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Hi Ria, I can understand where your coming from, but local people who were born and worked here and on a low wage, or min.wage can claim working mans tax credits, or those with family can claim family tax credits, it's based on the tax you have paid the previous year.P60.
So consquently these overseas workers would not be entitled. Regards Liz
So consquently these overseas workers would not be entitled. Regards Liz
Colin......."The new French president has said that he will endeavour to get his country back on line and ignore EU policy if necessary. Why can't we adopt this attitude or are we too scared of the other member states.
Before long the eastern block countries will be so strong within the EU they will be dictating to us. we will end up as a Soviet State of Europe."
OK as we are so soft and we are not a free entity anymore the European motoring limits we have are so bad for us. OK Motor industry is my area... I mean like France and Germany we have a 100BHP limit on Motorcycles, all aftermarket tuning parts cannot add more than 5% gain in performance(TUV Germany) and all second hand cars have to be sold with brand new tyres(Germany).We have a voluntary 186MPH limit on Motorcycles and no TUV and limites on performance and we dont have to change tyres for new if we sell our old car!
OH Sorry we dont comply.. Like we dont comply with green issues like recycling...........I could do a bit more searching and find other things we don't do.
How will the Eastern Block get control? They are quite impoverished and still struggling to re-build their countries after the mess they were left with after Russia left them......I suggest you visit one of the Baltic countries and it will surprise you with the state of much of the country. When you get real beggers coming asking you for money!
I am sorry that you have no real idea of the state of the old Soviet states. It just goes to show how insular many British people are! We have started to turn into Americans where we stop looking out side out little window and everything out side is like a big bad wolf that wants to kill us!
Before long the eastern block countries will be so strong within the EU they will be dictating to us. we will end up as a Soviet State of Europe."
OK as we are so soft and we are not a free entity anymore the European motoring limits we have are so bad for us. OK Motor industry is my area... I mean like France and Germany we have a 100BHP limit on Motorcycles, all aftermarket tuning parts cannot add more than 5% gain in performance(TUV Germany) and all second hand cars have to be sold with brand new tyres(Germany).We have a voluntary 186MPH limit on Motorcycles and no TUV and limites on performance and we dont have to change tyres for new if we sell our old car!
OH Sorry we dont comply.. Like we dont comply with green issues like recycling...........I could do a bit more searching and find other things we don't do.
How will the Eastern Block get control? They are quite impoverished and still struggling to re-build their countries after the mess they were left with after Russia left them......I suggest you visit one of the Baltic countries and it will surprise you with the state of much of the country. When you get real beggers coming asking you for money!
I am sorry that you have no real idea of the state of the old Soviet states. It just goes to show how insular many British people are! We have started to turn into Americans where we stop looking out side out little window and everything out side is like a big bad wolf that wants to kill us!
Well, with an Indian wife , born in Africa. Grandparents from Italy and Ireland I think I will quit my 60 hours per week job and live off the "British" tax payer ;O)
Brian (",)
Brian (",)
We have a new or about to be new EEC country where for many years visitors wanting to work in that country would be grilled by local immigration workers as to why they should be able to take local peoples jobs, quite often foreign women left the offices in tears as they headed to the airport and a one way flight home with passport marked.
As a foreign visitor investing in the country you were only able to own 49% of any business and have an indigenous partner owning 51%, over the past 50 years plenty of Brits and others have had their routine annual residency permit rejected and been forced to sell their share of their business and homkes for a pittance before fleeing tails between their legs.
This whilst the same countries people have been made welcome here and benefited from oour weak regulations and will now gain beenfit from EEC rules.
Ria
As a foreign visitor investing in the country you were only able to own 49% of any business and have an indigenous partner owning 51%, over the past 50 years plenty of Brits and others have had their routine annual residency permit rejected and been forced to sell their share of their business and homkes for a pittance before fleeing tails between their legs.
This whilst the same countries people have been made welcome here and benefited from oour weak regulations and will now gain beenfit from EEC rules.
Ria
Sorry only applies to overseas workers, do you qualify?? lol LizWell, with an Indian wife , born in Africa. Grandparents from Italy and Ireland I think I will quit my 60 hours per week job and live off the "British" tax payer ;O)
Brian (",)
Rich I do not understand how you can be so brazen as to know what knowledge I have of the outside world. Although I am retired I think I had a damn good job as a College lecturer and a fair knowledge of the EU states and their associated problems. As part of the EU, construction studies had to include alternative forms of construction of member states and their working conditions so we were quite up to date on that score. We also had exchange visits with other colleges within the EU where students would spend some time abroad studying the construction methods, rules and regulations of the country visited. Fair enough I am not up to date on all foreign legislation such as motoring laws, etc. but I think that I am competant enough to be able to discuss to a certain degree, every day working and living conditions in the majority of EU countries and know what I am talking about. In conclusion I think your personal attitude to my postings is one that has left a sour taste and up to this point this topic has been conducted in a somewhat friendly manner and now you have soured the whole theme of the topic.
