Overseas Workers

[Lord Braykewynde]

We are only a small island so I cannot see the point of millions more East Europeans coming here to replace the people you call low skilled Frank. Not all of Britains children will grow up to be University graduates, where do they find jobs, Eastern Europe? This is leading to anarchy in the future. It's not just Poles etc. we also take in millions from Asia and Africa, when does it stop, how does it end? In anarchy as I said before, when we have an even larger underclass of the indigenous population. If I have to have a choice give me the Eastern Europeans everytime, at least they integrate and have no interest in bomb making skills.

I wonder why that large company is in the CZ republic? Would it be because they are more IT and mathematically competant than here or would it be more to do with the salaries that are paid?

Maybe it's the former and that's why call centres are being re-located to the Indian sub-continent, because they have better telephone communication skills :O)

Allowing migrants into Scotland to reverse the population trend will not work Frank, wait until the midge season and they will follow the other Scots, south. To be truthful, if I was a Scot and lived in a midge area I would head south too .. hehheh!

 

[Val & Frank]

Liz,

Just all tradesmen are all from Riga or Kiew or Moscow or Prague

so where do you live???

Aberdeen

Kiz,

In a lot of cases the building trade has become semi skilled, alright I will admit to 90% of it has become semi skilled. With the advent of power tools a lot of it has become competent DIY jobs.

The world is not short of people who can do this work it's just that the peole are in the wrong locations.

Our clothes now come from China and not Accrington or Bradford. I suppose we can build a wall and fight the people off who want to come here,but were would that leave everyone ???

Val & Frank

 

[Val & Frank]

L B " I wonder why that large company is in the CZ republic? Would it be because they are more IT and mathematically competant than here YES, and the other important skill is Language Ability.

We have been slow to adapt to a changing world. Do you need to go to school until you are 18 to become a bricklayer ?? Because I know a few who left at 15 with no O or A levels and they are very very competent. Why all of a sudden is being "semi skilled" seem to have taken on a inferiority complex ??? I don't know the answers but I do know we need to change and quick!!!!

Val & Frank

Val & Frank

 

[LizCornwall]

Hi Frank, as you are aware I now live in Cornwall, work down here for some is seasonal, but we do have a lot of skilled and semi-skilled local people, now if local people down here all employed overseas workers to do their jobs, where does it leave our local workers.

Cornwall is bad enough for work, low pay, which most of the people do not moan about.

Like all places there are some who just don't want to work, and quite happy to claim social, but not all.

By employing more and more overseas workers, more and more local people will have to claim benefits because there is no work for them.

Lets give our own children and grandchildren a chance,

Whats going to happen to them if overseas workers are here to do their jobs. They will have to leave their home towns or even Country to find work.

Liz

 

[Lord Braykewynde]

Well I don't think it will affect me Frank, I'll hopefully be busy towing and visiting all the different scenic clouds unless someone has plans for me downstairs.

Anarchy is staring the country in the face and until the people in power, without worrying about the PC minorities, address the situation I fear the worse, so much so that sometimes I feel guilty about bringing my children into this mess. When I look at my grandchildren and wonder what the future holds for them it frightens me :O(

 

[Lord Braykewynde]

Hi Frank, as you are aware I now live in Cornwall, work down here for some is seasonal, but we do have a lot of skilled and semi-skilled local people, now if local people down here all employed overseas workers to do their jobs, where does it leave our local workers.

Cornwall is bad enough for work, low pay, which most of the people do not moan about.

Like all places there are some who just don't want to work, and quite happy to claim social, but not all.

By employing more and more overseas workers, more and more local people will have to claim benefits because there is no work for them.

Lets give our own children and grandchildren a chance,

Whats going to happen to them if overseas workers are here to do their jobs. They will have to leave their home towns or even Country to find work.

Liz

Whats going to happen to them if overseas workers are here to do their jobs. They will have to leave their home towns or even Country to find work.

Liz

Who cares Liz, with the exception of themselves and their relatives?

Government and employers are only interested in getting the jobs done as cheaply as possible and with the largest profit.

 

[LizCornwall]

Whats going to happen to them if overseas workers are here to do their jobs. They will have to leave their home towns or even Country to find work.

Liz

Who cares Liz, with the exception of themselves and their relatives?

Government and employers are only interested in getting the jobs done as cheaply as possible and with the largest profit.

I care about my daughter and her future children, my grandchildren, I would like them to work and I would like to see them grow up in this country, it has to be their choice not made to leave because their is no work for them in this country.

Not only work but housing, overseas workers have to live somewhere. Liz

 

[Nautilus_374303586]

The company in the North West for which I work recently had several vacancies including a driver, a storeman and two clerical vacancies.

There was not one application from a 'local' person. This has also been our experience in the past for many non-management or executive positions.

