Wild-camping dos and don'ts?

[TonyJones]

It's been a bit quiet on here lately so I thought I'd float a question that pops up from time to time on other forums: "wild-camping," or using our motorhomes "off-site."
Now this can easily slide into a slanging-match between those who "do" and those who "don't," each trying to show the other the error of their ways. Because of course, there are advantages to both, in different situations and according to preference and temperament.
So let's jump over that argument, and start by accepting as a fact that there are those of us who sometimes stay off-site, and that modern motorhomes are designed to make that possible - even easy. But there are plenty of people outside the motorhoming community (and a few within it) who regard all off-site camping as freeloading, by a bunch of selfish cheapskates who refuse to pay their way.
Can we convince at least SOME of them that we're not like that, by the way we choose our locations and how we act while we're there?
Which brings me to the question for this thread: What do you think are the important "does & don'ts" of off-site camping? What practices strengthen (or weaken) our reputation in the "host community," and what would help (or hinder) those who try to get more acceptance for our hobby? I don't suppose we'll get to the point where the authorities let us sleep by the road when the Tour de France comes to Yorkshire, but we might be able to improve things a bit!
A couple of suggestions to get you started:
1. If there's some "authorised" free or cheap stopover nearby (Aires or France Passion etc if abroad, in the UK Britstops, free Truckstops, or of course our own Nightstops), USE IT, rather than spreading motorhomes randomly around the area.
2. If not, choose a place where you won't cause inconvenience to others (in particular, don't "steal" that sea view that someone has paid good money for!).
I can probably think of a few more, but let's hear yours.

 

[BernieC]

Tony, I'm with you all the way so far. I have wild camped often in the past but also use sites on a regular basis. Could I please therefore add the following to your list.

• If you can locate the land owner, always attempt to seeek permission.
• Leave the site as you found it or tidier.
• Keep the noise level down, sound travels further over open ground and can disturb wildlife as well as people.
• Protect vegetation by not staying too long in one spot.
• Avoid lighting fires. Apart from the obvious spread through peaty soil and dry undergrowth. Also fallen branches often used as fuel for fires is a haven for bugs and wildlife.
• Be careful not to contaminate water courses you may be camping near.
• Use local pubs, shops, and other facilities for provisions.

 

[Retread]

I'm sure theres a UK version somewhere!

 

[DonnaG]

I think a major part of it is - don't outstay your welcome...just stay for a night, perhaps a couple if it's not going to disturb the locals. I know of at least one very popular place in SE Spain, not far from where we wintered... it's now been fenced off, at least in part due to the 70 or so vehicles (of all nationalities) that spent the whole winter parked there, blocking access to the beach for everyone else... abuse it... lose it. We are all ambassadors for the motorhoming community.

 

[gjh]

The nearest we get to off site camping is to use THS/Meet sites which, I suppose, are equivalent to Truckstops & Nightstops i.e. somewhere legal.
Reading/researching over the years the major problems seems to arise when people stop (especially congregate and/or "steal the sea view") where it is not legal.
As people we know who full time have shown us many times, there are thousands of places in the UK where it is legal to stay overnight off site so no need for anyone to do otherwise.
So, I suppose what I think is important is "do it legally".
Incidentally, Tony, I understand there will be at least one temporary site next year where people will be able to sleep by the road when the Tour de France comes to Yorkshire but arrangements are still being made so I don't yet know what they are

 

[maggyd.]

Im not against wild camping for an overnight stop

but have never been able to find one without going right out of the way and spending time looking, which my O.H would never agree to as he tends to panic about finding somewhere and heading to a site or aire if abroad. We were looking for somewhere on our way home from Wales last week, every car park had signs saying No Overnighting or hight barriers. Are we doing it wrong?? We ended up at the Wirrel CC site and only allowed 1 nt there.

 

[TonyJones]

No, you're not "doing it wrong" Maggie - just in the wrong country!
However, even here there are SOME enlightened councils, and of course there are PMH Nightstops, Britstops (like Fance Passion but British) and some of the Highways Agency's list of Truckstops are free of charge (the others are dearer than campsites, as they're aiming for the commercial lorry market). http://highways.headland.co.uk/truckstops.asp
By the way, I've "upgraded" you - no, not like a Cyberman, just that you won't need to copy those funny letters anymore.

