Fuel up again !!

[Steve L]

With fuel prices going over a pound a litre, where has the "British bull dog" fighting spirit gone.

Why are we putting up with the price hikes?

Are we all beaten and defeated?

Unless of coarse we are all owners of sign making firms. With the pirces going up so fast the only reason there isn't more, is that most garages had to stop at 99.9p as their pumps and signs could go no further.

Only 30 years ago when I first started driving, petrol was at 8p a litre. I could run my moped for £1.50 a week.

Why have we all sat back and let the oil companies and the chancellor walk all over us ????????????????

I've said this neumerous times before , but what affect do you think a 1 hour stoppage by all vehicles would have on the nation.

Answer, "world wide news coverage" and shame on the powers that be.

We would not need violence, or blockades, just a peaceful hour to point out that we all have had enough of being taxed to extinction.

So bring it on, have a growl and snarl, state your ponit and maybe if we all stick together then a voice will be heard.

By the way Im not your "red robbo" nor do I belong to the "monster raving looney" party, I'm just your average Jo who is fed up with being taxed, taxed and taxed again.

SWL

 

[LadyMaureen]

Steve,

We're just getting ready for a trip to the north of Scotland.Goodness knows what the prices will be there.I will be keeping a note and will post when we get back.

If we were all French,we would have had the ports all blocked by now !!

 

[emmerson2]

Steve, I advocated just such an action in the last lorry drivers strike way back in the early eighties.In my opinion,that strike was unneccesary, as just by stopping all lorries at the same time, wherever they were, for one hour would have brought the country to a complete standstill for hours,possibly even days.Sadly, I couldn't get enough support then.It might work now though, if ALL drivers of whatever vehicle could be made to co-operate! Picture the scene---------every road in the country jammed for an hour! Perhaps then A B Liar would take notice.BTW, like you Steve, I'm not normally militant either, but eough is enough.In today's Telegraph, there's mention of a proposal which would increase couincil tax by FORTY %.Time for that revolution, I think.

 

[RogerL]

Protesting would be pointless. The price of fuel in the UK is higher than elsewhere because of the tax structure. If fuel duty was reduced, income tax would have to go up by the same amount, leaving us no better off.

Fuel prices are a "Catch-22". They won't come down until the world price of oil drops - but that won't drop until we use less oil.

Apparently, market research has shown that UK consumers won't significantly reduce consumption until the price hits

 

[Guest]

The price of fuel has risen as a direct result of oil prices rising, they are now above $75 per barrel and a $100 barrel has been mooted. However, the rises are not due to shortages but panic buying by speculators. The American summer is arriving and demand there always shoots up, this in addition to the shouting match over Iran and the unrest in Nigeria makes speculators think that a fast buck can be made. If you read Lord Brownes comments regarding BP's position, he expects the price to drop back once reason prevails to possibly $40 per barrel.

Here Mr G Brown is not going to say a word because he benefits from the rise in price through his North Sea taxes, this almost singly has allowed him to claim his Budget figures match up, when in reality he would have been hopelessly in debt without it. One can reasonably assume that his proposed tax rise on fuel duty in September will be postpones, at least until the pumps can read 4 digits. He doesn't need it as the job has been done for him, and he can claim innocence.

 

[colin(bridgend)]

RogerL it would appear to me from this and preious postings that you support the present government regarding their futile policies. If you were to look at the profits the oil companies are making it is scandelous. They say the profit is not at the pump but in the process leading up to the retailing of the fuel. They should be made to drop their prices. Regarding your previous postings where pension companies invest in these greedy profiteering companies I do not think it will make much difference. The pension companies spread their investments and there are other companies where they can invest. Tesco for example have released figures showing a profit of

 

[mcghee]

In some ways I agree with Roger. Reducing the tax on fuel will create a deficit of millions which will have to come from somewhere else. Reducing payments to those with fake disabilities, etc may be one way, but I feel Roger's reasoning may be more accurate; increased income tax. Does the average working man really want to pay more tax to effectively subsidise the companies who would benefit from lower fuel costs? There are many faults with the taxation methods and rates in this country but as long as we continue to fund the undeserving and unwilling we'd better to just get used to it. That is to say that fuel tax affects us all and so tends to get more press and gather more momentum, but I don't think it's the biggest misappropriation of funding we face at present.