Whilst I agree that to no small degree the do-gooders and 'liberals' are in mno small way responsible for many of the problems this country presently has,to blame any group of non UK Citizens for taking jobs is Xenophobic Claptrap.

The decline in British Industry during the 60's and 70's had far more to do with the Unions (look at the motor trade) and the Labour Party's obsession with nationalisation than with immigration (which was blamed back then).

I agree that we had it much easier in many ways than our kids and especially our grandchildren do. However, that doesn't mean we can turn the clock back, pull up the drawbridge and pretend we still have an Empire.

 

[Guest]

Poland itself is now so short of workers, of all types that their own infrastructure is suffering. So by encouraging this movement we are also affecting badly another country. I also feel that the reason many of them came here was more regarding working the minimum period of time necessary to obtain the benefits, and then of course bring Mum Dad and all the family across as well. It is unrealistic to assume that someone can work here for less than the minimum wage and still be able to survive, plus if we cannot afford to live here after paying taxes etc, then another nationality cannot either. Many of them work the black market so do not pay taxes or NI, until they are caught and then claim asylum. 80% of the homeless shelters here in Edinburgh are full of migrant 'workers', all currently Polish but they are about to be evicted by the Romanians who are coming in droves as well. Yes, many retail stores here in Edinburgh employ migrant workers because they are cheap. But they never stay for very long as they find the work is too hard and guess what.. the money does not go far enough.

I accept that after the War a number of Poles settled here very happily, but that was not in the hundreds of thousands, and they married and settled down with local people, mainly because to go home would have meant being shot. That is not the case now.

I am sorry but kindness is one thing, stupidity is another. Yes, Frank there is a housing improvement boom, mainly due to the fact that prices are overinflated. However, that will stop sooner or later and then what? Will all these 'experts' go home? Somehow I doubt it.

 

[Lord Braykewynde]

Sorry Nautilus, I cannot see your point. I'm not blaming them for coming here, I'm blaming the authorities for admitting literally millions into these small islands. All this extra pressure is put on the energy utilities, water, health etc. It also puts a burden on British taxpayers who have to pay out child benefits etc. even though the workers families don't live here. What the Empire had to do with it I don't know with the exception when we had an Empire we still had immigrants, but at a regulated number, not a free for all from any country in the sun who wants to dump their population here.

Take for example the illegal immigrants and asylum seekers who mainly come from Africa. Once leaving their countries their first port of call is usually France or Spain. If they are seeking asylum why don't they do it in those countries, ask yourself that Nautilus.

If you still don't know the reason is good ol' blighty is a soft touch with better handouts. They are economic migrants, simple as that.

It's easy to blame the ills of the country on the Unions back 40 years ago so why not blame World War 2 and the lend-lease debt which we've only just finished paying the U.S.A. for? This country isn't fully recovered from that whereas Germany and Japan didn't have to pay any reparations for fear of the same thing happening after the signing of the Versaille Treaty.

 

[Val & Frank]

Hi All

Lets clear one thing up, these are NOT illegal immigrants. The same as SL is not an illegal immigrant in Hungary. They have a right under the EU to be here and to be working. Now you may not agree with that I don't know. What I do know is I never voted this lot in. Yes I agree with SL, Poland is short of workers but not for long. The ones here are saving for a new home in Poland, and when the Polish economy picks up like Spains or G all will be ok

Val &frank

 

[LizCornwall]

Sorry Frank, but I quote "The ones here are saving for a new home in Poland".

What chance have our local people got then saving for a new home here???

 

[Litespeed]

Hi Liz,

It seems that all the Eastern Europeans in Cornwall are working either for the Daffodil / bulb farms or the veg picking companies. Our business employs about 140 people in Cornwall and I would say less than 20 are Cornish. They are all from 'Up The Line' as we say. It seems that the Cornish are happy to sit back and let the Northerners (anybody past Launceston!!)take over!!!

Whats happening to us!!!???

As for the Eastern Europeans I would be happy to employ any of them, but as I said above they seem happy out in the fields in the Cold, Fog, Wind and Rain, I suppose its just like home!!

 

[LizCornwall]

Hi Litespeed,

Quite right what you say daffodil pickers etc. we see them all picked up at the stop points in the white vans, but most of them are illegal immigrants!!!

The Cornish are not stupid, even in selling their homes, very particular who moves next door for their neighbours.

Very,Very, close community.

P.S you say your business employs people in Cornwall, are you actually based in Cornwall, if not that might be the reason why not so many work for your business??

Regards Liz

 

[Marc1]

Here in sunny Lincolnshire we have attracted large numbers of immigrant workers many of whom work as previously stated in jobs that our local workforce do not appear to want. However like most things in life it is not always as it appears. A factory in Goole made its entire workforce redundant then a few weeks after reopened using casual labour provided almost exclusivly of east europeans on minimum wages. Strictly legal perhaps but from a perspective of the redundant workers hardly right. Unless the flow of migrant workers is controlled then who's job is next?.