Hi Liz referring to your posting of 100+ contributions with no friction I must apologise to you for spoiling the record but as you can see I get quite annoyed when someone tries to tell me, without even ever meeting me, what I know and don't know. I have more respect for people than to ever dream of doing such a thing. I respect their individual belief and would never dream of telling them in a manner which has been adresses to myself.
Hi Colin, No worries, I feel like a moderator here, watching the posts to make sure no personal attacks, don't want the record to be broken. Have no heard from Lord B or Frank for a long time, cannot stand the pace. Must admit I can hardly keep my eyes open, so up the wooden stairs I must go, now keep calm, deep breaths, p.s I forgot I have no wooden stairs, I live in a bungalow, it's old age creeping in, or I'm tired, I think the latter. Regards Liz
Colin... Your comment about ex-Soviet states taking over is just mind boggling. Reading about what economy they have and how it should be in those countries is one thing but being there and having family who live and work there is a bit more realistic. As they say those who can, do, and those that cant, teach. I wanted to go to University a good few years ago to do a motorsport engineering degree. I knew more than the lecturers and because I had actually been involved in motorsport at an international level as a competitor the stuff they were teaching was wrong. The theory was OK but the application was just farcical!I was lucky as I got a job where some poor guy who had just finished University was just so far out of his depth some ex coal miner turned racer had to teach him the reality of his job!
I suggest you actually go and see where the real citizens live in towns like Ogre in Latvia and let them know they are living the wrong way from what you have been told.
OK you may be older than me and taught students with the information you were given but the old Iron Curtain holds many secrets which was and still is a way of life. How people live in real life and what we are told is different. How many people do you know breed Rabbits to sell as food? Is that taught to students about Eastern Europe? I have been to most of Europe and the Americas and seen both sides of life. From cities to small towns and reality kicks in when you see the difference! I do find it hard to accept with some of the rundown areas even in America where towns lost industry and have almost become ghost towns. I don't see that being spoken about anywhere!
I suggest you actually go and see where the real citizens live in towns like Ogre in Latvia and let them know they are living the wrong way from what you have been told.
OK you may be older than me and taught students with the information you were given but the old Iron Curtain holds many secrets which was and still is a way of life. How people live in real life and what we are told is different. How many people do you know breed Rabbits to sell as food? Is that taught to students about Eastern Europe? I have been to most of Europe and the Americas and seen both sides of life. From cities to small towns and reality kicks in when you see the difference! I do find it hard to accept with some of the rundown areas even in America where towns lost industry and have almost become ghost towns. I don't see that being spoken about anywhere!
Rich, the U.K. has the third highest populaton density, that is people per square kilometre, in the whole of Europe. The Netherlands and Belgium are higher. Those countries have put on hold the admission of immigrants, like the rest of Western Europe except Ireland, Spain and Sweden. Where is the sense of destroying the infrastructure of this country by covering it in concrete to build more hospitals, roads, housing etc. and digging holes in greenbelt land to bury an even greater mountain of rubbish/waste. When it all comes crashing about our ears the Eastern Europeans will be off home but where does that leave us?
Don't get me wrong, I feel sorry for these people, but the problem wasn't of our making and charity begins at home. We have our own big time problems to sort out without trying to be the saviour of Eastern Europe. We tried to do that in 1939 when tens of thousands from this country died and where did it get us? This country as only just finished paying its Lend Lease debt to the U.S.A.
What did Germany pay? Nothing, simply because if they were made to pay reparations the Allies thought the same thing would happen as after signing the Treaty of Versaille in 1918 when Germany had to pay which fermented unrest and spawned the Nazi Party. In 1946 money was fed into Germany and Japan by countries like America. The money was probably ours in the first place from what we were paying the Yanks. Democracy came at a terrible price for this country and we are still suffering for it.
Don't get me wrong, I feel sorry for these people, but the problem wasn't of our making and charity begins at home. We have our own big time problems to sort out without trying to be the saviour of Eastern Europe. We tried to do that in 1939 when tens of thousands from this country died and where did it get us? This country as only just finished paying its Lend Lease debt to the U.S.A.
