Keeping to 20 mph

[Buckman]

After reading up on the ACC, it seems I have been using it anyway? However even when not using the ACC, the Yaris will still brake or twitch steering if the system thinks there is danger ahead. I was taught to drive at high speeds and to advanced driving standards and the one thing we were taught was never to brake on a bend however the Yaris does just this as it thinks the trees on the other side of the road are a danger. On a wet road the consequences could be terrifying!

Whoever decided to impose these onerous gadgets on car manufacturers is obviously not a driver. If one needs to rely on all these gadgets to get safely from A to B, maybe they should not be on the road?

 

[Dustydog]

No mine doesn’t have active sign recognition, but the satnav shows speed limit relayed to the message screen in front of me. What makes you think that ACC makes the driver switch off? I could say that being on CC is not as good because at the driver is needing to keep making adjustments either actually, or mentally due to variations in speed of nearby traffic. Is there any evidence to support your view?

My Sat nav shows the speed limits ,but in Scotland and Wales it still shows 30 rather than the 20 which seems to have been brought in over the last two years.

Of course there’s no evidence ! Just an opinion on whether technology should be a prime mover or just a driver aid. From what you and others have said it appears to be a radar system with a specific distance set presumably synched with speed.
There are some who don’t pay attention to the distant range of vision and become reliant on the ACC.
Just a point of view Clive

 

[otherclive]

After reading up on the ACC, it seems I have been using it anyway? However even when not using the ACC, the Yaris will still brake or twitch steering if the system thinks there is danger ahead. I was taught to drive at high speeds and to advanced driving standards and the one thing we were taught was never to brake on a bend however the Yaris does just this as it thinks the trees on the other side of the road are a danger. On a wet road the consequences could be terrifying!

Whoever decided to impose these onerous gadgets on car manufacturers is obviously not a driver. If one needs to rely on all these gadgets to get safely from A to B, maybe they should not be on the road?

I’m now on my third car with automatic emergency braking, current one RAV4 and Kia Rio, and although we explore all sorts of roads the only time I have ever felt it activate was a sightly too fast entry to our drive with garage door ahead. I tend to set the response at medium setting, but your Yaris is more modern than the cars I've had it on, and perhaps it’s sensors and processors respond more widely.

 

[otherclive]

My Sat nav shows the speed limits ,but in Scotland and Wales it still shows 30 rather than the 20 which seems to have been brought in over the last two years.

Of course there’s no evidence ! Just an opinion on whether technology should be a prime mover or just a driver aid. From what you and others have said it appears to be a radar system with a specific distance set presumably synched with speed.
There are some who don’t pay attention to the distant range of vision and become reliant on the ACC.
Just a point of view Clive

Methinks a satnav update could be on the Christmas list. But even they aren’t foolproof. Mine has picked up a new mandatory 40 mph on the A350 dualling project. It picked up the variable limits at the M5M4 Almondsbury gantries even as they changed. But despite two full software updates it still thinks it’s 40mph from M4 Jnct 17 southbound on the 70mph A350 dual carriageway until you pass the 50 mph limit just prior to traffic lights about 1.5 miles south of J17. Welsh 20 mph ones picked up too. It gets current updates OTA but gaps in the data base aren’t seemingly addressed. Should we trust such technology? Yes, with a degree of caution and scepticism.

 

[JTQ]

The only "gripe" I have with our Golf's ACC is it getting involved on the likes of motorway exits, where a following car accelerates up our inside, aiming to exit at a higher speed than our cruising speed. The Golf is provoked to slow down.
Not that I understand why those leaving motorways feel a need to accelerate away when coming off only then likely to have to brake shortly later.

 

[Dustydog]

I’m now on my third car with automatic emergency braking, current one RAV4 and Kia Rio, and although we explore all sorts of roads the only time I have ever felt it activate was a sightly too fast entry to our drive with garage door ahead. I tend to set the response at medium setting, but your Yaris is more modern than the cars I've had it on, and perhaps it’s sensors and processors respond more widely.

For a laugh 🙉 how do you think this system would respond if you drive under power at 30 mph towards a brick wall🤪Worth a punt maybe 😉

 

[otherclive]

For a laugh 🙉 how do you think this system would respond if you drive under power at 30 mph towards a brick wall🤪Worth a punt maybe 😉

if you look at the car’s NCAP report you can get chapter and verse on how it might cope. Though hope not to test it. On the first YouTube NCAP tests you can actually see videos of cars being tested for emergency autonomous braking, or pedestrian detection braking, etc. I can’t understand why anyone would doubt the potential of such systems providing supplementary backup capabilities

https://cdn.euroncap.com/media/55650/euroncap-2019-toyota-rav4-datasheet.pdf

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KW6rMl8DIgY



PS this next video shows a BYD sea lion tire puncture control system working with two simultaneous blow outs on one side. Takes me back to my Citroen BX16 estate, which could resist a tyre blowout using its hydraulic suspension.