 

[RogerL]

Colin - I certainly DON'T support the policies of this government. High UK fuel duty compared to other countries has been a policy of both main parties.

If any tax is reduced, the decision has to be made whether to raise other taxes to maintain the overall level of taxation OR to reduce spending on some public service or other.

Where would the supporters of reduced fuel duty make their balancing adjustments? Cut spending on health, education, law & order or increase income tax?

I didn't invent the laws of economics, it would be better if a few more people understood their basics.

I do, however, support all those efforts being made to reduce energy consumption both globally and within the UK.

 

[Tom_5073611]

I don't have a problem with tax or fuel prices....why ?? Because I can afford it.

All too often this subject raises it's ugly head only to be met by the same response, but if you look at the problem it is simple, if you live within your means or cash for our pride and joy whether it's a motorhome,caravan 4x4 or whatever, which in most cases can be tens of thousands of pounds but stick 30p on a litre of fuel over the course of 5 years and lets all form a line and bring the country to it's knees.

Wake up and smell the coffee guy's,we are the instigators of our own problems.

 

[Steve L]

Steve,

We're just getting ready for a trip to the north of Scotland.Goodness knows what the prices will be there.I will be keeping a note and will post when we get back.

If we were all French,we would have had the ports all blocked by now !!

Hi Maureen. Two years ago petrol at Ullapool was

 

[Steve L]

Well I'm afraid I'm not likely to do the puppy dog for the government. That is lie down roll over and let them tickle my tummy and do what they like with me like Roger is doing !!

As for petrol going to

 

[Tom_5073611]

Nice comments Steve, as for me being loaded,I wish. If you read my post it was simply put ie:i live within my means .

I don't know your age but with cast your mind back to the coal miners strike Scargill versus Thatcher, what did they acheive.....nothing , in fact most of them lost their jobs. The basic problem with fuel prices stems from the cost per barrel ( which was mentioned in an earlier post)

Your attitude acheives nothing.

I think that you should sit down and reflect on how fortunate you really are when thousands of men and some women at the Peugeot factory are facing a jobless future, that for me puts it all into perspective!

 

[Steve L]

Actually Tom, I've been in the Peugeot situation a couple of times as the copy of a post on that details below.

steve in Leo

1 May 2006 07:56 AM HI Dave.

Sorry to hear of your impending redundancey. It is a time of difficult choices.

I have been there firstly ten years ago, as a small business employer who had to tell his 12 strong workforce that the firm was forced to close because a larger company had piled it's debts into the subsiduary we worked for and this was too much for us to cope with. Four years ago, the company I now work for told 160 workers that they would be made redundant and re-employed 18 miles away at their assembly plant on new contracts.

Fortunately I was clued up on employment law and advised them all to say they would take the company to tribunal for "constructive dismissal" which stopped the redundancey ploy but the move went on as planned. You see all of us would of had to apply for those new contracts, a crafty way of weeding out.

In the interim between the closeure of my engineering business ten years ago and starting in the CNC motor industry, I actually went out building chicken sheds for the battery hatcheries. A job I hated but it brought the money in even if it was lodging away for three weeks and home for one weekend. It nearly cost us our marriage and so I got the CNC job.

Even now, just last Febuary, I was again faced with redundancey as ourcompany was laying off 23 people from it's 230 strong work force. They asked for volenteers and as I've got a mortgage and kids I didn't take it. However I'm now thinking of selling the house and either doing a site warden job or going into rented accomodation as then I could take volentary redundancey in September as that is when they predict the next round will be.

Like Roger I've cut my cloth to suit ten years ago loosing the 40K job and the XJ40 and the house in the country, to go to nothing but a van load of furniature and start again. So living in my own caravan will still be better and I can choose the neighbours.

If you need any advise on employment law mail me at steveinleo@hotmail.com

All the best for the future and I hope things work out for you.

Regards.

Steve.

