Why does the 4x4 owner always draw the short straw?
We have a Disco to tow our caravan and is also used as a general workhorse for business. The only thing which I consider as inappropriate is, mothers driving kids 100 yards to school in a 4x4 which has no other use than a children chariot!!
We have a Disco to tow our caravan and is also used as a general workhorse for business. The only thing which I consider as inappropriate is, mothers driving kids 100 yards to school in a 4x4 which has no other use than a children chariot!!
Jim
I am one of the lucky ones who can get around (just not too far). As for a debate! it would end as an opinion of where the line is drawn, how able must the person be? how far into the countryside? where? when?
The problem with this kind of thing is that people abuse it, thats the real issue to the whole access to the countryside argument. I love the countryside and hate to see it get abused by anyone, this includes off roaders as well as ramblers (who cause more damage than they admit too)
I am lucky because my lack of abilities are not too visible due to treatment and special braces. But I am also treated as a hooligan in a 4x4 when out because I did not walk the path.
My belief is that all people should have a choice and that rules can be put in place and managed to ensure abuse is avoided. I also believe that the countryside is there for all to enjoy, no matter how they want to enjoy it. there is room for everyone as long as tolerance is given and abuse is controlled.
Personally, we don't use our Disco for offroading. It has it's job and that's all. It doesn't mean to say we dissaprove ....we had a very old LR which was used as an offroading vehicle, and it was great fun, but, this was not green laning but an organised meet on a JCB training site.
There is no easy answer, any scheme would be open to abuse, just look at the blatant abuse of the disabled parking badge scheme.
Got no problem with that Wendy or 4x4s for towing, its green laning I object to. Just had a conversation with Steve who has made the point that due to poor health he cant get in to the countryside any other way. Dont know what to say, I dont like it but who am I to deny him access.
Greenlaners are usually pretty responsible people. In fact I have read somewhere if it wasn't for them, alot of the green lanes would be lost due to lack of upkeep and maintainance. In turn this would be a loss to horse riders and walkers also. In theory I have no objection at all.
There should be some differtiation here.
"4x4" is too general a term.
Is it then unacceptible to drive a 4 wheel drive saloon car like the Audi AllRoad then? Or a Fiat Panda 4x4? or a Volvo V70 AWD?
There are "proper", capable offroad vehicles that are built for a purpose - the potential workhorses. LR Defender etc. I own one of these and use it responsibly offroad. It also comes in useful for clearing burn out stolen cars from Byways to assist the local authority.
Then there are the "soft roaders" - most of which will never see anything more challenging than a kerb in Tesco's car park or a grass pitch!. Most of these are surely status purchases - and I agree many people can't drive the things.
There was a recent survey that actually stated that the Land Rover Defender was the safest "classic" vehicle to drive!.
Own up - how many Ramblers are there in here?.
"4x4" is too general a term.
Is it then unacceptible to drive a 4 wheel drive saloon car like the Audi AllRoad then? Or a Fiat Panda 4x4? or a Volvo V70 AWD?
There are "proper", capable offroad vehicles that are built for a purpose - the potential workhorses. LR Defender etc. I own one of these and use it responsibly offroad. It also comes in useful for clearing burn out stolen cars from Byways to assist the local authority.
Then there are the "soft roaders" - most of which will never see anything more challenging than a kerb in Tesco's car park or a grass pitch!. Most of these are surely status purchases - and I agree many people can't drive the things.
There was a recent survey that actually stated that the Land Rover Defender was the safest "classic" vehicle to drive!.
Own up - how many Ramblers are there in here?.
"Then there are the "soft roaders" - most of which will never see anything more challenging than a kerb in Tesco's car park or a grass pitch!. Most of these are surely status purchases - and I agree many people can't drive the things."
Probably right with "most" but some like mine are used off road for work. Also can anyone suggest a normal car that would pull a 1300kg caravan while still maintaining the reccomended 85% ratio?
Steve
Roger, Im sure if you went on the 4x4 experience (see open invitation) you wouldnt make ill informed statements like that.
(ps.totally agree with you)
(ps.totally agree with you)
And cars, don't forget them, afterall they account for greater number of deaths on the road than any other vehicle!!!!
Oh, AND THATS A FACT!!
Roger,
Do I take it that you put the same effort into campaigning against
- drivers without tax, insurance and MOTs?
- drivers without licences or who are banned?
- young lads in souped up badly maintained hot hatches?
- people who don't wear seatbelts?
If I run you over in any vehicle it's going to hurt. How much and whether you survive surely also depends on factors such as speed etc.
Mind you, if I run you over in my Defender it will hurt twice - once going forwards then again when I select reverse
I assume you are a fully paid up member of the Ramblers Association and ride a bicycle rather than drive a car?.
Surely there are far more important matters in the world today than getting excited about 4x4s.
Do I take it that you put the same effort into campaigning against
- drivers without tax, insurance and MOTs?
- drivers without licences or who are banned?
- young lads in souped up badly maintained hot hatches?
- people who don't wear seatbelts?
If I run you over in any vehicle it's going to hurt. How much and whether you survive surely also depends on factors such as speed etc.
Mind you, if I run you over in my Defender it will hurt twice - once going forwards then again when I select reverse
I assume you are a fully paid up member of the Ramblers Association and ride a bicycle rather than drive a car?.
Surely there are far more important matters in the world today than getting excited about 4x4s.
David,
If you think there is more important things to get exited about, why do you threaten to run somebosy over when they don't agree with you?
If you think there is more important things to get exited about, why do you threaten to run somebosy over when they don't agree with you?
truck, buses etc have a valid purpose and worth the risk. The risk is to great and the benifits are very small with 4x4.
Sorry but that is again just your point of view. And again you post it as if it is everyones. Pete, you have no idea what the benefits of using a 4x4 is to the individuals, so why post blanket statements like that?
Why are the risks of driving a 4x4 higher than driving a car?
Cars do not kill, Drivers and circumstances do that.
I think this anti 4x4 thing is all rather sad to be honest.
I thought this was a forum to discuss caravaning but every other post seems to be about 4x4s. Many opinions are sadly expressed by people who clearly have not bothered to seek out the facts for themselves or who clearly do not think people should have the right to own and drive what they want.
Anyone who goes caravaning, myself included, must also think about what that hobby does for the environment before attacking others. I may not tow with my 4x4, but I am still adding to congestion on the roads and by towing increasing the fuel consumption and therefore emissions that my car throws out into the atmosphere every time I take the van out.
And how many of the anti's fly on aircraft? - I'm sure your one cheap flight will have done far more damage to the environment than my (proper) 4x4 will ever do in it's lifetime!.
I'm off to take up knitting
I thought this was a forum to discuss caravaning but every other post seems to be about 4x4s. Many opinions are sadly expressed by people who clearly have not bothered to seek out the facts for themselves or who clearly do not think people should have the right to own and drive what they want.
Anyone who goes caravaning, myself included, must also think about what that hobby does for the environment before attacking others. I may not tow with my 4x4, but I am still adding to congestion on the roads and by towing increasing the fuel consumption and therefore emissions that my car throws out into the atmosphere every time I take the van out.
And how many of the anti's fly on aircraft? - I'm sure your one cheap flight will have done far more damage to the environment than my (proper) 4x4 will ever do in it's lifetime!.
I'm off to take up knitting
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