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G1g00OwOj2I

 

[RogerL]

Questioning the effectiveness of emergency autonomous braking is like questioning the effectiveness of a RCD fitted to caravans - they're designed to trip fast enough to protect a person with poor cardiac health, but they're not actually tested like that.

 

[otherclive]

Questioning the effectiveness of emergency autonomous braking is like questioning the effectiveness of a RCD fitted to caravans - they're designed to trip fast enough to protect a person with poor cardiac health, but they're not actually tested like that.

I really don’t understand what you are saying. Is it that someone with poor cardiac health has slower responses than one with good cardiac health. What’s a RCD got to do with cardiac health, other than an electric shock isn’t going to do a heart any favours irrespective of whether it’s a healthy or unhealthy heart.

 

[RogerL]

I really don’t understand what you are saying. Is it that someone with poor cardiac health has slower responses than one with good cardiac health. What’s a RCD got to do with cardiac health, other than an electric shock isn’t going to do a heart any favours irrespective of whether it’s a healthy or unhealthy heart.

People with poor cardiac health are less likely to survive an electric shock - but an RCD should be fast enough to protect them.

When I fitted mains electrics to my first caravan, I paid an electrician to test it - he failed the RCD on speed - when he tested the replacement RCD, which passed, he made the claim that it had to operate fast enough to protect someone with poor cardiac health - I challenged him to a demonstration but he declined!

 

[Buckman]

Methinks a satnav update could be on the Christmas list. But even they aren’t foolproof. Mine has picked up a new mandatory 40 mph on the A350 dualling project. It picked up the variable limits at the M5M4 Almondsbury gantries even as they changed. But despite two full software updates it still thinks it’s 40mph from M4 Jnct 17 southbound on the 70mph A350 dual carriageway until you pass the 50 mph limit just prior to traffic lights about 1.5 miles south of J17. Welsh 20 mph ones picked up too. It gets current updates OTA but gaps in the data base aren’t seemingly addressed. Should we trust such technology? Yes, with a degree of caution and scepticism.

Why not download an app like TomTom to your phone, link the phone to the car and use the TT app for journeys or simply use it on the phone to compare the inbuilt Satnav. We have never had a car where the inbuilt Satnav is up to date. Cannot understand why a stand alone Satnav can update on its own, but the inbuilt Satnav can only be updated by the dealer and this may only happen once every 2 - 3 years!

 

[otherclive]

Why not download an app like TomTom to your phone, link the phone to the car and use the TT app for journeys or simply use it on the phone to compare the inbuilt Satnav. We have never had a car where the inbuilt Satnav is up to date. Cannot understand why a stand alone Satnav can update on its own, but the inbuilt Satnav can only be updated by the dealer and this may only happen once every 2 - 3 years!

My comment was to Dusty Dog not wrt my satnav, which is fine for navigation, weather and traffic alerts, fuel pricing/location, speed camera alerts and parking location/availability. Its weak point is that there are stretches of road where its database doesn’t correlate with the posted road sign speed limit. It doesn’t have road sign reading. So mine is a minor irritant but since it’s the first car I’ve had where it shows if I’m exceeding a speed limit I can live with the minor glitch. Apart from the Speedo of course. 😂

I’ve updated it twice now using downloads from the Toyota portal. Full updates covering UK and Europe. Just download to usb, insert into cars data port on dashboard and wait patiently for it to install. Toyota issue two updates per year, Spring and Autumn. I’ve got Spring 2025 installed. But there must be gaps in its database wrt speed limit accuracy going back some time. It does though do OTA update the active services I listed above, that’s how it knew that a local 40 mph limit had been introduced to cover 18 months of roadworks. So it’s not all gloom.

I could use AppleAirplay for Apple Maps or Google mapping via my phone on to the cars display screen, so no need for Tom Tom or others like Waze.

 

[GUMPY]

I use Google maps via Android Auto to display sat nav on the cars screen. This enables me to run GPS test on the phones display giving me a very large accurate MPH display that I can't ignore. More to the point it gives C a speed display so I can be nagged if I am going to quickly or slowly 🫣

 

[Buckman]

We have found Google maps to very misleading and taking you around the houses when there is a simpler and quicker route. I prefer to use the stand alone TomTom in the Yaris which luckily would be very seldom. On issue with the built in Satnav on the Lexus.

 

[GUMPY]

I don't believe it does but Google maps appears to learn the type of routes you like.
Mine rarely takes me down little roads and if the quickest route is little roads always gives me an alternative route using bigger roads.

 

[otherclive]

Why not download an app like TomTom to your phone, link the phone to the car and use the TT app for journeys or simply use it on the phone to compare the inbuilt Satnav. We have never had a car where the inbuilt Satnav is up to date. Cannot understand why a stand alone Satnav can update on its own, but the inbuilt Satnav can only be updated by the dealer and this may only happen once every 2 - 3 years!