And as stated before it's always the working classes who suffer the most. The management at Peugeot will all get very hansome pay outs and be able to use their gloryfied CV's to get back to work, leaving the working man/woman to scrat for the leftovers.

If we all stood together for once (just an hour) it would show the powers that be, that we all don't like what is going on. I'll never forget our CNC dept when the company wanted to go from two 12hour shifts (4hours overtime per day) to triple shift (no overtime). I told the guys stick together and we'll get a rise to make up for lost earnings. What did they do, go it alone. What did they get 20p per hour instead of

 

[ProfJohnL]

The cost of fuel seems to be a hot topic at the moment, and I can remember when Shell was 3s/6d a gallon! I must state now that I am no way obliged to any company, thus my comments represent my own views.

As Roger L and others have pointed out; the cost of fuel is related to supply and demand. There are some that point an accusing at finger at the oil companies who seem to make vast profits, but simply looking at the actual profit by it's self does not give you a clear or fair picture.

The media are always looking for a story, and they have been known to make them up sometimes, but more frequently they will use statistics and other facts in isolation to sensationalise and stir up distrust through public ignorance.

"EXCLUSIVE! Acme profits rise by 100%" The public response is why can a company make such a big profit increase? Surely there must be some fat cats there using Joe Public to feather their own nests! This hides the fact that company turnover last year was 100M, with a profit of only 1M (1% profit on turnover) This year Turnover 120M and a profit of 2M

(0.6% on turnover) Yes 2M compared to 1M is a 100% increase, but profitability of only 1% and falling to 0.6% would be a bad sign and in reality would be a failing company.

The real Oil companies are very big organisations, and their turnover is measured in Billions of

 

[colin(bridgend)]

John what you posted regarding profits by the major companies is fair enough but there is a difference between a reasonable profit and the vast amounts being made at the expence of the consumer. As you state it is supply and demand and they know that Joe Public needs their commodities and therefore can call the tune. As I previously stated Tesco has virtually collared the retail grocery market and attempting the same in non grocery items such as clothes, electrical goods, etc. and end up with a

 

[Lord Braykewynde]

Just a small point regarding Tom's remark -

"I don't know your age but with cast your mind back to the coal miners strike Scargill versus Thatcher, what did they acheive.....nothing , in fact most of them lost their jobs".

To put things into perspective the miners weren't fighting for a wage increase, they were fighting to keep the mines open. At the end of the day they didn't lose their jobs because they went on strike. The Tories led by Thatcher, the evil government of the time, had every intention of closing the mines. Arthur Scargill warned of this but nobody would hear of it and he was villified by the Tories and their media as a Communist trouble maker. I ask you, who told the truth? Where are the mines now? Even the miners of the Democratic Mineworkers Union who carried on working still lost their jobs. Could this country do without coal? No, it was imported from Poland and other Eastern Bloc countries of the time where such things as a decent living wage and health and safety laws didn't apply. I rest my case :O)

 

[LMH]

Just a small point regarding Tom's remark -

"I don't know your age but with cast your mind back to the coal miners strike Scargill versus Thatcher, what did they acheive.....nothing , in fact most of them lost their jobs".

To put things into perspective the miners weren't fighting for a wage increase, they were fighting to keep the mines open. At the end of the day they didn't lose their jobs because they went on strike. The Tories led by Thatcher, the evil government of the time, had every intention of closing the mines. Arthur Scargill warned of this but nobody would hear of it and he was villified by the Tories and their media as a Communist trouble maker. I ask you, who told the truth? Where are the mines now? Even the miners of the Democratic Mineworkers Union who carried on working still lost their jobs. Could this country do without coal? No, it was imported from Poland and other Eastern Bloc countries of the time where such things as a decent living wage and health and safety laws didn't apply. I rest my case :O)

Here, here.

 

[colin(bridgend)]

Lord B the contents of your posting is a damn good lesson for us all to learn and take heed from. What happened in the 1980s was that we all sat back and let the government carry on and as you say we now import our coal. Surely from this lesson we should now act to prevent any similar occurrance. This is coming from a predominantlt Tory supporter.