What did Germany pay? Nothing, simply because if they were made to pay reparations the Allies thought the same thing would happen as after signing the Treaty of Versaille in 1918 when Germany had to pay which fermented unrest and spawned the Nazi Party. In 1946 money was fed into Germany and Japan by countries like America. The money was probably ours in the first place from what we were paying the Yanks. Democracy came at a terrible price for this country and we are still suffering for it.
Well said L.BRich, the U.K. has the third highest populaton density, that is people per square kilometre, in the whole of Europe. The Netherlands and Belgium are higher. Those countries have put on hold the admission of immigrants, like the rest of Western Europe except Ireland, Spain and Sweden. Where is the sense of destroying the infrastructure of this country by covering it in concrete to build more hospitals, roads, housing etc. and digging holes in greenbelt land to bury an even greater mountain of rubbish/waste. When it all comes crashing about our ears the Eastern Europeans will be off home but where does that leave us?
Don't get me wrong, I feel sorry for these people, but the problem wasn't of our making and charity begins at home. We have our own big time problems to sort out without trying to be the saviour of Eastern Europe. We tried to do that in 1939 when tens of thousands from this country died and where did it get us? This country as only just finished paying its Lend Lease debt to the U.S.A.
What did Germany pay? Nothing, simply because if they were made to pay reparations the Allies thought the same thing would happen as after signing the Treaty of Versaille in 1918 when Germany had to pay which fermented unrest and spawned the Nazi Party. In 1946 money was fed into Germany and Japan by countries like America. The money was probably ours in the first place from what we were paying the Yanks. Democracy came at a terrible price for this country and we are still suffering for it.
I agree entirely.
LB... As I have said a few times... It is not whether migrant workers come here to make money for themselves or family. It is down to EU poliicy regarding workers.
Legal migrant workers have rights and every pound they make in any country does contribute to that country in the form of profit for their employer and taxes paid by the worker. There cannot be any argument about that.
We are part of the EU and unless we can change that then we are stuck. The UK ecomomy is probably stronger than most of Europe so we are the target for workers. Right or wrong that is a fact of life.
When we are told Eastern Europe will soon start to dictate EU Policy I cannot see how that will happen. They do not have the financial or political strength to even tie their own shoe laces. Worst of all that comes from a college lecturer who seems to know more about Eastern Europe than someone who has both close and extended family living there!
Am I an idiot?
Did I say we have to go out of our way for migrant workers?
Do I say I support Illegal immigrants?
Legal and Illegal are very different things and if policy changes to limit migrant workers..Fine because that is the way the law stands. I don't have to agree with how it works but I do have to abide by it! Is 1 million immigrants too many? I say YES. Illegal immigrants should not be here and we need to find a way of clearing some of that problem. But legal workers by definition are here legally and have rights.
But if you want an idea.. I suggest we look for illegal immigrants and start reporting them to the police. If you don't want attention we can do it by painting a sign on the door. Then the police know who to arrest and deport. Then we can send them all to a detention centre until we find where we can put them.....But please make sure the detention centre is all nice and clean with some really nice shower blocks........
Sorry for the bad taste in sarcasm but that is how public opinion will go if we have no way of pointing out what is and is not legal.
Legal migrant workers have rights and every pound they make in any country does contribute to that country in the form of profit for their employer and taxes paid by the worker. There cannot be any argument about that.
We are part of the EU and unless we can change that then we are stuck. The UK ecomomy is probably stronger than most of Europe so we are the target for workers. Right or wrong that is a fact of life.
When we are told Eastern Europe will soon start to dictate EU Policy I cannot see how that will happen. They do not have the financial or political strength to even tie their own shoe laces. Worst of all that comes from a college lecturer who seems to know more about Eastern Europe than someone who has both close and extended family living there!
Am I an idiot?
Did I say we have to go out of our way for migrant workers?
Do I say I support Illegal immigrants?
Legal and Illegal are very different things and if policy changes to limit migrant workers..Fine because that is the way the law stands. I don't have to agree with how it works but I do have to abide by it! Is 1 million immigrants too many? I say YES. Illegal immigrants should not be here and we need to find a way of clearing some of that problem. But legal workers by definition are here legally and have rights.
But if you want an idea.. I suggest we look for illegal immigrants and start reporting them to the police. If you don't want attention we can do it by painting a sign on the door. Then the police know who to arrest and deport. Then we can send them all to a detention centre until we find where we can put them.....But please make sure the detention centre is all nice and clean with some really nice shower blocks........
Sorry for the bad taste in sarcasm but that is how public opinion will go if we have no way of pointing out what is and is not legal.