Marc

 

[Guest]

It is certainly true that the EU rules allow for freedom of movement. However, the majority of countries in what was known as the old West European states have imposed restrictions on work visas for all the new accesion countries. The only ones that didn't were the UK and Ireland and Sweden I believe. So if you were travelling looking fior a good home which would you pick?? Now maybe all these European states are completely wrong, or they recognised something that our political masters seem unable to see. Stability is one thing, chaos is another and guess which one we have achieved.

It is not just the migrant that is the problem, it is the fact that they will bring their whole family group and so we will be paying pensions to those who have never worked here and of course education and health treatment will need to be provided for all. In addition, such large numbers can elect their own MP's and demand preferential treatment, the cost of which will have to come from the existing citizens.

In about 10 years time we will be paying a heavy price for this shortsightedness.

 

[Nautilus_374303586]

Sorry Nautilus, I cannot see your point. I'm not blaming them for coming here, I'm blaming the authorities for admitting literally millions into these small islands. All this extra pressure is put on the energy utilities, water, health etc. It also puts a burden on British taxpayers who have to pay out child benefits etc. even though the workers families don't live here. What the Empire had to do with it I don't know with the exception when we had an Empire we still had immigrants, but at a regulated number, not a free for all from any country in the sun who wants to dump their population here.

Take for example the illegal immigrants and asylum seekers who mainly come from Africa. Once leaving their countries their first port of call is usually France or Spain. If they are seeking asylum why don't they do it in those countries, ask yourself that Nautilus.

If you still don't know the reason is good ol' blighty is a soft touch with better handouts. They are economic migrants, simple as that.

It's easy to blame the ills of the country on the Unions back 40 years ago so why not blame World War 2 and the lend-lease debt which we've only just finished paying the U.S.A. for? This country isn't fully recovered from that whereas Germany and Japan didn't have to pay any reparations for fear of the same thing happening after the signing of the Versaille Treaty.

My points are a) that it is IMHO wrong to blame immigrant workers for taking all the jobs.. that's all been tried before

b) that the Unions had more to do with the economic decline than any of the possibly misguided immigration policies over the last fourty or so years

c) the attitude of some people on these forum seems to be blinkered in that they want to turn the clocks back to the days of the good old British Empire when Jonny Foreigner knew his place and civilisation stopped at Dover.

I agree with a lot of what has been posted on this thread but to blame immigrant workers for our ills as some people seem to be doing , is as stupid and misinformed as the leanings of the PC Brigade to protect everyone except white, anglo saxon British.

 

[Lord Braykewynde]

Here in sunny Lincolnshire we have attracted large numbers of immigrant workers many of whom work as previously stated in jobs that our local workforce do not appear to want. However like most things in life it is not always as it appears. A factory in Goole made its entire workforce redundant then a few weeks after reopened using casual labour provided almost exclusivly of east europeans on minimum wages. Strictly legal perhaps but from a perspective of the redundant workers hardly right. Unless the flow of migrant workers is controlled then who's job is next?.

Marc

My sister-in-law lives in Boston and she says it's full of Portuguese workers. I found this difficult to believe, thinking she had the nationality wrong, until I saw a programme on the T.V. about it.

 

[Lord Braykewynde]

It is certainly true that the EU rules allow for freedom of movement. However, the majority of countries in what was known as the old West European states have imposed restrictions on work visas for all the new accesion countries. The only ones that didn't were the UK and Ireland and Sweden I believe. So if you were travelling looking fior a good home which would you pick?? Now maybe all these European states are completely wrong, or they recognised something that our political masters seem unable to see. Stability is one thing, chaos is another and guess which one we have achieved.

It is not just the migrant that is the problem, it is the fact that they will bring their whole family group and so we will be paying pensions to those who have never worked here and of course education and health treatment will need to be provided for all. In addition, such large numbers can elect their own MP's and demand preferential treatment, the cost of which will have to come from the existing citizens.

In about 10 years time we will be paying a heavy price for this shortsightedness.

Agree 101% and I can't understand how some cannot see it. It is so blatantly obvious but at least it will be easy for the historians of the future to see the causes of why Britain became a third world country.

 

[Nautilus_374303586]

Not sure where you have your information from Scotch Lad but it isn't in fact accurate.

As of April 2006 , if you are an EU national you will not need a work permit to work in Spain - you can enter the country as a tourist and register with the Spanish national employment office (Instituto Nacional de Empleo - INEM) to look for a job. You then have 90 days to find employment - you can obtain an extension after that date or leave Spain and re-enter for a further 90 days. Once you find a job, you will need your employment contract in order to apply for your residence permit.