 

[Andy_5062145]

With so many cars on the roads these days can you imagine how much worse the roads would be without the cost of fuel restricting some people driving? Its something else to think about. As for the monopoly of the big supermarkets, I only buy food etc from them. If I want a new electrical item I tend to find it is much cheaper to buy online. And the Thatcherite days, what I remember of that time is limited as I was in my early teens, but I do remember that my Father had an A4 folder about 2 inches thick with "Thanks but no thanks" job application replies. He was unemployed for about 8 years and was by no means unemployable. He is a hard worker, intelligent and never had a days absence in his life. That was our family's hardest ever times.

 

[colin(bridgend)]

Andy I will agree with you regarding food as the big boys have virtually wiped out the small corner store type of business. As far as electrical goods are concerned I tend to buy from a small local trader who is willing to match Comet/Curries on price and generally offers a far better service. Eighteen months ago my mother in law needed a new fridge freezer. Curries wanted the obvious

 

[Andy_5062145]

Colin, I do the same if they can match the price I also do not want to see these guys going out of business.

 

[Lord Braykewynde]

Thank you Colin, I agree. It's no good putting a post about the miners if not prepared to state the full facts, just incase there are people reading Toms post who were too young to remember the truth.

 

[David.O]

CanI add another angle to this . I hope to shortly travel to France for my annual getaway. one of the attractions is the cheaper fuel costs plus of course the wine etc. but on the other side I am expected to produce food and compete with the french and they with their fuel costs that much lower than ours. there has been talk of Tescos and thier profits, as a farmer the mention of that name makes me want to vomit. We are required to produce to a high standard to meet thier requirements then they bring in produce from all over the world that is produced by methods that I would be locked up if I were to use them.

Thats enough for my blood pressure tonight.

David from Suffolk

 

[colin(bridgend)]

I was walking through town the other day when I passed a well known company of green grocers - S****S - they had a fine array of fruit and vegetables on offer both outside and inside the shop. Out of curiousity I stopped to see how many home grown produce was on offer. The only one I saw was for used potatoes which were probably from last year as they were begining to sprout in the plastic bags. David what has happened to our home growers and the old way of eating in season? God only knows what chemicals are being used in the growing of these crops and what preservatives are being applied to the whilst "shipping" them into this country from all parts of the globe. When was the last time you tasted a nice fresh apple?

 

[Guest]

There will always be arguments regarding the value, or otherwise , of the Thatcher era. The problem is nobody can make any accurate statement about where we would be if she had not come to power. Prior to her arrival we were in hoc to the IMF up to our necks, power cuts were regular and nobody I ever met would admit to buying a British Leyland car., let alone a British TV set. Looking at the working practices then I suspect our industries would have still become defunct in a very short time indeed versus the new economies. What did happen was that we went through the 'pain' and were in a far better state to meet the competition when it arrived in the 80/90's. Yes, the coal mines closed and everybody adopted gas, which one should state has served us well for the last 30 years and is still being produced. The Poles, who happily supplied coal to us, are now complaining bitterly that their coal industry has been eradicated by newer markets and what do they do about it? Move to Britain in large numbers. What do the Brits do about the problems? Move abroad in large numbers, So in many ways we are adopting the global economy which Thatcher imposed on us, whether everybody really likes it, or not. What the Trade Unions hate most of course, is their loss of power and are desperate to get that back at any cost. If it does happen we will be even worse off, because the rest of the world has moved on, and if we don't follow suit, we fall.

I empathise with the comments regarding local businesses, and I too try to support them. The growth of 'farmers markets' is just one example. But a family of 4 is far more likely to shop at a large supermarket as it is obviously cheaper for them, and it is almost impossible to argue against that one. Local businesses that can find niche markets will survive, and the Internet has opened many doors for small one man businesses to make a success. I note from looking at many of the hobby type of magazines that many ex miners, or ex whatever, are making a successful living creating a small niche business and using the Internet as a market. You just have to look at the addresses given to realize these are not in industrial areas.

Nostalgia is a wonderful thing but that should not detract from the fact that the majority of people living in Britain have a far higher standard of living than previous generations. Yes, there are bad points of course, but do you really want to go back? If so, start by asking all the 2 car families to give one up.