 

[maggyd.]

Thanks tony

I wondered about the new security Ive never seen it before!!
I just wish we didnt have such a long drive to folkstone we would be on the road much more than we manage here, we spent more in one week travelling through Chester and Wales than two weeks in France.

 

[gjh]

As well as the PMH Nightstops there are around 4000 CLs/CSs in the UK plus all the THSs/Meets run by various organisations. OK you have to be a member but it works out at just over 2 quid a week even if you join all three of the major clubs which promote legal (i.e. not unlicensed) sites.
The number of councils which make provision for motorhome parking in the daytime is increasing (and some also allow overnighting in car parks). It's a slow process but it is increasing. It isn't a lack of enlightenment though, it is a lack of real demand. Where people have taken the trouble to build a case and present it to a council, success has followed. As the Fylde pilot report says "Motorhome users had been petitioning the Council for many years to provide space on its car parks to enable overnight stays.".
The fact is, though, that for all we read of people who say they want aires on the various forums, very few of them are willing to actually build a case and present it to a council.
When I first started http://www.motorhomeparking.co.uk/ only a few councils published motorhome parking information on their web sites. When I checked last month that number had increased to about 90 (around 25%). I've since written to all the others and many have agreed to publish information at source. As a by-product it has raised awareness and some are starting to think more about provision, even if just during the daytime at present. Current restrictions on car park usage have (in the vast majority of
cases if not all) been put there for sound reasons. Circumstances may
have changed but unless somebody makes the case how are councils to
know?
Graham

 

[sambukashot]

Here is a great blog about wilding: http://www.tmcto.org/index.php/blogs/item/wilding

 

[gjh]

As I said previously - "So, I suppose what I think is important is "do it legally"."
As the Cornwall County Council web page states, "Overnight sleeping has always been banned in
Council car parks". It is purely because some people decided that they were above the law and insisted on ignoring the ban that complaints from residents and town
and parish councils arose - and led to the complete ban on parking.
Had those people made constructive approaches to the council (as with Fylde and Torridge for example) then perhaps some sort of compromise might have been reached.
As it is, all that has happened is that a ban has been imposed on the car parks. There is no ban on anyone applying for a caravan site licence in order to open an aire with basic facilities, so why does that not happen? Could it be, perhaps, that nobody has shown any entrepreneur any evidence that the investment would be worthwhile?

 

[gjh]

As part of revising the Motorhome Parking web site I have contacted
the various national tourist site organisations regarding publication of
motorhome parking information.

I have just had a reply from
Forestry Commission Scotland which, as well as providing information
about daytime parking at their locations, included a link -
http://www.campa.org.uk/downloads/Guidlines.pdf - to Guidance for Camping
Wild in Campervans and Motorhomes in Scotland.

It strikes me that the guidance is eminently sensible and can be easily applied elsewhere, not just in Scotland.

Graham

 

[Steve928]

I can't say that I agree with the statement "do not park overnight within sight of people's houses".
That would rule-out, for no good reason that I can see, a large proprtion of the wild camping spots that we've used, some well over half a mile away from houses but still "within sight".

 

[gjh]

I can't say that I agree with the statement "do not park overnight within sight of people's houses".
That would rule-out, for no good reason that I can see, a large proprtion of the wild camping spots that we've used, some well over half a mile away from houses but still "within sight".

Many of the complaints about "wild" camping which are publicised concern motorhomes spoiling the view of home owners. That might not be a good reason from the point of view of the motorhomer but it obviously is from the point of view of the home owner - and home owners are council tax payers and electors in the area concerned so may well have their views taken more seriously than the motorhomer's counter arguments.

 

[DonnaG]

I can't say that I agree with the statement "do not park overnight within sight of people's houses".
That would rule-out, for no good reason that I can see, a large proprtion of the wild camping spots that we've used, some well over half a mile away from houses but still "within sight".

Many of the complaints about "wild" camping which are publicised concern motorhomes spoiling the view of home owners. That might not be a good reason from the point of view of the motorhomer but it obviously is from the point of view of the home owner - and home owners are council tax payers and electors in the area concerned so may well have their views taken more seriously than the motorhomer's counter arguments.