Similar regulations apply to Germany and I believe France.I suspect that the Netherlands and Belgium are not that different.

Whether or not the UK has room for an unlimited influx of immgrants is another question. I do wonder at the apparent xenophobia that appears to exist generally.

I agree with a lot of the points raised but for different reasons. It has far more to do with the nanny state and people wanting/expecting something for nothing than the influence of immigrants whether from Europe or elsewhere. To blame the woes of the country on them is in my opinion naive...

 

[Marc1]

Good morning your lordship.

There is such a large amount of portugese in the area now that the local BBC radio station broadcasts a news programme for them once a week. Wouldn,t mind but nothing for the ex pat yorkies down here.

Marc

 

[Lord Braykewynde]

Nautilus, by using the word xenophobia is a nice try. It's a word used widely by the PC Brigade if anyone speaks in defence of their family or culture.

At no point have I blamed them for the woes of the country and I don't believe anyone else has. The main culprit is this government but that doesn't detract from the fact that we shouldn't be defending our children and grandchildrens future.

SL is right in his posting, the countries he mentioned, including ours, have an open policy with no limits whereby the others do.

 

[Lord Braykewynde]

Make me happy and tell me the following is a pack of lies made up by "xenophobic" people.

In a UK of 58 million people, levels of net inward migration are already causing rapid environmental deterioration. A million more houses here, a new airport there. in a finite space population pressures grow relentlessly. The amount of land available to provide for each citizen's needs and to absorb the impact of each citizen's consumption has shrunk to nearly a tenth of what it was just 250 years ago, when the population numbered little more than five million.

Overpopulation is already a major contributing cause of urban sprawl, transport gridlock, collapsing infrastructure, disappearing countryside and mounting waste - and those are only the visible problems. Severe fossil fuel shortages are among the challenges that lie ahead, and these will probably occur before 2050, within the lifespan of many people now aged under 35.

I await someones reply with anticipation :O)

 

[Lord Braykewynde]

Not sure where you have your information from Scotch Lad but it isn't in fact accurate.

As of April 2006 , if you are an EU national you will not need a work permit to work in Spain - you can enter the country as a tourist and register with the Spanish national employment office (Instituto Nacional de Empleo - INEM) to look for a job. You then have 90 days to find employment - you can obtain an extension after that date or leave Spain and re-enter for a further 90 days. Once you find a job, you will need your employment contract in order to apply for your residence permit.

Similar regulations apply to Germany and I believe France.I suspect that the Netherlands and Belgium are not that different.

Whether or not the UK has room for an unlimited influx of immgrants is another question. I do wonder at the apparent xenophobia that appears to exist generally.

I agree with a lot of the points raised but for different reasons. It has far more to do with the nanny state and people wanting/expecting something for nothing than the influence of immigrants whether from Europe or elsewhere. To blame the woes of the country on them is in my opinion naive...

Spain has had an open door policy for 10 years and the following is the fruits of their labours ...

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/5369986.stm

 

[Lord Braykewynde]

Not sure where you have your information from Scotch Lad but it isn't in fact accurate.

As of April 2006 , if you are an EU national you will not need a work permit to work in Spain - you can enter the country as a tourist and register with the Spanish national employment office (Instituto Nacional de Empleo - INEM) to look for a job. You then have 90 days to find employment - you can obtain an extension after that date or leave Spain and re-enter for a further 90 days. Once you find a job, you will need your employment contract in order to apply for your residence permit.

Similar regulations apply to Germany and I believe France.I suspect that the Netherlands and Belgium are not that different.

Whether or not the UK has room for an unlimited influx of immgrants is another question. I do wonder at the apparent xenophobia that appears to exist generally.

I agree with a lot of the points raised but for different reasons. It has far more to do with the nanny state and people wanting/expecting something for nothing than the influence of immigrants whether from Europe or elsewhere. To blame the woes of the country on them is in my opinion naive...

Further proof that Sls comment was correct.....

Eastern European workers are most likely to choose to immigrate to the UK, Ireland and Sweden; the three countries of Old Europe that opened their borders to immigration from the ten new member states, who joined on 1 May 2004.

According to a report by the European Citizen Action Service (ECAS) published on 10 Aug. this year, the increase in migratory movements from Eastern Europe since 2004 looks like a full-blown invasion: 175,000 new workers registered in the UK; 85,000 new National Insurance numbers created in Ireland; almost 22,000 visas handed out in Sweden.

The "invaders" are generally young (usually between 18 and 34 years of age) and male. However, the ECAS data does not allow confirm whether this constitutes brain drain or not - that is to say, whether the immigrants are highly qualified or not. What is certain is that between 3 and 5 percent of young Eastern adults who have completed a university course leave their country. This figure is relatively low, partly due to the fact that the other countries of Western Europe have decided to use a transitional period during which their borders will remain closed.