gutted because it interferes with all my weights and what I was allowed to tow but last year I done my heavy goods which upped my limit anyway but like people say if you do the test it'll be a lot better , but still getting a car and outfit can be done within your limits .

We enjoyed 3 years off beginners caravanning with this outfit but all under 35oo !
Good luck