I suppose, as with so many things, it's a case of using your common sense. As Steve said, half a mile away would maybe be considered ok, right in front of someone's house would not

 

[gjh]

I suppose, as with so many things, it's a case of using your common sense. As Steve said, half a mile away would maybe be considered ok, right in front of someone's house would not

But, to play the Devil's advocate, is that the common sense not to camp anywhere in line of site and risk spoiling somebody's view?

 

[DonnaG]

I suppose, as with so many things, it's a case of using your common sense. As Steve said, half a mile away would maybe be considered ok, right in front of someone's house would not

But, to play the Devil's advocate, is that the common sense not to camp anywhere in line of site and risk spoiling somebody's view?

Yes, I see where you're coming from in this, but that's where the common sense comes in. You might still be within their line of sight but in a direction where you're not spoiling a view! Unless you take into account the fact that some people don't like to see motorhomes anywhere within sight :/ We stayed on a CS recently where the neighbour had stopped their storage facility, even though the stored vans were behind a fence which was only visible from one bedroom window, and only at an angle a that...

 

[Steve928]

I can't say that I agree with the statement "do not park overnight within sight of people's houses".
That would rule-out, for no good reason that I can see, a large proprtion of the wild camping spots that we've used, some well over half a mile away from houses but still "within sight".

Many of the complaints about "wild" camping which are publicised concern motorhomes spoiling the view of home owners. That might not be a good reason from the point of view of the motorhomer but it obviously is from the point of view of the home owner - and home owners are council tax payers and electors in the area concerned so may well have their views taken more seriously than the motorhomer's counter arguments.

With respect 'within sight' is very different to 'spoiling the view'.

No,
I wouldn't park-up directly in front of someone's bay window and
between them and the beach, I'm very conscious of not intruding on
others' privacy, but 'within sight' suggests that we shouldn't park/camp
anywhere where a house can be seen from our motorhomes and I think that's OTT.

Can pictures be posted on this
forum? If so I'll put up some of a couple of spots we've stayed in
'within sight' of houses but very remote and not troubling anyone.

 

[gjh]

Steve & Donna, I do see the points you make and I'm perfectly happy to accept that you would always try to camp where you caused nobody any nuisance.
As we all know, though, not everyone - motorhomer or householder - is as considerate/tolerant. Also, less experienced people may not appreciate potential problems. The guidelines are there for everyone, experienced and inexperienced.

 

[DonnaG]

Steve & Donna, I do see the points you make and I'm perfectly happy to accept that you would always try to camp where you caused nobody any nuisance.
As we all know, though, not everyone - motorhomer or householder - is as considerate/tolerant. Also, less experienced people may not appreciate potential problems. The guidelines are there for everyone, experienced and inexperienced.

Yes, that's true

 

[sambukashot]

We have published a "motorhome code of conduct" please view it here: http://www.tmcto.org/index.php/motorhomers-code-of-conduct

 

[katetaylor1]

What are your views on overnight camping on Aberystwyth's prom? Ceredigion council is set to debate possible parking restrictions in May.
Also, our 'Diamond Dave' Newell will be giving a talk about going off-grid at The National Motorhome Show this weekend at Peterborough Arena. Dave will be on stand 19 and can offer gas checks, refillable gas systems, batteries and so on. His talk will be on Saturday.

 

[gjh]

Somebody else saying "The council should consider the Aires European system" but won't lift a finger or get off his backside to try to make it happen.
Add that to that fact that vans are on the pavement and using levelling ramps and it's no wonder that we, as a whole, gain a bad reputation. It makes achieving extra facilities even more of an uphill struggle.
Graham

 

[sambukashot]

Re, Abersytwth we are seeing the same thing happing all over the UK and it is giving motorhome users a bad name. A good start would be to get all motorhome users familier with the "Motorhome Code of Conduct" Dealers could issue this document with all sold vechicles and magazines could publish it.
What do you think?
Have a read of the document (which is work in progress) and leave your comments under the document. Thank you
Document here: http://www.tmcto.org/index.php/motorhomers-code-of-conduct

 

[Retread]

The FFCC has a code for camping caristes, might be useful to crib a few ideas! Mind you even with great facilities over here, there are still totally selfish people who empty their toilets into the gray water grid leaving a vile mess as I found the other day, makes me ashamed to be associated with people like that.