My Garmin stand alone satnav has to be updated by me and I either use home wifi or connect it to the MAC. Garmin issue updates to the navigation and software elements at periodic intervals. I just update it about three monthly as we use it in the Rio.

 

[otherclive]

I use Google maps via Android Auto to display sat nav on the cars screen. This enables me to run GPS test on the phones display giving me a very large accurate MPH display that I can't ignore. More to the point it gives C a speed display so I can be nagged if I am going to quickly or slowly 🫣

Does it alert you in any way if your speed is above the limit?

 

[Buckman]

My Garmin stand alone satnav has to be updated by me and I either use home wifi or connect it to the MAC. Garmin issue updates to the navigation and software elements at periodic intervals. I just update it about three monthly as we use it in the Rio.

Same here with our TomToms. However the TT updates you instantly if the road ahead is closed or blocked for whatever reason. Of course you also get the speed camera notification. Bonus is that you can add your own POIs.

However the TT, Garmin etc Satnav cost a between £200 - £400 and has all these facilities. The inbuilt car Satnav probably cost over £1000 yet it has none of these facilities?

 

[otherclive]

I don't believe it does but Google maps appears to learn the type of routes you like.
Mine rarely takes me down little roads and if the quickest route is little roads always gives me an alternative route using bigger roads.

If it compares alternative route distance and the one down the country lanes is 259 m less than the A road distance, if both roads are 60 mph limits then the lanes route takes precedence. Perhaps as more AI comes to fruition such conflicts could be smoothed out. I normally opt for Fastest on a satnav, but it still doesn’t rule out the above. When I had a van in tow I would recon the route using Google, or input my own route to my Garmin, ensuring that my “landing approach” aligned with the sites instructions. Google Street View being the travellers friend. 👍

 

[GUMPY]

Does it alert you in any way if your speed is above the limit?

Not that I am aware of but that's one of the things that C does.😲

 

[otherclive]

Same here with our TomToms. However the TT updates you instantly if the road ahead is closed or blocked for whatever reason. Of course you also get the speed camera notification. Bonus is that you can add your own POIs.

However the TT, Garmin etc Satnav cost a between £200 - £400 and has all these facilities. The inbuilt car Satnav probably cost over £1000 yet it has none of these facilities?

I’m surprised at you saying that the car satnav has none of your listed facilities. Could it be that being pre owned the dealership reverted the infotainment and sat nav to factory default. Mine did that for my previous Kia Xceed and now this RAV4. So I had to register the car with the respective makers portals and then set up and update the systems. Kia gave me four updates a year for seven years. No such generosity from Toyota. But after paying for an update which I self installed it gives me all of the facilities you list and more.

 

[otherclive]

Not that I am aware of but that's one of the things that C does.😲

Here’s what Google AI says about route selection. Being Googles own AI search answer it must be correct😱

Google Search

 

[Buckman]

Here is link copied from another website. https://olderdriversforum.com/ I am considering doing the IAM assessment.

I’m surprised at you saying that the car satnav has none of your listed facilities. Could it be that being pre owned the dealership reverted the infotainment and sat nav to factory default. Mine did that for my previous Kia Xceed and now this RAV4. So I had to register the car with the respective makers portals and then set up and update the systems. Kia gave me four updates a year for seven years. No such generosity from Toyota. But after paying for an update which I self installed it gives me all of the facilities you list and more.

I have never come across a car where the Sastnav updates to warn you of roadworks, accident and offer alternative route. One of the reasons why I carry the TomTom in the car just in case.

 

[JTQ]

The Discovery's in built sat nav takes some "interesting" routes, particularly if provoked to do a recalc if I miss or ignore its plans.

Examples could be if redirected to pick up on a road returning at an acute angle, it would easily find some farm track across rather than the major road hairpin. This its favourite trick in France where I have found its best not to take.

It also strangely sees popping through Didcot as its preferred route if travelling along the A34, that one I definitely know better.

The Golf's and our Garmin also as others have found tend to favour taking more "normal" routes than the local "rat runs" we know about.
I don't see this as a shortcoming, best when not travelling locally to keep to more traffic friendly routes IMO.
Our lane is part of a local rat run and the last thing I want is those travelling across country using their sat navs to come that way.

 

[RogerL]

Here is link copied from another website. https://olderdriversforum.com/ I am considering doing the IAM assessment.


I have never come across a car where the Sastnav updates to warn you of roadworks, accident and offer alternative route. One of the reasons why I carry the TomTom in the car just in case.

As delivered, the satnav in my Touareg used a combination of the satnav and the traffic feature to re-route journeys if delays became apparent, ie accident or roadworks but the traffic signal they used got switched off and no alternative available.

I use Google Maps to pre-plan routes on the PC at home, then Waze on my phone during the journey - sometimes with the car's inbuilt satnav as well!

It's worth doing the IAM assessment - most people are surprised at the number of bad habits they've picked up over the years.