I find this thread interesting and it is interesting to see so many with the same view.I do not propose to make comment as such as it may be deleted.All I will say is that I am 57 and worked since the age of sixteen paying tax in large quantities.Now after being off work last year,I have now been forced to part company with my employer and now spend my time caring for my wife who has cancer.I get
The plotter. I am really sorry about your situation,and i really
do hope things do get better.
You have every right to be angry, but you should be angry at
the government, they set the amounts you can claim, and it has
nothing what so ever to do with immagrants/dole claims ect.
Do you thing the government would give more money out to people
forced to stop working, if they had no other payments to make?
No not at all.
lordB.
"lost the plot" really? i believe its people like you who have
lost the plot.
The majority of overseas workers work foe natives! think about
it.
Who gets rich off these sorts of "underpaid workers"?
So whos fault is it then?
All you do is attack those that cannot defend themself, why
are you not slatting of the supermarkets who force prices down
so employers have to use cheaper and cheaper work forces.
Ditto All the big fatcats in this country, there the ones you
should be complaining about, the greedy, not the needy!
do hope things do get better.
You have every right to be angry, but you should be angry at
the government, they set the amounts you can claim, and it has
nothing what so ever to do with immagrants/dole claims ect.
Do you thing the government would give more money out to people
forced to stop working, if they had no other payments to make?
No not at all.
lordB.
"lost the plot" really? i believe its people like you who have
lost the plot.
The majority of overseas workers work foe natives! think about
it.
Who gets rich off these sorts of "underpaid workers"?
So whos fault is it then?
All you do is attack those that cannot defend themself, why
are you not slatting of the supermarkets who force prices down
so employers have to use cheaper and cheaper work forces.
Ditto All the big fatcats in this country, there the ones you
should be complaining about, the greedy, not the needy!
Sighhhhhhhh!
gio, read my posts carefully, then pick holes in them. Until then I have no intention of explaining them to you because they are self explanitory. Please don't read into my posts want you want to see. The only point I will make once more that I have made above more than once and that is this.....I have typed it in uppercase incase you miss it.
I DO NOT BLAME THE IMMIGRANTS. I AM NOT ATTACKING THE IMMIGRANTS. I BLAME THE GOVERNMENT FOR MAKING IT OPEN HOUSE/FREE FOR ALL.
Is that clear enough gio. Please keep reading it until it sinks in.
gio, read my posts carefully, then pick holes in them. Until then I have no intention of explaining them to you because they are self explanitory. Please don't read into my posts want you want to see. The only point I will make once more that I have made above more than once and that is this.....I have typed it in uppercase incase you miss it.
I DO NOT BLAME THE IMMIGRANTS. I AM NOT ATTACKING THE IMMIGRANTS. I BLAME THE GOVERNMENT FOR MAKING IT OPEN HOUSE/FREE FOR ALL.
Is that clear enough gio. Please keep reading it until it sinks in.
I agree with that 100% emmerson, such a good discussion going on, I had my two pence worth last night, so sitting back and looking in tonight, don't let the mods get involved.
Liz
Liz
Frank... You seem to be the only one who gets the situation. EU policy is trying to build a single market comunity. Now whether they are getting it right or not depends on the point of veiw depending on which side of the border you sit. I have no opinion on EU policy as the sudden growth of the community is taking it in a direction which will need looking at and the laws and policies will need tuning if it is going to keep every member state happy. But as they say you can keep all of the people happy some of the time and some of the people all of the time but not all of the people all of the time.
EU laws are enforceable in each member state so we have to abide by them in the same way as we have to abide by UK laws. I do not condone illegal acts either by foreign or UK citizens. There have to be changes to make some form of regulation possible but it has to be made a legally binding policy either here or EU wide.
EU laws are enforceable in each member state so we have to abide by them in the same way as we have to abide by UK laws. I do not condone illegal acts either by foreign or UK citizens. There have to be changes to make some form of regulation possible but it has to be made a legally binding policy either here or EU wide.
I dont think they are rich not all of them anyway like the one that states that a eu member country has to accept refugees at the point of entry but as a little island at the top end of a very big europe it would be a unlikely landing point for immigrants but we get them after they have travelled though 3 or 4 countrys to get here
Hi Frank, The Latvian that has now finished, have you sent him to Wales to see Colin(bridgend) just a thought, unless you have sent him down here but he will have shock if he wants
Some posts (and replies to them which didn't make sense without the original post) have been removed as they contained insulting comments.
Mr Mod 1, I object to my post being deleted. It was not insulting, it stated fact. This thread was a very interesting and adult discussion until xxxxx it went downhill. That is not insulting, it is factual. As you will also have noted, others agreed with me.
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